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Subject: chakram-refugees-digest V3 #2
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chakram-refugees-digest   Saturday, January 4 2003   Volume 03 : Number 002



                               Today's Subjects:
                               -----------------
  Re: [chakram-refugees] <<Coming Home>>               [cr <cr@orcon.net.nz>]
  Re: [chakram-refugees] RE: Flirty Xena               [cr <cr@orcon.net.nz>]
  Re: [chakram-refugees] <<Eternal Bounds>>            [cr <cr@orcon.net.nz>]
  [chakram-refugees] Re: [Flawless] Chakram #20              [IfeRae@aol.com]
  [chakram-refugees] Re: [Flawless] Chakram #20-- Oops       [IfeRae@aol.com]
  Re: [chakram-refugees] RE: Flirty Xena                     [IfeRae@aol.com]
  [chakram-refugees] xena visors/hats POLL  ["Creation (Sharon Delaney)" <ou]
  [chakram-refugees] Re: [Flawless] xena visors/hats POLL  ["Creation (Sharo]
  Re: [chakram-refugees] RE: Flirty Xena  ["Cheryl Ande" <cande@sunlink.net>]
  [chakram-refugees] Tsianina Joelson sighting  [mirrordrum <aemoses@comcast]

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 19:24:10 +1300
From: cr <cr@orcon.net.nz>
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] <<Coming Home>>

On Friday 03 January 2003 12:31, Cheryl Ande wrote:

>
> " Xena could always tell these things....    remember how she could always
> tell  when Ares was around?   Obviously it works for the Furies, too."
>
> Well not always.  She only figured out the Furies were in Gabrielle's head
> after she fractured her skull - it would saved herself< Gabby and Eve a
> world of hurt if she could have sensed The Furies a little sooner.

Hmm, yes, you're right.    I'd forgotten about that.    Maybe it's only Ares 
that Xena's so sensitive to, and that's why Xena could tell the Furies were 
haunting him but not Gabs.   (Ares-Xena-shippers do a little dance while the 
subtexters glower with disapproval of the idea  :)

Sorry, I didn't intend to go down that road, it just happened   :(

>
> "I did like Queen Marga's performance in that scene. "
>
> I liked Queen Marga also.  I was sorry to see here go in Dangerous Prey.
> Apparently the Amazon's have the bad luck of loosing their best queens.

It seems to be one of the risks of the job.   Terreis, Melosa, Velasca, 
Ephiny, Marga, have I missed anybody out?   ;)

And yes, I was sad when she was killed in DP.  I thought she was far more 
regal than Varia. 

>
> " I thought it blew them up, actually."
>
> I though they blew-up when their heads were cut off.

I'd have to slow-mo that to be certain.   

>
>  "  That was the first occasion, IIRC,  when the chacky developed
> superpowers.    That is, on every previous
> occasion, its flight could be accounted for by a series of bounces (even if
> impossibly long and complex like Been There Done That), but this time, it
> was  just gone too long."
>
> It did linger out there for a bit.  I assumed it was just careening off
> rocks - they were up in the mountains.  So perhpas Xena figured out just
> how long she was going to play with Ares before she let him knock into the
> pond and then drown.  Knowing once she was dead the Furies would leave Ares
> to gloat the chakram then could return (don't ask how she would know just
> where they would stand to that gloating because I don't know).

When you consider all the difficulties with that approach - particularly the 
timing - I think it just becomes simpler to assume its a 'magic' chacky.

>
> " I'm inclined to think, Greek Amazons."
>
> You are obvious right but it doesn't explain where Marga got Gabby's
> antlers - perhaps they were a gift from Cyane who thought they looked
> really stupid on Gabrielle so sent them off as a diplomatic gift.

I'd just put it down to a minor YAXI from the Recycled Props Department.   

Where did Gabby get the antlers from?   It wasn't the deer she shot in Them 
Bones, because that had full antlers, IIRC.    Did Gabs just inherit them 
from Cyane in Kindred Spirits?   

OK, next question, they weren't by any chance the Bambi antlers that Xena was 
wearing as part of her cossie in Sin Trade?   D'you suppose, right after Sin 
Trade ended, the Ewokazons got hold of Xena's cossie and incorporated the 
antlers as part of their queen's regalia?    I do like the idea.   

More viewing necessary!    (Grabs stack of tapes and heads for the VCR....)

cr
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Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 00:20:43 +1300
From: cr <cr@orcon.net.nz>
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] RE: Flirty Xena

On Friday 03 January 2003 13:00, Cheryl Ande wrote:
> I have been following the Xena and her lack of lovers thread and I do agree
> that Xena as a character has a lot of psychological reason for being a
> little leery about sexual encounters  but I think from a practical point of
> view there were good reasons for keeping Xena a bit reticent about getting
> Xena romantically involved too often.   First as much we may not like it
> there is a different standard for woman than for men.  Hercules or Iolus
> could have the girl of the week and we see that as an indication of their
> manliness.  Now reverse that, if Xena and Gabrielle were off with a
> different guy each week we have a pretty icky feeling that our gals were
> just a tad immoral if not trampy.  

Every week might be a bit much, but I'd regard it as just an interesting role 
reversal if Xena had the occasional guy tagging along.   And not trampy at 
all, IMO.

> Sexual relations for a woman usually
> must be tied to strong romantic feelings - Gabrielle married Perdicus,
> Marcus was Xena true love (for that season), Ulysses wanted to stay with
> her, even Borias tried his damnest to "make an honest woman" of her once a
> child was on the way.   Promiscuous sex and being a female hero and role
> model hardly go hand in hand in television land.  

