From: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org (chakram-refugees-digest) To: chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Subject: chakram-refugees-digest V3 #123 Reply-To: chakram-refugees@smoe.org Sender: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk chakram-refugees-digest Wednesday, May 7 2003 Volume 03 : Number 123 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [chakram-refugees] Xena Season 1 dvd - the details on thebonus disc offe... [IfeRa] Comments on FIN added to Re: [chakram-refugees] Xena Season 1 dvd - the details on the bonus disc offer!! [] [chakram-refugees] re:Cheryl's reviews [Wizdym4@aol.com] Re: Comments on FIN added to Re: [chakram-refugees] Xena Season 1 dvd - the details on =?iso-8859-1?q?the bonus=20disc?= offer!! [] Re: [chakram-refugees] <> [cr ] Re: [chakram-refugees] Xena Season 1 dvd - the details on the bonus disc offer!! ["Creation (Sharon Delaney)" > ["Ann Reddecliffe" LaScola wrote: > > >lost bits from the cutting room floor. If a show ran long, what is > >edited is lost forever?? > > I also would have thought that *someone* has kept the raw film > footage. I personally would love to see raw film footage of > Renee and/or Lucy working through fight routines with the stunties, > heck, even getting to see footage of the 2nd unit shoots and > all of the hard work of the stunt doubles. > > Amen! Or, like somebody else said, some special effects person telling/showing that aspect of it. What's "garbage" to Xenastaff is like gold to us. - -- Ife ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 May 2003 00:21:06 -0400 From: mirrordrum Subject: Comments on FIN added to Re: [chakram-refugees] Xena Season 1 dvd - the details on the bonus disc offer!! oh yeah. it's why I'm still making Xena walls, still watching Xena eps, planning on buying the dvds and keeping the tapes so my SO can watch them while she works out, still coming up with questions about eps, still mulling over FIN, still on chak-ref. my partner still wears her chakram necklace on days when she has to deal with tough issues at work, whether it's death and dying, dealing with a mom on crack, homeless teenage parents, a hostile family, grief issues, too many difficult cases, an intransigent HMO or a nasty surgeon. since i can't work, i use Xena (and the actors' overall work ethic which fits with my old one) to keep me going when I'd really rather not; keeps me writing Congresspeople, letters to the editor, doing what i can do. i use other resources too, of course, but for some reason Xena fills a slot that nothing else touches. sometimes it's good for a laugh, sometimes for plain distraction and sometimes for the story or the acting, the characters and the relationships. it's a show that still gives me things to ponder, things to explore. i confess that during the most intense period leading up to and then during the invasion of Iraq, i couldn't watch Xena b/c i couldn't tolerate any more violence than what i was finding on the net (none of that made it to the US major media of course). that gave me cause for pause too and provoked more thinking about faux violence leading to the real thing--or making us take the real thing as though it were a movie or sporting event. then the other night i finally was able to watch FIN the director's cut with the commentary. i still don't know what to make of the relationship between the images I've seen and what i've read about what happened in Iraq--the reality of war--and my love of the show. i can't fit these together. but the director's cut and then watching it with the commentary really touched me and the best i can come up with is that in the end, it wasn't about the violence but about the assumption of responsibility. Mary Renault says "sin isn't just guilt. it's about being responsible for the consequences. Orestes found that out." i don't know that anybody has made that connection but Xena's guilt or sin fits quite well, i think, into the Greek conception that left Orestes to be hounded by the Eumenides. he didn't act with intention to violate mores, but he did and so he suffered punishment for his actions, separate from his intentions. the same applied to Xena. in the commentary on FIN, Lucy comments that Xena acted irresponsibly--presumably with the torch--which i thought was interesting. she didn't seem to feel that xena's grief or her persecution by the villagers explained, let alone justified, the consequences of what she did in Higuchi. the slaughter of innocents had to be paid for. well, to me this is relevant to the current situation with the US. i will say no more than that. just that once again, Xena became relevant to me in a way i wouldn't have expected. and it may be simply because i agree with the importance