From: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org (chakram-refugees-digest) To: chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Subject: chakram-refugees-digest V3 #182 Reply-To: chakram-refugees@smoe.org Sender: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk chakram-refugees-digest Monday, June 30 2003 Volume 03 : Number 182 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 1 [IfeRae@aol.com] Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 1 [IfeRae@aol.com] Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 1 [cr ] Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 1 [cr ] [chakram-refugees] Caesar on TNT, et al [KLOSSNER9@aol.com] [chakram-refugees] Hercules DVD ["Cheryl Ande" ] Re: [chakram-refugees] Hercules DVD ["Ernie" >Again have to say I have always seen Xena as a very > >emotional character. Although she hides behind the warrior mask I really > >believe Xena wears her heart on her sleeve more than another character in > >the series. > > You just contradicted yourself there. Just the wrong figure of speech. > Yes Xena does hide her feelings (which is the exact opposite of 'wearing her > > heart on her sleeve', I think). But, if you said she's naturally a deeply > emotional person, albeit one who has learnt from bitter experience to keep > her emotions in check, then I'd agree. > > My apologies for repeating anything from my previous response on Cheryl's comments, but I believe the apparent "contradiction" is dead-on. I believe Lucy gave depth to Xena precisely by somehow managing to project both passion and control. Warlords holding a knife to Gabby's throat may haven seen themselves facing an impassive Xena, but even the dumbest could tell that the menace radiating from her did not come from the same "business as usual" nonchalance of other warriors. You could feel her fear for Solan's life, even as she made calculated assessments of Hope's vulnerabilities. Ming T'ien could feel her love for Lao Ma, even as she stood regarding him with icy rage. We knew whom Xena loved or hated, whether she had a personal investment in something, without her ever saying a word. Her emotions were in her eyes, her stillness, her posture, the curl of her lips -- right out there in the open -- for any opponent who chose to look. Sure, many missed, ignored or underestimated her feelings, but that can happen even when someone dangles the "sleeve" right in front of some people's faces. What she didn't necessarily reveal was what she intended to do or that she was vulnerable in any way simply because she cared. I guess I'm saying that I think people can wear their "heart on their sleeve" without necessarily being blatant. That Xena had "heart" (love, passion, courage, etc.) in every sense of the word was so integral to her "being" that she could "mask" it however she wanted and it was still there. Don't know if that makes sense, but it's like saying I see this as a case of "both/and," not "either/or." - -- Ife ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2003 03:01:25 EDT From: IfeRae@aol.com Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 1 In a message dated 6/28/2003 9:34:57 PM Central Daylight Time, cr@orcon.net.nz writes: > If there's one > >>character in the > >>series I really would have loved to see more of, it's M'Lila. >> > > > >Me too, if only to see a little of her back story. > > > >-- Ife > > Yes, they could have done that... though it would only peripherally have > been a Xena story. (And we know how you feel about Xena-lite eps :) > > cr > No, in my version, we somehow have a flashback to before M'Lila stows away on Xena's boat. Maybe M was a freedom fighter who'd joined with some folks Xena battled. We find out how she learned her skills and see her checking out Xena's moves and strategies. When the forces are defeated, she decides to kill Xena, learn from Xena and/or see if Xena's boat can get her closer to home. The ep would be Gab-lite. - -- Ife ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2003 19:00:11 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 1 On Sunday 29 June 2003 17:21, IfeRae@aol.com wrote: > > You just contradicted yourself there. Just the wrong figure of speech. > > Yes Xena does hide her feelings (which is the exact opposite of 'wearing > > her > > heart on her sleeve', I think). But, if you said she's naturally a > > deeply emotional person, albeit one who has learnt from bitter experience > > to keep her emotions in check, then I'd agree. (snip) > I guess I'm saying that I think people can wear their "heart on their > sleeve" without necessarily being blatant. That Xena had "heart" (love, > passion, courage, etc.) in every sense of the word was so integral to her > "being" that she could "mask" it however she wanted and it was still there. > Don't know if that makes sense, but it's like saying I see this as a case > of "both/and," not "either/or." > > -- Ife