From: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org (chakram-refugees-digest) To: chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Subject: chakram-refugees-digest V3 #203 Reply-To: chakram-refugees@smoe.org Sender: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk chakram-refugees-digest Saturday, July 19 2003 Volume 03 : Number 203 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 2 [IfeRae@aol.com] RE: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 2 ["H.J.J. Hewitt" ] Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 2 [cr ] Re: [ Re: [chakram-refugees] Titans--YAXIs] [cr ] [chakram-refugees] Three Camera vs. One Camera [Brule31x63@aol.com] [chakram-refugees] Xena DVD Season 2 ["Cheryl Ande" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2003 00:52:24 EDT From: IfeRae@aol.com Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 2 In a message dated 7/17/2003 12:35:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time, xjv05@dial.pipex.com writes: > Over the six seasons, we initially saw the people who had influenced Xena - > Hercules, Ares, Lao Ma, M'Lila etc. Then we started to see the people that > Xena had influenced Borias, Satrina, Grunhilda, Akemi etc, but each of them > saw Xena as an opportunity. They could get something they wanted from Xena. > Gabrielle got the most from her relationship with Xena because she was > willing to risk everything and change. That is what I saw in the solo > ending and why I felt it was so much more powerful that the amended version. > Agreed. Plus, she was the only one who wanted Xena to be what Xena wanted, to love Xena for herself. I also preferred the original ending for dramatic reasons, even if I sometimes watch the revised ending for sentimental reasons. - -- Ife ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2003 01:56:31 -0500 From: "H.J.J. Hewitt" Subject: RE: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 2 >>The DVD ending with the two women together suggests >>nothing has changed and it negates in >>some way the sacrifice both women made.>> > >I also prefer the original ending of Gabrielle standing on the ship "alone" I'm one of the overly-sensitive souls who refused to see FIN. To verify that the tape of it that I had made for Sojourner was okay, I checked the very final minutes and saw Xena and Gabrielle on the boat, and as I recall, saying something to the effect of "We will always be together". But from the above exchange in Ann Reddecliffe's message, it sounds as if what I saw would have been the DVD ending. So how did the 'original' ending that I caught the glimpse of differ from the DVD's? TEXena ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2003 19:55:33 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 2 On Friday 18 July 2003 18:56, H.J.J. Hewitt wrote: > >>The DVD ending with the two women together suggests > >>nothing has changed and it negates in > >>some way the sacrifice both women made.>> > > > >I also prefer the original ending of Gabrielle standing on the ship > > "alone" > > I'm one of the overly-sensitive souls who refused to see FIN. To verify > that the tape of it that I had made for Sojourner was okay, I checked the > very final minutes and saw Xena and Gabrielle on the boat, and as I recall, > saying something to the effect of "We will always be together". > > But from the above exchange in Ann Reddecliffe's message, it sounds as if > what I saw would have been the DVD ending. So how did the 'original' > ending that I caught the glimpse of differ from the DVD's? > > > TEXena 7 seconds more footage, by my estimation. The original ending shows a close-up of Xena and Gabs on the boat, then fades to a mid-length shot of Gabs alone on the boat, and the camera tracks up and away past the stern of the boat to sunset and fadeout. 18 seconds from the fade to fade-out. The DVD ending shows the same close-up, then fades to the same tracking shot but starting part-way through, behind the stern of the boat, so you don't see Gabs alone. 11 seconds. cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2003 21:07:55 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 2 On Friday 18 July 2003 07:37, Ann Reddecliffe wrote: > I also prefer the original ending of Gabrielle standing on the ship "alone" > and felt that the "new" ending actually diminished what had been achieved. > In some respects I could never really understand the outcry about the > original ending. > > I heard, but didn't take on board, the issues about Gabrielle was seen to > be abandoned or soulmates being separated. None of the arguments seemed to > fit, but it was interesting how perspectives differed, especially where > people emphathised with one character rather than the other. The overall > concepts seemed to revolve around the idea that one or both of the > characters (or their relationship) was diminished by the ending. I could never understand that either. The scene started with Gabrielle alone on the ship. Then Xena 'appeared' for most of the scene, but the scene ended with Gabrielle alone again. Now I don't personally think it makes much difference to this particular argument whether 'Xena' was a ghost that Gabrielle alone could see, or a figment of Gabrielle's imagination, or (as I tend to think) the real spirit of Xena appearing in Gabrielle's thoughts. Physically, Gabby was alone on the ship, as we saw at the start of the scene and again at the end. I really can't see any symbolism in that 'disappearance'. I do think, though, that the brief shot of Gabby alone at the end was very effective, very moving, it did justice to the episode, and I wish RT had left it in the DVD. (Of course, with DVD technology, there could have been a menu option to choose the preferred ending). cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2003 21:11:15 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: [ Re: [chakram-refugees] Titans--YAXIs] On Friday 18 July 2003 05:48, Mark B. wrote: > Jackie M. Young wrote: > > I was catching up on checking my S1 DVDs and noticed in The Titans that > > there were some YAXIs I hadn't seen/heard before. ;) > > This is a good example of what I would categorize as a 'snoozable' ep > and yet, like all the others, there are always a couple of great lines, > looks or raised eyebrows! I was going to comment on the fact that very few people had noticed those YAXIs. Quite probably (I think) because 'nobody' liked it well enough to devote much attention to it, nor did anybody hate it enough to go looking for faults. IMO :) cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2003 11:32:34 EDT From: Brule31x63@aol.com Subject: [chakram-refugees] Three Camera vs. One Camera Cheryl Ande wrote: > > > Not to mention, the one-camera setup. Low, low production values, > only > > > undercut by the daytime soaps. :( > > > > I though sitcoms use a tree camera set up. That was the innovation that > > Desi Arnez had for I Love Lucy.\ cr replied > No, it's Flintstones that use the tree camera. > Oh, you mean *three* camera ;) > > Well, maybe so, but the cameras never zoom, never move, never change > focus... > in other words, as uninteresting (and cheap) as it's possible to make it. > (Or do they actually move and I never noticed?) > > Three camera is common for sitcoms. Three camera is MUCH cheaper than one camera. In sitcoms, there are three cameras covering the "action" such as it is. Because the cameras must not "see" each other, the actors must stay within very constrained marks. With all three cameras going at the same time, all close-ups, etc. can be made by one camera while another camera picks up the long shots. The editor then pieces the three films of the same action together to make the finished product. In a one camera show, such as Xena or Buffy, only one camera covers the action and so it's impossible to destroy the illusion of really being there by having the camera "see" another camera. This means that all the scenes have to be done over multiple times when the director wants some long shots and some close-ups. "One Camera" is the term used for dramas or action shows with HIGH production values. "Three Camera" is the term used for sitcoms or shows with LOW production values. Of course, One Camera shows like Xena will sometimes save money by using more than one camera. XWP's tavern shots work like this. `It Takes One To Know One` probably had three cameras going most of the time, I'd guess. A show like `Friends` will sometimes use tracking shots or crane shots which are traditional one camera techniques. Tracking shots can't normally have a second camera following much of the action because the second camera will "see" the track. Check out: www.cs.vu.nl/~mmc/tbr/content_pages/ repository/Film_Glossary.doc Cleanthes (GGGHD) Drive my dead thoughts over the universe, Like withered leaves, to quicken a new birth; --Shelley-- ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2003 22:18:39 -0400 From: "Cheryl Ande" Subject: [chakram-refugees] Xena DVD Season 2 Creations is taking preorders for the set. So look around you might be able to find other sites taking orders too. CherylA ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ End of chakram-refugees-digest V3 #203 **************************************