of responsibility. i think it a bit more complex than that but that doesn't really matter. i think my favorite bit in the commentary was Lucy's (or maybe rob's--or possibly both) comment at the end that the question Xena should have asked Gabrielle at the fountain was "if i came back now, what kind of life would i have (knowing what the result would be for the 40,000 souls)?" she said she wished that had been asked. it's a question so many of us have raised who liked the ending to FIN. or, well, not "liked" but found it right and fitting. to have come back would have been hell for both Xena and gab and in the end would probably have destroyed them both. her death probably saved them and the fact that, in the end, though Xena pushed the decision, gab abided by what Xena asked of her. and she didn't have to, as Xena presumably couldn't have stopped her from dumping the ashes. pretty cool. well, sorry for the digression. I've just been thinking about it and haven't posted for such a long time. md At 10:04 PM 5/5/2003 -0400, Cheryl LaScola wrote: >md, >hit the nail on the head.... the actors and crew were so generous and >honest it does leave us always wanting more, and therein lies the >rub....we love the unselfishness of the Xenaverse but find ourselves >selfishly craving more. I guess it's a good problem to have.... ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 01:16:27 EDT From: Wizdym4@aol.com Subject: [chakram-refugees] re:Cheryl's reviews Salutations Cheryl! I'm hoping you were just kiddin' about not bein' sure if anyone appreciated your reviews of the Xena eps. They're my favorite part of the Chakram list. Sheesh!...I honestly treasure them! I'm trying to save'em by copyin' them and mailing them to myself...lol. Huh, I've even done that with other's commentaries on your reviews. But, it'd be a lot easier if you put 'em all on a CD and maybe a hard-copy book...I know I'd buy both if you were to market them. Maybe you plan on that already, I can tell you're a very sharp tack! Btw, your last name Ande is interesting. Are you perhaps from South America? I've been listening lately to some Andean flute music. Also, I heartily recommend to you and everyone on this list an artist named Shenandoah who sings some enchantingly beautiful American Indian songs. Last week I ordered three more of her CDs from Amazon.com. I'm listening to her now....... Anyway, please continue your reviews. They are very much appreciated. ..................>>>>>>>>God/dess Inspire!...>>>Carmon ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 20:48:35 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: Comments on FIN added to Re: [chakram-refugees] Xena Season 1 dvd - the details on =?iso-8859-1?q?the bonus=20disc?= offer!! On Tuesday 06 May 2003 16:21, mirrordrum wrote: (mindless cuts and gratuitous snippage) > then the other night i finally was able to watch FIN the director's cut > with the commentary. i still don't know what to make of the relationship > between the images I've seen and what i've read about what happened in > Iraq--the reality of war--and my love of the show. i can't fit these > together. There's a big gap, for me, between my 'real-life' beliefs (which lean towards the pacifist) and what I like to watch on TV. I don't know how it is for you but I find it's the tension, the excitement, and the action that makes me watch Xena (amongst other things!). Not necessarily the violence as such, though without the threat of it, much of the tension would dissipate. Why do I like watching this stuff? Probably because it's genetically programmed into us to be competitive, or vicariously to watch someone else up against it, whether it's competing against others or just trying to beat the odds in a 'will he make it?' kind of way. But I can't watch Vietnam movies. They're too real - and by that, I'm not praising their producers, but thinking of the circumstances. The Vietnam war happened. People died in it. I can watch World War 2 documentaries - a war I think was justified (from the Allies' side), but not usually WW2 movies. Xena, OTOH, can give me the excitement, without the overshadowing knowledge that people were suffering and dieing for real. Because Xena is fictional. The only thing that would give me qualms of conscience about watching Xena is the idea that viewers might get used to violence and accept it. But I honestly don't think it has a lot of effect on most adequately balanced individuals, and the few nut cases are a lost cause anyway. (IMO). Does it cause the great mass of the populace to be more accepting of violence in their name? Well, past ages have been incredibly violent and they didn't have TV or movies to brainwash them into it. Overt violence is often not necessary. Sometimes