Okay. I'll buy that. You're right with reference to Xena. Though it's not how I interpret the usual meaning of the phrase. cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2003 20:22:18 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 1 On Sunday 29 June 2003 19:01, IfeRae@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 6/28/2003 9:34:57 PM Central Daylight Time, > > cr@orcon.net.nz writes: > > >> If there's one character in the > > >> series I really would have loved to see more of, it's M'Lila. >> > > > > > >Me too, if only to see a little of her back story. > > > > > >-- Ife > > > > Yes, they could have done that... though it would only peripherally have > > been a Xena story. (And we know how you feel about Xena-lite eps :) > > > > cr > > No, in my version, we somehow have a flashback to before M'Lila stows away > on Xena's boat. Maybe M was a freedom fighter who'd joined with some folks > Xena battled. We find out how she learned her skills and see her checking > out Xena's moves and strategies. When the forces are defeated, she decides > to kill Xena, learn from Xena and/or see if Xena's boat can get her closer > to home. The ep would be Gab-lite. > > -- Ife Oh, well done. I like that. We could have seen Xena plotting her strategy and M'Lila plotting hers... a sort of parallel between the two young commanders trying to outwit each other. TPTB really should have got you to write that ep.... they coulda done that for a fan-written ep instead of When Fates Collide. Woulda made KT happy :) cr ... ps. Gab-lite wouldn't worry me.... just thought you'd like to know ;) ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2003 16:21:23 EDT From: KLOSSNER9@aol.com Subject: [chakram-refugees] Caesar on TNT, et al There's a lot of ancient history stuff on cable tonight. At 7:00 Central TNT has part one of their 2-part miniseries Caesar. The review in my local papaer says that they portray Julius Caesar as a "young idealist" and "populist." Unfortubately these miniseries always have to portray their protagonists as good guys. So Caesar gets overrated here, just as Npaoleon was in a recent miniseries claled Napoleon, made in Europe but shown on U.S. cable. They even recently had a Hitler miniseries which they had to cut drastically to avoid accusations of making him sympathetic. They cut his childhood almost completely out. As for Caesar being a populist, I recall that XWP gave him a couple lines suggesting that in the episode about a 3-way battle among Caesar, Pompey and Xena. In Rome all the top men were aristocrats. One group was openly anti-democratic; another, equally aristocratic bunch was supposedly for the people. Caesar's family belonged to the latter faction and so did he. Modern conservatives see Caesar as an example of a rich guy becoming dictator and replacing a functioning republic with the emperor system (though only after his death) by bribing the common people with handouts. Also tonight is Spartans at the Gates of Fire on Discovery Channel, at 8:00 Central. This is a 2-hour docu on the Spartans at Thermopylae, the battle very loosely referred to in One Against an Army. Also, History Channel, at 7:00 Central, has Punishment, a 2-hour docu on criminal punishments throughout history. They probably start with the ancient world, and should point out that large prisons did not exist in ancient times, when people were mostly punished by fines, confiscation, enslavement, exile, mutilation or death. So the XWP prison island episode was not accurate. Also TSM has the two Ray Harryhausen Greek mythology films, Jason and the Argonauts and Clash of the Titans, at 7:00 and 9:00 Central; and Atlantis the Lost Continent (not Harryhausen) at midnight Central. Boeotian ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2003 17:16:24 -0400 From: "Cheryl Ande" Subject: [chakram-refugees] Hercules DVD Much to my surprise I saw an ad for the first Hercules DVD Saturday on the show Lost World. It contains all the Hercules movies and the 13 epsiodes from the first season. It also has commentary by Kevin Sorbo and Michael Hurst. The commentary surprised me - I wonder if Anchor Bay has some kind of corporate relationship with Tribune since they got Sorbo to do commentary? CherylA ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2003 18:19:22 -0700 From: "Ernie" Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Hercules DVD To all Sacramento-area Xenites: Best Buy has season one of Hercules for $54.99, which is far better than the $89.99 that Border's wanted. Git 'em while you can. Scads of Xenas, too, for the same price. Ernie - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cheryl Ande" To: Sent: Sunday, June 29, 2003 2:16 PM Subject: [chakram-refugees] Hercules DVD > Much to my surprise I saw an ad for the first Hercules DVD Saturday on the > show Lost World. It contains all the Hercules movies and the 13 epsiodes from > the first