From: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org (chakram-refugees-digest) To: chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Subject: chakram-refugees-digest V3 #276 Reply-To: chakram-refugees@smoe.org Sender: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk chakram-refugees-digest Thursday, September 18 2003 Volume 03 : Number 276 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll [IfeRae@aol.com] Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll [Cousin Liz ] Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll [cr ] Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll [] Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll [Meredith Tarr ] Fwd: Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll [cjlnh@webtv.net (Cheryl LaScola)] [chakram-refugees] TV GUide on Tarzan [KLOSSNER9@aol.com] [chakram-refugees] [OT] Warrior Queen [KLOSSNER9@aol.com] Re: [chakram-refugees] TV GUide on Tarzan [Meredith Tarr ] [chakram-refugees] new Xena chapter in book [KLOSSNER9@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 00:35:57 EDT From: IfeRae@aol.com Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll In a message dated 9/16/2003 9:10:31 PM Central Daylight Time, cjlnh@webtv.net writes: > I don't know when this poll is supposed to end on Tarzan, but I > am determined now to go back to the site and click on YES for LUCY as > many times as my tired fingers will allow Oooo, thanks for the reminder. It's now about 11:30 CST and supposedly 19.313 have voted -- nearly 500 more than my last visit about 3 hours ago. The "No" vote went up a percentage point, while the "yes" vote stayed at 68%. I never followed one of these polls before, but it does look mighty fishy. - -- Ife ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 01:00:42 -0400 From: Cousin Liz Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll IfeRae@aol.com wrote: > The "No" vote went up a percentage point, while the "yes" vote > stayed at 68%. I never followed one of these polls before, but > it does look mighty fishy. This is a poll being conducted on a fan site (not the official site for the show) being run by someone from Great Britian according to the records. I really doubt the results of this poll will matter at all to Lucy or TPTB. And in all honesty, it's not the kind of poll I'm worrying about at all, or even bothering to spend any time in visiting. I'll let Lucy's appearance in this new show speak for itself. :) - -- Cousin Liz eas01@fast.net Soulmates Xena Dinosaur Bards http://cousinliz.com ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 20:41:14 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll On Wednesday 17 September 2003 14:10, Cheryl LaScola wrote: > All I can say to KT's informative post is, > WOW... I had no idea all this animosity was going on!! Gabfundies or > not, how sad a commentary that supposed "fans" would have to be sooo > small as to stuff the ballot box to tear Lucy down. > > I am only on this list so not in tune with the bigger picture I guess. > I couldn't figure out how /why the count against Lucy joining the cast > of Tarzan was so high and growing. I suppose I should be happy it is > just a small nucleus of disgruntled ex-XWPfans. As you all know, IANAG (I Am Not A Gabfan ;). Ironically enough, most of the XWPfans I know personally *are* Gabfans. Which is why I feel impelled to point out (and I'm sure KT will agree with me) that 99% of Gabfans - the vast majority of them - are *not* Gabfundies out to 'get' Lucy. They're thoroughly nice people who just happen to see something in Gabs that I can't, but mostly they either like Lucy too or at least accept her the same way most of us Xenafans accept ROC. There are just a very few who suffer from the paranoia that "ROC would be the star of the show if Lucy wasn't married to the producer" yadda yadda. But KT's right, those deluded characters do exist, and some of them are very noisy about it. Still, I'd be surprised if those few are so bitter and twisted as to try and wreck Lucy's vote - except that I can't think of any other more likely explanation. Misogynistic Tarzan-fanatic guys who don't want an ex-'Warrior woman' on the show? Nah, hardly seems likely. cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 13:24:47 +0300 From: Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll Cousin Liz" "I'll let Lucy's appearance in this new show speak for itself. :)" Yes I think it's the right think to do. Either some people like iy or not Lucy WILL play on Tarzan and she is going to give the answers with her special way! No polls can prove anything. Sophia ========================================================= > This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. > To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with > "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. > Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. > ========================================================= ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 07:11:27 -0700 (PDT) From: Meredith Tarr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll Thanks, cr, for standing up for Gabfans everywhere. :) I'm sure that took quite a lot of intestinal fortitude. ;) As a Gabfan, I was shocked and appalled to read KT's account of the sick weirdos that are out there. Granted, I'm quite insulated when it comes to the Xenaverse these days -- this list and Xena Night at Meow Mix are about the extent of it. It's disheartening to know that some people are willing to take time out of their short lives to spread such negativity everywhere. But I guess if people are willing to not only watch a show that they loathe but join fan groups just so they can spew vitriol about their hatred of the show there, anything is possible. (We all know this happened in the Xenaverse ... and I saw it happening in Buffy fandom as well. Amazing.) Personally, I'm very much looking forward to seeing Lucy in a new role (though honestly, from the description in the press releases doesn't it sound like she's going to be playing Dar Roberts? ;). I'm not all that excited about a Tarzan tv show (sorry, but I've never understood the appeal of that story in general), and I have some reservations as to the wisdom of Lucy taking on another genre role, but maybe we'll all get lucky and _Tarzan_ will be the next _Smallville_. My only issue is that it appears that _Tarzan_ is going to conflict with _Alias_. *HUGE* problem. (Not to mention a ratings problem as well -- it's just stupid to schedule genre shows against one another.) Good thing I didn't get rid of my VCR when I got my TiVo. Meredith meth@smoe.org __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 14:04:07 -0400 (GMT-04:00) From: cande@sunlink.net Subject: [chakram-refugees] Re: Tarzan Poll - ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 09:03:19 -0800 (AKDT) From: KTL Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll "Well sadly, the anti-Lucy bias is most virulently alive among the rabid Gabrielle/Renee fans. These guys got themselves a special name on the Xenaverse list and an entry in the Xenaica. They are known as Gabfundies. And the mark of the Gabfundie is to worship Gabrielle and Renee and to hate Xena, Rob and very often Lucy." Well I figured the anti-Lucy votes came from disaffected Xena fans. Xena fans would welcome her and those who didn't know her would just wait and see. I know that there are a contigent of "fans" who hate Lucy. "It comes from jealousy over Lucy's much higher profile and anger that Renee gets "overlooked". For years, while the show was on the air, there was a conspiracy theory that Lucy forced Rob to keep Renee from doing talk shows and interviews ...." Yes I remember those people and I guess they are still around. I wonder how they reacted to ROC referring to Rob as "her champion" in the DVDs. They are obviously so busy defending Renee that the never noticed she doesn't want or need their help. "Sure some fans dislike Gabrielle. But I have NEVER seen that extrapolated to hating Renee. Most XWP fans I know respect Renee for her hard work and for her own lack of ego that made her such a great co-star both on the show and in real life. In the season two commentaries, she repeats again something about how much easier it was for her on the show since Lucy was the one who bore the burden of being the star, receiving the bulk of the attention and having to be aware every moment of everything she said. And that Renee was happy it was that way." It is odd that ROC has this faction of her fans who are so fanatical in their devotion. I'm sure she is not pleased that there people who hate people that she seems to genuinely like and respect. She must find their attitude not only mysterious but I'm sure on some level frigthening. Imagine if you had a friend that someone you didn't know was convinced was out to harm you and therefore actually wished your friend harm. I'm sure it must baffle ROC. ROC seems to be content to march to her own drumer and seems to be doing what she enjoys. I don't think she ever was that concerned with trappings of stardom or it's demands. She always seemed very happy that Luct did the interviewing and publicity while she was off climbing mountains. "Also, why would Tarzan fans hate Lucy?" Actually there are no Tarzan fans yet unless they are Johnny Weismiller fans. There is no reason for anyone to hate Lucy unless you have some other agenda. At worse you would be in the undecided camp. However perhaps the actress that got replaced has a really big family and they are trying to their girl's job back (g). CherylA ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 20:07:10 +0100 From: "A. Reddecliffe" Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] xena poll at tarzantheseries.com Seems > > some Tazan fans are increasingly anti-Lucy. Since I started tracking the > > poll, the "NOT HAPPY at all Lucy is in the series" count has gone from > > 500 to almost 850!! Possible reasons for this: a) Tarzan fans (of books/films/comics/mythos etc) don't want the traditional story ruined with extra characters that don't belong in the tarzanverse. b) Tarzan fans who don't want Xena on their show c) Tarzan fans who like the Tarzan/ Jane elements and don't want to risk any subtext on the show. d) Gay men who want a show about half dressed guys in the jungle and don't want any women in the show. e) See below. f) See below that I certainly hope folks are wrong in > thinking it's XWP fans who don't like Lucy or are using the poll to express > their dislike of AFIN or something else about XWP. Some people really liked AFIN. I just can't imagine that many > who know nothing about Lucy who would have such a strong negative opinion > about her being on the show. e) Or those who do know something and don't like XWP/Xena/Lucy/Gabrielle/ROC etc- people who are not fans and never liked anything about the show anyway. Of course there's also the slight possibility that > there are those who *do* like Lucy and think Tarzan isn't the right vehicle > for her. f) Must be that one. Obviously wanting her to do another Broadway musical. I know a lot of Gabfans, including me, and the reaction is the range from "Good luck to her, hope it works out well", to indifference. Ann ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 19:21:32 -0400 From: "Cheryl Ande" Subject: [chakram-refugees] Najara mention I just got the TV Guide for the week of 9/20 and there was blurb about Kathryn Morris which mentions her Xena role. "The thirtysomething actress, perhaps best known as Tom Cruise's estranged wife in Minority Report" and sexy villain Najara on Xena: Warrior Princess..." Now why are all female villains referred to as sexy? Najara wasn't particularly sexy in my opinion. She was psychotic, manipulative and fanatical but not sexy. I don't know it just seemed lazy on the writer's part like he couldn't even bother to ask the actress about the role, he just went for the pat description. CherylA ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 20:12:45 -0400 (EDT) From: cjlnh@webtv.net (Cheryl LaScola) Subject: Fwd: Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll Just to set the record straight from my side, I not only accepted Lucy/Xena ROC/Gabrielle in their roles, I loved both characters and felt the show was greater than the sum of it's parts due to the diverse and tremendous talents of both LL & ROC. So to coin Sophia..... whocares how the poll turns out, Lucy is in the show and will answer the naysayers by making the character her own on her terms. Cheryl J PS Whether going against ALIAS is Tarzan's downfall or not, I am hoping the primetime exposure LL will get in the first set of episodes will catapult her into future roles / movies, etc.. Received: from smtpin-3103.bay.webtv.net (209.240.204.213) by storefull-2334.public.lawson.webtv.net with WTV-SMTP; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 02:00:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smoe.org (jane.smoe.org [199.201.145.78]) by smtpin-3103.bay.webtv.net (WebTV_Postfix+sws) with ESMTP id 55430FE0C for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 02:00:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smoe.org (ident-user@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smoe.org (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h8H8xwcp012871 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 04:59:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from majordom@localhost) by smoe.org (8.12.9/8.12.9/Submit) id h8H8xw6G012870 for chakram-refugees-outgoing; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 04:59:58 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dbmail-mx1.orcon.co.nz (loadbalancer-VIP.orcon.net.nz [219.88.242.2]) by smoe.org (8.12.9/8.12.9) with ESMTP id h8H8xncp012862 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 04:59:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from there (port-219-88-129-248.orcon.net.nz [219.88.129.248]) by dbmail-mx1.orcon.co.nz (8.12.6/8.12.6/Debian-7) with SMTP id h8H8whG6003067; Wed, 17 Sep 2003 20:58:56 +1200 Message-Id: <200309170858.h8H8whG6003067@dbmail-mx1.orcon.co.nz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" From: cr To: cjlnh@webtv.net (Cheryl LaScola), fsktl@aurora.uaf.edu (KTL) Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Tarzan Poll Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 20:41:14 +1200 X-Mailer: KMail [version 1.3.2] Cc: chakram-refugees@smoe.org References: <21966-3F67C27C-5999@storefull-2337.public.lawson.webtv.net> In-Reply-To: <21966-3F67C27C-5999@storefull-2337.public.lawson.webtv.net > MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: -2.4 () EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,MSGID_HAS_NO_AT,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENC ES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES X-Spam-Score: -2.4 () EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,MSGID_HAS_NO_AT,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENC ES,REPLY_WITH_QUOTES X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.32 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-26.1 required=5.0 tests=EMAIL_ATTRIBUTION,IN_REP_TO,QUOTED_EMAIL_TEXT,REFERENCES, REPLY_WITH_QUOTES version=2.53 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.53 (1.174.2.15-2003-03-30-exp) X-Virus-Scanned: clamdscan / ClamAV version 0.60 X-Virus-Scanned: clamdscan / ClamAV version 0.60 Sender: owner-chakram-refugees@smoe.org Precedence: bulk X-Brightmail: Message tested, results are inconclusive On Wednesday 17 September 2003 14:10, Cheryl LaScola wrote: > All I can say to KT's informative post is, > WOW... I had no idea all this animosity was going on!! Gabfundies or > not, how sad a commentary that supposed "fans" would have to be sooo > small as to stuff the ballot box to tear Lucy down. > > I am only on this list so not in tune with the bigger picture I guess. > I couldn't figure out how /why the count against Lucy joining the cast > of Tarzan was so high and growing. I suppose I should be happy it is > just a small nucleus of disgruntled ex-XWPfans. As you all know, IANAG (I Am Not A Gabfan ;). Ironically enough, most of the XWPfans I know personally *are* Gabfans. Which is why I feel impelled to point out (and I'm sure KT will agree with me) that 99% of Gabfans - the vast majority of them - are *not* Gabfundies out to 'get' Lucy. They're thoroughly nice people who just happen to see something in Gabs that I can't, but mostly they either like Lucy too or at least accept her the same way most of us Xenafans accept ROC. There are just a very few who suffer from the paranoia that "ROC would be the star of the show if Lucy wasn't married to the producer" yadda yadda. But KT's right, those deluded characters do exist, and some of them are very noisy about it. Still, I'd be surprised if those few are so bitter and twisted as to try and wreck Lucy's vote - except that I can't think of any other more likely explanation. Misogynistic Tarzan-fanatic guys who don't want an ex-'Warrior woman' on the show? Nah, hardly seems likely. cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 22:28:09 EDT From: KLOSSNER9@aol.com Subject: [chakram-refugees] TV GUide on Tarzan The TV Guide Fall Preview issue, Sept. 13-19, p. 59, has a piece on Tarzan. They list 5 actors -- and no Lucy Lawless. Sheesh. How quickly they forget. Boeotian ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 22:40:16 EDT From: KLOSSNER9@aol.com Subject: [chakram-refugees] [OT] Warrior Queen TV Guide Fall Preview issue, p. 109, has a note on Warrior Queen, a movie on Boudica, to be shown on PBS (!) on Oct. 12. It stars Alex Kingston, of ER and The Adventures and Misadventures of Moll Flanders. Boeotian ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 20:00:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Meredith Tarr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] TV GUide on Tarzan Hi, Boeotian noted: > The TV Guide Fall Preview issue, Sept. 13-19, p. 59, > has a piece > on Tarzan. They list 5 actors -- and no Lucy > Lawless. Sheesh. > How quickly they forget. More likely, it's that the issue had already gone to press when the news broke last week that Lucy is joining the cast. TV Guide always seemed to like X:WP and Lucy in particular -- I can't imagine they wouldn't have mentioned it if they had known. Meredith meth@smoe.org __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 22:01:35 -0500 From: "S. Wilson" Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] [OT] Warrior Queen At 10:40 PM 9/17/2003 -0400, KLOSSNER9@aol.com wrote: >TV Guide Fall Preview issue, p. 109, has a note on Warrior Queen, a >movie on Boudica, to be shown on PBS (!) on Oct. 12. It stars Alex >Kingston, of ER and The Adventures and Misadventures of Moll Flanders. > >Boeotian Ah! Ah! A couple of years ago the production staff of this movie contacted me to get some help with background info and historical costumery and stuff like that. I've been waiting to see this puppy finally hit the market. Yay! I think Alex Kingston is going to rock in this role. Steph *running out into the night to buy a spankin' new tape* ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 23:11:40 EDT From: KLOSSNER9@aol.com Subject: [chakram-refugees] new Xena chapter in book There is a new article in Whoosh, Preferred and Oppositional Readings on Xena: Warrior Princess, by Hannah Jennings-Voykovich. In her bibliography, she lists a chapter in a new book. The chapter is "Histories, Fictions and Xena: Warrior Princess," by Sara Gwenllian-Jones. It is in a 2003 book from Routledge, an academic publisher - The Audience Studies Reader, edited by Will Brooker and Deborah Jermyn. Boeotian ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ End of chakram-refugees-digest V3 #276 **************************************