the threat of it is enough - - which creates suspense. The scariest sequence I know was in a Clint Eastwood movie 'Play Misty for Me' (no, not a Western!) where he played a DJ who had an affair with a fan then dropped her when he found out she was obsessive (hey, the original Scary Fan? ) And he came home to his house and we knew - but he didn't - that she was waiting in there somewhere. With a knife. And the camera followed him through the house, every time he casually walked through a doorway my nerves were screaming... when she finally attacked it came as a relief. Or, again, a good director could get far more tension out of two cowboys facing each other, waiting to draw, than half a battallion blasting away at each other with automatic weapons. Whether they finally drew or not. > but the director's cut and then watching it with the commentary > really touched me and the best i can come up with is that in the end, it > wasn't about the violence but about the assumption of responsibility. Without the story to give a point to it, the violence would have been - pointless. On the other hand, could the story have functioned as well with less violence in it? I don't know that it could (without changing the storyline completely). This was Xena's final battle. She had to do major damage to the enemy before going out. It had to be overwhelming odds. She actually did more damage, in terms of numbers, to Khan's army in Back in the Bottle. But that was a battle too easily won. It wouldn't have done as well for the epic finale that FIN needed to be. > i think my favorite bit in the commentary was Lucy's (or maybe rob's--or > possibly both) comment at the end that the question Xena should have asked > Gabrielle at the fountain was "if i came back now, what kind of life would > i have (knowing what the result would be for the 40,000 souls)?" she said > she wished that had been asked. it's a question so many of us have raised > who liked the ending to FIN. or, well, not "liked" but found it right and > fitting. I think some of the objectors thought that the 'punishment' - having to stay dead - outweighed the 'crime' (since there were extenuating circumstances), But I don't think that was the point. Life, or fate, or destiny, or karma, had conspired to place Xena in a position where the fate of the 40,000 souls depended on her. It may not have been 'fair' or justice but then life often isn't fair. And Xena, being Xena, did what she had to do. In that line from Tsunami (that KT hates because Xena would never say it herself) - ['What did you expect?'] 'From me, nothing less.' > well, sorry for the digression. I've just been thinking about it and > haven't posted for such a long time. > > md I'll see your digression and raise you one! ;) And it's great to see you back! cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 22:04:52 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] <> On Monday 05 May 2003 08:47, Cheryl Ande wrote: > # > # > # > # > To Helicon and Back > > > Should I comment? Seeing as how I like this episode just slightly better than One Against an Army.... ah well, Cheryl posted her review, I'll make some remarks :) > The episode takes place just after Paths of Vengeance. Varia is about to > be made Queen of the Amazons and there is going to be a ceremony. > Gabrielle is an invited guest but Xena, because she is not an Amazon, is to > be excluded. Those snotty Amazons! As if, one way or another, Xena didn't have more impact on the Amazon nation than every single one of their Queens put together. (And that includes itinerant relieving Queen Gabrielle! ;) > This doesn't seem to bother Xena at all - she has never been a > fan of Amazon ceremonies. With a good-humored warning to Gabrielle not to > do anything she wouldn't she is off to her more peaceful campsite. > > > > There ceremony seems to a pretty typical Amazon gathering: dancing, some > blue women and some ceremonial bloodletting. Things go wrong when, once > again, the Amazons are taken surprise by a troop of masked and hooded men. They're supposed to be a warrior tribe.... haven't they heard of such a thing as lookouts? Just in case the Romans come back (again), for example.... > The Amazons are stunned. They've lost another queen and a number of their > sisters. Xena has discovered that the raiders have come from the fortress > of Helicon on the coast. The Amazon queens decide to mount a rescue > mission for their queen but since none of them are familiar with Greece > they ask Gabrielle to lead them. Gabrielle is never comfortable leading > people into battle defers her command to Xena but the Amazon's will not > accept Xena - they must be lead by an Amazon queen and Gabrielle is the > only Greek queen around. Gabrielle reluctantly