season. It also has commentary by Kevin Sorbo and Michael Hurst. > The commentary surprised me - I wonder if Anchor Bay has some kind of > corporate relationship with Tribune since they got Sorbo to do commentary? > > CherylA > ========================================================= > This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. > To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with > "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. > Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. > ========================================================= ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2003 22:59:31 EDT From: IfeRae@aol.com Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 1 In a message dated 6/29/2003 3:12:48 AM Central Daylight Time, cr@orcon.net.nz writes: > >No, in my version, we somehow have a flashback to before M'Lila stows away > >on Xena's boat. Maybe M was a freedom fighter who'd joined with some folks > >Xena battled. We find out how she learned her skills and see her checking > >out Xena's moves and strategies. When the forces are defeated, she decides > >to kill Xena, learn from Xena and/or see if Xena's boat can get her closer > >to home. The ep would be Gab-lite. > > > >-- Ife > > Oh, well done. I like that. We could have seen Xena plotting her > strategy and M'Lila plotting hers... a sort of parallel between the two > young commanders trying to outwit each other. > Oooo, I like that even better. Actually, that's something I kind of missed - -- Xena going up against an honorable (and mortal) female warrior, whom she later came to respect. Usually, she pretty quickly defeated (e.g., Cyane) or teamed up with (e.g., Bodicea) the honorable ones, or fought someone "bad" like Callisto or Mavicam. I guess the closest was Athena -- whom Xena used to respect and wasn't unworthy or evil, so much as determined to preserve the status quo. - -- Ife ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2003 22:59:30 EDT From: IfeRae@aol.com Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Friend In Need Part 1 In a message dated 6/29/2003 3:13:15 AM Central Daylight Time, cr@orcon.net.nz writes: > >I guess I'm saying that I think people can wear their "heart on their > >sleeve" without necessarily being blatant. That Xena had "heart" (love, > >passion, courage, etc.) in every sense of the word was so integral to her > >"being" that she could "mask" it however she wanted and it was still there. > > Don't know if that makes sense, but it's like saying I see this as a case > >of "both/and," not "either/or." > > > >-- Ife > > Okay. I'll buy that. You're right with reference to Xena. Though it's > not how I interpret the usual meaning of the phrase. > LOL! I didn't think of it quite that way either, until Cheryl said it in relationship to Xena. I suddenly found myself redefining the concept, or perhaps more accurately seeing it as more multi-dimensional. Admittedly, it connoted a potential "weakness" to me (perhaps wrongly) before. But it "fit" my idea of Xena, just as the "mask" idea did. Now I see that the "mask" can connote vulnerability (what she's trying to hide), while the "heart on sleeve" can connote strength (passion and feelings as part of her arsenal). That's probably going beyond what Cheryl meant, but it's something else that occurred to me as I was trying to reconcile those two seemingly contradictory aspects. - -- Ife ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2003 17:54:27 -1000 (HST) From: "Jackie M. Young" Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] watching Xener On Mon, 23 Jun 2003 22:16:01 -0400, "Cheryl Ande" wrote: >Jeeze I thought I was the only one having trouble moving on. Nothing has >really pricked my interest since Xena. - --;=) In one of my university classes, the "kids" (I'm *ermm* "non-traditional") ask me why I'm still interested in the show since it's off the air. I usually reply that it's still in reruns on Oxygen and that new people discover it all the time, and that I think it's a classic like ST:TOS and will be the benchmark for similar action shows/films in years to come. What's interesting is that people nowadays only judge things by what's new or "hot" and don't judge things by *quality*, not realizing that "if you don't learn from history, you are doomed to repeat it" (or something like that ;) ). Not only did TPTB on XWP learn from History, Philosophy, and Religion, but they reinvented it, IMO. ;) - --Jackie ****************************************************** * Proud to have the same birthday as Lucy Lawless! * * * * "I think New Zealand geographically comes from * * ... Hawai'i." --Lucy Lawless, Late Show, 4/9/96 * * * * JACKIE YOUNG, JYOUNG@LAVA.NET * * * ****************************************************** ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ End of chakram-refugees-digest V3 #182 **************************************