From: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org (chakram-refugees-digest) To: chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Subject: chakram-refugees-digest V4 #98 Reply-To: chakram-refugees@smoe.org Sender: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk chakram-refugees-digest Thursday, April 8 2004 Volume 04 : Number 098 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [chakram-refugees] Destiny Question [cr ] Re: [chakram-refugees] Destiny Question [cr ] Re: [chakram-refugees] The upraised swords of season three [cr ] Re: [chakram-refugees] The upraised swords of season three [cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Destiny Question On Wed, 07 Apr 2004 01:06, Ribaud, Lynn wrote: > cr wrote: > > > > Maybe it just looked cool? ;) > > It's been a while since I read the script, but this explanation, as > I recall, is the best fit. Oh. That's kinda disconcerting. I'm not used to being right in a throwaway line. ;) cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 18:49:28 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Destiny Question On Wed, 07 Apr 2004 16:09, IfeRae@aol.com wrote: > > It was intriguing to me because though Niklios (sp?), an excellent, > > expert healer had declared Xena dead, she was not yet totally gone. But > > then of course, that's just Xena, able to leap tall ships in a single > > bound, stop speeding arrows with her teeth and make her own choice on > > whether mortal wounds will make her die or not. >. > > Yes, Niklio was right, in that she had, at that moment decided to die. No > doubt her body stopped functioning at the point, so he didn't know that she > changed her mind. That was interestingly foreshadowed in the 'ten winters ago' flashback, when Xena asked Nicklio "What did she [M'Lila] say?" "She said it's not your time to die" "Well, if not now, then _when_?" (with Lucy's inimitable delivery) cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 19:07:00 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] The upraised swords of season three On Tue, 06 Apr 2004 21:27, KTL wrote: > Anyway, I also watched a piece of the Furies and remembered that I noticed > while first running through much of the season when I first got the DVDs, > (gasping breath) that there is a repeated image in a number of eps. It's > that of a person standing over another prone person with an upraised sword > about to skewer them. Xena thus threatens Cyrene in The Furies, Meridian > threatens Krafstar in The Deliverer, Xena threatens Hope in Gabrielle's > Hope and Xena not only threatens but for the first time follows through in > skewering Gabrielle in Bitter Suite. I don't remember more. (Outside of a > fight scene, I mean.) It's certainly an arresting image. And I wonder if > it was deliberately being used as a signature image for this season or if > these four times were merely coincidences. How could you possibly not remember that incredibly photogenic shot in Return of Callisto where Callisto is poised to skewer Gabrielle, in silhoutte, with Xena approaching on Argo, all backlit in green and gold. That has to be one of the most photogenic images in the whole series, IMO. (http://cr.qc1.net/nx/bethellvly/roc21t.jpg) > Lucy and Renee of course both forgot that Xena skewered Gabrielle. Errrm, it was an illusion. But typically, Gabrielle wouldn't take that as an excuse ;) cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 19:15:01 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Destiny Question On Wed, 07 Apr 2004 05:33, KTL wrote: > As always, for Xena, things are just a little bit different than they are > for just plain folks. > > KT (Sigh). And after I've been arguing _so_ hard that Xena's looks aren't what make her special, it's her personality. Care to rephrase that? cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 19:23:32 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] The upraised swords of season three On Wed, 07 Apr 2004 16:09, IfeRae@aol.com wrote: > You may be right, that in S3 the overall feeling was more of the desire to > attack, sometimes in "out of their minds" situations. Certainly the raised > sword suggests impending death more than the horizontal one. Of course, that only worked if the prospective victim was unarmed. (I call to mind Athena's undoing in Motherhood when she was about to kill Xena and Xena got her from below. IIRC) I think tactically holding a sword like that was probably a bad move. Leaves you wide open and makes it hard to parry a thrust from below if the person on the ground is quick enough to get one in. (But I'm not a swordsman, I'm just guessing here). cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 00:11:53 -0800 (AKDT) From: KTL Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] The upraised swords of season three > How could you possibly not remember that incredibly photogenic shot in Return > of Callisto where Callisto is poised to skewer Gabrielle, in silhoutte, with > Xena approaching on Argo, all backlit in green and gold. That has to be > one of the most photogenic images in the whole series, IMO. > (http://cr.qc1.net/nx/bethellvly/roc21t.jpg) That was season two. I seldom watch season two. I was talking about this as an image repeated in season three. Whether it was intentionally used to mean something or was just a cool image that they enjoyed envisioning, staging and seeing onscreen. > > > Lucy and Renee of course both forgot that Xena skewered Gabrielle. > > Errrm, it was an illusion. > Yup. Just like everything else in the episode once they've screamed their way over the cliff. Hence the name of the place, "Illusia". Xena: "NONE of this is real." So all actions there are just as real as any other. KT > But typically, Gabrielle wouldn't take that as an excuse ;) > > cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 07 Apr 2004 08:49:54 -0500 From: "Mark B." Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] The upraised swords of season three cr wrote: > On Wed, 07 Apr 2004 16:09, IfeRae@aol.com wrote: > > I think tactically holding a sword like that was probably a bad move. > Leaves you wide open and makes it hard to parry a thrust from below if the > person on the ground is quick enough to get one in. I tend to think that Athena would back you up on this. Mark ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 16:23:23 -0400 (GMT-04:00) From: cande@sunlink.net Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Re: The Debt - -----Original Message----- From: KTL But I really do think that all these folks had parts in the rift, though Caesar's inclusion to me is the most tenuous. And I think Xena's forgive me song, especially the line about "Forgive me and you'll discover, too, That the love of your love is you", is a somewhat torturous way of saying, "When you forgive others and let go of the hatred inside, then you can love yourself again." KT Gabrielle: "Believe me. If I have to go the rest of my life without companionship, (lov)ing myself won't be a problem. You really believe that Xena was referring to Gabrielle loving herself! Hmm I have a more subtexty explanation, naturally. CherylA ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 16:30:36 -0400 (GMT-04:00) From: cande@sunlink.net Subject: Fw: Re: [chakram-refugees] Re: The Debt - -----Forwarded Message----- From: cande@sunlink.net Sent: Apr 7, 2004 4:28 PM To: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Re: The Debt - -----Original Message----- From: cr > > I don't think the appearance of Callisto, Ares, and et al had anything to > do with people who Xena hated. These are the people who let hate rule > them. What I saw the point being was that if she and Gabrielle didn't > overcome they will become like Callisto, Caesar, Ares - they will be people > who will be destroyed by theit hatred. > > CherylA Hmm, that's an interesting viewpoint, they could serve as hideous examples to be avoided. But they looked more like Xena's personal demons, rather than just relatively impersonal 'examples'. At least to me, in that scene. cr Well I don't see them as impersonal at all. I think these are people who are very connecte to hatred. Callisto is rather an obvious example of where hate leads one. Kraftstar and Caesar I believe are people who do hate - no one slaughters people or worships an evil god without a deep seated hate and contempt for humanity. Ares probably doesn't hate per se but he feeds off it. War is afterall the ulimate expression of hate. CherylA ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ End of chakram-refugees-digest V4 #98 *************************************