takes command. Okay, so I know it's a plot device to get Gabs to make the Tough Decisions, but last time in Endgame there didn't seem to be a problem... Xena did the strategising and Gabs rubber-stamped it, and it worked fine against a whole Roman army. This time, presumably, Xena let Gabrielle gain some experience in command. I suppose it would be unkind to compare the casualty lists and attribute it to the respective commanders . Hey, I didn't write the script. :) > A strategy now is planned. Helicon is a fortress on the seacoast. Xena > tells the Amazons the fort faces the inland and that is where the defenses > are. Gabrielle decides the best attack would be from the sea and Xena > agrees. The strategy seems a bit hasty but I am assuming since Xena > readily agrees with Gabrielle, she must know something of Helicon. She was > the one who identified the raiders from a mace found after the battle > therefore I assume Xena is familiar with the fortress. 'A bit hasty' is being kind. I guess I'd better not elaborate any further on the strategy in Saving Private Varia.... > Xena is now off on her own to kill the leader of Helicon. Gabrielle > gathers up the best Amazon warriors and is off to hire a ship - I assume > the Amazons don't have a navy. In Helicon Varia is being taunted by > Belleraphon, her captor. Varia says that the Amazons will come and rescue > her and Varia is shocked when Belleraphon is not shaken by this news but > elated. That night Xena sneaks into he fortress and encounters > Belleraphon. There is a fight and Belleraphon knocks around Xena pretty > easily. She's impressed but a bit non-plussed - the only people who have > punched her like that were gods. Belleraphon informs her he is half-god. > He is the son of Artemis and wants vengeance against the Amazons for > abandoning his mother during her time of need and Xena for killing his > mother. He will kill her and the Amazons starting with "those fools > bobbing up and down in the water" outside of his fort. Xena is stunned he > has figured out the plan and now knows it is a trap. She forgoes killing > Belleraphon, a mistake, and leaps out of the window into the ocean to help > Gabrielle and the Amazons. Yeah, howcome? Xena doesn't make mistakes. Usually. > On the ship the Amazons are not a happy bunch. They are seasick and > scared. Cyan and Gwen-Tier, the British queen, are talking. Cyan asks to > borrow some money. Gwen-Tier laughs saying they don't use the same coin. > Cyan says if she owes someone money she is bound to survive. Gwen-Tier > laughs but Cyan is deadly serious. Another young Amazon is frightened and > ashamed of it. Gabrielle comforts her saying everyone is frightened. We assume Gabs' legendary sea-sickness is overcome by the tension and the concentration required. That can happen. > The diversion works and the Amazons break through. Now Gabrielle is trying > to get them to the shelter of some large dunes where they will be out of > the line of fire. They make it to shelter with great loss of life. Cyan > suddenly sees Xena emerge from the water and she now joins them. Before > she can explain what has happened an Amazon accuses Xena of failing the > Amazons and that they will all die on the beach. That's a bit rich since the Amazons wouldn't let Xena lead them, isn't it? > > Indeed Varia has not shown the judgment of a great queen and that is what > Varia is suppose to be. Varia had an opportunity. It was wise of her to > accept Bellerphon's offer because it got her released but carrying it out > was another matter. The murder of Gabrielle at this crucial juncture of > the battle would have demoralized the troops. Varia had no idea how Xena > may have reacted to Gabrielle's death and if she would have been willing to > help the Amazon's after Gabrielle's death. If Belleraphon had kept his > word and let the Amazon's go, she could have been in Belleraphon's power in > the future simply because he knew of her treachery. On the other hand if > she would have revealed the deal to Xena that may have lead to a plan in > which the deal could have been used against the enemy. Instead Varia once > again goes it alone unwilling to seek advice or counsel of those with more > experience. Yet, was it any more unwise or ruthless than Gabs' intention to leave the wounded behind? And, since we're speculating, I would submit, it might have forced the Amazons to accept Xena's leadership (and forced Xena to take over), and considering the standard of generalship up to that point, it could only have been an improvement... ;) > The other Amazons at this point have decided they have had enough of Varia. > Cyan wants to kill her on the spot. Gabrielle won't stand for that but she > is more than willing to leave Varia stranded on the beach. She doesn't > want her at her back. Xena intervenes and says they can't just leave her > behind. Gabrielle relents but not before stripping Varia of her title. I don't think Gabs had the authority to do that. Place her under arrest, maybe, but I would have thought only the council of queens could do that. > That night the Amazons begin the swim to the castle's flank. They women > are towing a seriously wounded Queen Gwyn-Tier. Suddenly one of the women > spots a shark and this causes panic among the troops. Gabrielle quickly > makes a decision. She takes the comatose Gwyn-Tier and sacrifices her to > the shark in hopes that he will distract by his snack. This is, of course, the usual method of ensuring that dozens of sharks gather in a feeding frenzy. But maybe Greek sharks are different ;) > The Amazon's finally make it to the forest. Where they should have been in the first place..... > Gabrielle makes her battle > speech. She reminds the Amazons to fight for the Amazon nation and to > honor those who died. The speech is nice and ROC delivers it well but it > lacks the passion of say Henry V's Crispin Day's speech. Now we don't > expect Shakespeare but Gabby is bard you would have expected something a > bit more dramatic and yes we know Gabrielle is really depressed by now but > I believe she would played the part of confident queen better at this > point. Nevertheless the Amazons seem to take heart. Errrm, I agree there. I didn't find it convincing. (And yes, I know, I'm not a Gabfan but still....) > Xena now goes off to do her part. At the fortress she calls Belleraphon > out. The demi-god is arrogant; he believe he can't be killed because he is > part god. They fight. Xena has to pretend to loose the fight to > Belleraphon and you can tell she is none to happy about it. She does play > her part well and finally slinks off in defeat. A jubilant Belleraphon > calls for his horse and with his army chases after Xena. > > In the clearing Xena faces Belleraphon and his army. Belleraphon > arrogantly asks if she is facing her reputation. She says know she is > facing his. Suddenly the forest erupts with enraged Amazons. They finally > have their chance. No longer are the hiding from a faceless enemy. They > have flesh and blood men to fight and they do so with lethal abandon. So, why didn't they do this in the first place? Amazons are used to fighting in trees. Amazons are *not* used to storming castles, nor did sieges ever work unless the besiegers could starve out the defenders or had siege artillery. Which the Amazons did not have. Okay, I can say all this with hindsight. *But* a good commander (which Xena is supposed to be) should be able to see that before it all goes pear-shaped. And I don't believe Xena would let Gabby get half the Amazons killed just for practice. > This was for me a powerful episode. Yes it was written as homage to Saving > Private Ryan and all war movies. Biiig mistake. IMO. Wasn't SPR about the Normandy landings? (I haven't seen it). Okay, so the homage had to have a landing across a beachhead. Never mind that Amazons are quite unsuited to it. > Even Xena who prides herself on her dispassionate warrior persona suddenly > finds herself in the odd position of being the compassionate and merciful > one. When all assumptions about characters are thrown out the window and > when an audience is surprised, that is good drama. This is good drama. > > Now whether is makes sense in the realm of good strategy for war or battle > planning is questionable. I don't know and frankly I don't care. Obviously, I do. The trouble is, it not only doesn't make sense for pointy-headed amateur military tacticians, it doesn't make sense for *anybody* who's watched the average number of movies. You don't attack castles with a small number of troops across an open beach in daylight. You don't make sharks go away by feeding them (has nobody ever watched Jaws?) Oh I see you mentioned that. > I don't > know if Helicon is on the seacoast or if you can attack it by sea. Mythical place, it can be where TPTB want it to be. > Yes I > will agree that the Amazons should have had better intelligence but recent > history shows that lousy intelligence and a wacky battle plan can still win > wars. Such as....? That only works when you have a massive superiority in strength and equipment. 'Whatever happens, we have got the Maxim gun, and they have not' It does not work when (like the Amazons) your forces are at a disadvantage. > I do know that probably feeding someone to a hungry shark is a bad > idea since it would probably cause a feeding frenzy. Again I don't care I > watched this as a character study not as a realistic war documentary. Well, obviously I don't care so much for 'character studies'. Which is not to say I don't care about the characters. I *do* like the characters to be believable and interesting, and the more so, the more the story interests me. What I don't care for is an ep with "This is a character study. Ignore the stupid plot" in six-inch high letters across the screen. Which this might as well have had. (Actually, in that respect, it has similarities with OAAA and many of my gripes about OAAA apply also to this ep). In order for the characters to be believable, the *situations* they're in have to be believable. So unless they're trying to establish Gabby as the incompetent get-your-troops-killed klutz of the week, the idiocy of the military tactics is so blatant, so obvious to anybody, that the intended character study fails miserably. (This ain't just me tearing a strip off Gabby, I'd say exactly the same if Xena had been in command). And, getting to Xena - how is it in character for her? Xena is supposed to be an experienced commander. The best, in fact. Howcome she lets Gabby get most of the Amazons killed without doing something about it? I just can't credit that. > Before I finish up I would like to also mention Joe Doluca's score, which > was outstanding especially in the final battle scene. Morgan Reese > Fairhead was once again the outstanding as Cyan who hopefully now becomes > queen of the Amazons since Varia has proven an idiot once again. I like Cyane as queen but I think she'll have to watch her back with Varia around. > Well that's it for today. I hope those who missed me - if there is anyone > - enjoy this weeks review. > > CherylA Good to see you back. I enjoyed - umm, commenting on your comments. ;) cr ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 09:48:08 -0700 From: "Creation (Sharon Delaney)" Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Xena Season 1 dvd - the details on the bonus disc offer!! That's correct. It's now common practice to film behind-the-scenes footage on movies for DVD versions. But television shows never do it. Only on special occasions like a 200th episode. About the bloopers. Everyone seems to think there are hours of bloopers that we're just not releasing and it's not true. If an actor constantly blows their lines, they don't keep their job. Some episodes have no outtakes at all. And it costs money to print the footage that will not be used on the show. It's too expensive to print them all. Funny things may happen that don't get saved. Also, a mistake has to be funny to make a blooper. An actor simply saying the wrong word, stopping and then repeating the right one isn't funny. There may be a few that weren't put on the reel -- if the editor was pressed for time -- but not many. The unused and raw footage -- in the form of dailies -- is in the vaults at Universal and would be very expensive to access. Sharon >I don't know if time travel is viable, but are ou saying that they only >filmed the making of 2 shows in 6 years (including ameteur stuff)? That >is a real shame. > >Oh I guess I will have to settle for adding lots of out takes and or >lost bits from the cutting room floor. If a show ran long, what is >edited is lost forever?? > >C ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 22:09:25 +0100 From: "Ann Reddecliffe" Subject: RE: [chakram-refugees] <> Definitely one of my favourite episodes. # # # # To Helicon and Back This episode is one of my favorites simply because it is an episode that explores the changes in Xena and Gabrielle's characters. This piece can be seen as a companion piece to The Price. >> I actually see this differently, as a study in leadership and its costs. We see all the self doubt and self questioning that goes with the territory. The bit where X and G sit on the sand and have their "This is not who I am, this is the queen of the Amazons talk" says so much about the dilemma. Sometimes we have to achieve the right ends, but don't like the means. I see it as different from the Price. There Xena believes herself to be right (even if she doesn't like it), but Gabrielle sees it as wrong. Here both characters see their actions as necessary evils. >>There ceremony seems to a pretty typical Amazon gathering: dancing, some blue women and some ceremonial bloodletting. Things go wrong when, once again, the Amazons are taken surprise by a troop of masked and hooded men. The Amazons, rudely awakened from their trances, begin to fight back. Xena having heard the raiders advance soon joins the fray. >> I kept wondering what alerted her. I can't hear anything, but then she has amazing hearing - far better than mine I am sure. >>A strategy now is planned. Helicon is a fortress on the seacoast. Xena tells the Amazons the fort faces the inland and that is where the defenses are. Gabrielle decides the best attack would be from the sea and Xena agrees. >> There is an interesting exchange here between the characters. After Gabrielle outlines her plan and her thinking, Xena says "Good call", and Gabrielle replies "Good teacher". I was immediately struck by the scene in FIN where they are dealing with the fire at Higuchi (or some such spelling) and Xena asks Gabrielle for her plan there and then adopts it. It definitely suggests some off camera teaching of battle tactics. >>On the ship the Amazons are not a happy bunch. They are seasick and scared. Cyan and Gwen-Tier, the British queen, are talking. >> British?? Did we have Amazons? >>The diversion works and the Amazons break through. Now Gabrielle is trying to get them to the shelter of some large dunes where they will be out of the line of fire. They make it to shelter with great loss of life. Cyan suddenly sees Xena emerge from the water and she now joins them<< How did she get from the water to the beachhead without the enemy getting her? It was a TATMLM action, one I have a bit of trouble believing. But...... >>A new strategy is arrived at. They will flank the castle by going by sea and attack the fortress from the forest. Gabrielle says that they should leave the wounded behind because taking them would poses too much of a danger to the troops. Varia is incensed - she will not leave anyone behind. Xena is stunned and she tells Gabrielle the wounded will be at the enemy's mercy. At that moment Xena and Gabrielle have reversed roles. >> Interestingly, the script has the roles reversed and it is Xena wanting to leave the wounded behind and Gabrielle who wants to take them. I must admit that I think it works better as it was filmed. >>Xena then tells Gabrielle she will have to eventually rally the troops to fight again and more will probably die. Gabrielle is resigned to that eventuality. She reminds the Amazons to fight for the Amazon nation and to honor those who died. The speech is nice and ROC delivers it well but it lacks the passion of say Henry V's Crispin Day's speech. Now we don't expect Shakespeare but Gabby is bard you would have expected something a bit more dramatic and yes we know Gabrielle is really depressed by now but I believe she would played the part of confident queen better at this point. Nevertheless the Amazons seem to take heart>> The speech that makes it to the screen is much better than the one in the script. You can believe in the words on screen. How much of that is due to ROC is open for debate, but it worked for me. In fact I think the script was well conceived, with nice character studies and good interactions between the characters, but it reads as if it was rushed in the writing. The great ideas were there, but things needed a bit more reflection and maturing. It is good that some of the changes that were made were for the better. >>At the ridge a livid Gabrielle confronts Varia. She tells the other Amazons that Varia tried to kill her. >> I always wondered if Varia expectedd to "get away with it". Did she expect everyone to know that she had killed Gabrielle? What did she think the reaction of others would be? >>That night the Amazons begin the swim to the castle's flank. Gabrielle quickly makes a decision. She takes the comatose Gwyn-Tier and sacrifices her to the shark in hopes that he will distract by his snack. >> This, more than any other action, shows how much Gabrielle had changed. She could do something for the greater good, that she couldn't justify as a "good" act. >>Before I finish up I would like to also mention Joe Doluca's score, which was outstanding especially in the final battle scene. >> Amen to that. He really captured the mood of some of the scenes and really heightened some of the drama. >>Well that's it for today. I hope those who missed me - if there is anyone - enjoy this weeks review. Nice to havt them back and any excuse to watch such a really good episode. :-) Ann ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 May 2003 19:24:07 -0400 (EDT) From: cjlnh@webtv.net (Cheryl LaScola) Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Xena Season 1 dvd - the details on thebonus disc offe... I must say after reading Sharon's explanations about the lack of lost scenes, more bloopers or cutting room edits I was depressed to think all the series material has been published. All I can say is keep the coffee talks coming.... and if possible expand the coffee talk sessions beyond a scripted dialog & have them talk to us about how things are going in their real life too, without giving away really personal information...just a suggestion. C ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ End of chakram-refugees-digest V3 #123 **************************************