Not fair, is it?

> Also I think it would
> have gotten pretty boring after a while if every week we had our gals
> mooning after some guy each week.  

Well no, I don't see Xena as mooning after anybody.   (This is why I get 
peeved when Xena goes mooning after Gabs!  :)       I don't mind guys mooning 
after her.   I would.  ;)

cr
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Date: Sat, 4 Jan 2003 00:22:51 +1300
From: cr <cr@orcon.net.nz>
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] <<Eternal Bounds>>

On Friday 03 January 2003 08:43, KTL wrote:
> >
> > Now was it you, or someone else, who said they had a big problem with
> > that particular battle, in terms of Xena managing to defeat the enemy?  
> > <vbeg>
> >
> > cr
>
> Yup, because of the bogus extension of time they gave her AFTER Ares
> snapped them all back to the present.

(Rest snipped)

OK, I see what you mean.  Point conceded.  ;)

cr
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Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 12:29:38 EST
From: IfeRae@aol.com
Subject: [chakram-refugees] Re: [Flawless] Chakram #20

In a message dated 1/2/03 3:03:11 PM Central Standard Time, 
fsktl@aurora.uaf.edu writes:

<< There's a great new picture of Lucy and Rob in Chakram 20.
 
 Happily, Mary D has it posted on her site:
 
 http://ausxip.com/lawless/picturearchive/robandlucy/cal2003P030.jpg
 
 I love this shot. This is just such a great partner picture to me.>>

Hmmm, I think it's also on one of the two 2003 calendars I recently received.
 
 <<The reason I'm happy to see them so happy is that this is the duo who
 brought us Xena, the person who created her and spun her story and the
 person who brought her to life. And I shall be eternally grateful to
 them. What an incredible achievement-and how kewl it must be for them to
 know that they did it together. What a bonus to have been able to create
 such a incredible character who became an iconic emblem of powerful women
 everywhere. And doing so while working with the person you love. Way cool.
  >>

Yep.  I was never one for faery tales or romance novels, so Lucy's life is 
the closest I'll get.  I certainly don't mean to suggest she didn't work damn 
hard for what she's got, or that she hasn't had her share of pain along the 
way.  But when I picture a little girl dreaming of one day being famous, 
meeting the partner of her dreams, having a big family, hoping she'll always 
dare to follow her heart, and making a positive impact on other people, I 
can't help but be happy that her fantasy came true.  

That photo reminds me that, somewhere in his psyche, Rob probably fantasized 
about Xena/Lucy.  I laughed when I read somewhere that, early on, he thought 
Lucy was a bit too over the top.  Apparently, he needed/wanted that, just as 
Lucy needed/wanted him to ground her and help make her dreams real.  What a 
wonderful combination.  And, yes, what makes it all so special to me as that 
I got to share the fruits of that -- both in the their real-life 
accomplishments and in the fantasy world they created for me to play in.

- -- Ife
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Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 12:34:55 EST
From: IfeRae@aol.com
Subject: [chakram-refugees] Re: [Flawless] Chakram #20-- Oops

Crap!  Sorry about posting to the wrong list.

- -- Ife
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Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 14:18:27 EST
From: IfeRae@aol.com
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] RE: Flirty Xena

In a message dated 1/2/03 5:59:22 PM Central Standard Time, cande@sunlink.net 
writes:

<<  First as much we may not like it there is a
 different standard for woman than for men.  Hercules or Iolus could have the
 girl of the week and we see that as an indication of their manliness.  Now
 reverse that, if Xena and Gabrielle were off with a different guy each week 
we
 have a pretty icky feeling that our gals were just a tad immoral if not
 trampy.  Sexual relations for a woman usually must be tied to strong romantic
 feelings >>

I'm not sure how much that influenced Herc/Xena.  Indeed, I think they 
intentionally went against such standards. I didn't watch Herc much, but of 
what I saw, the strong, respectful feelings in his liaisons seemed very much 
tied to his heroic, "manly" character.  With Xena, they certainly expanded 
the range of liaisons that could be shown of a female hero -- some purely 
physical or strategic (Borias, Caesar), some as casual or affectionate 
dalliances (possibly Marcus, Draco, Rafe), others with potentially deeper 
ties (Petracles, Ulysses, Antony).  

I agree that Reformed Xena was not shown as having a bunch of different 
liaisons.  I simply never felt her sexual nature was denied or romanticized 
or ruled by a double standard.  She seemed capable of using sex if she had to 
and free to engage in it if she wanted, but *chose* to be caring and 
respectful as what was "right" for her.  I guess I view what we saw as more a 
function of the action format and concept of her character, and that the same 
was true of how TPTB dealt with Herc's relationships.

- -- Ife
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Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 12:00:26 -0800
From: "Creation (Sharon Delaney)" <outback@creationent.com>
Subject: [chakram-refugees] xena visors/hats POLL

Okay, we're getting together new products for the Pasadena convention --
which will also be for regular sale after that weekend -- and someone
suggested visors.  Does everyone know what they are?  You know, those hats
without tops, just brims to keep the sun off your eyes.  Is this an item
people would want?  There would be one with a Xena-style logo and one for
Gabrielle.

We're also putting the same logos on hats as well.  We're making the hats
out of denim this year.  Is that a material you would like?

I'll be turning in the results of the poll on Monday, Dec. 6.

Sharon
Official Xena Fan Club
Creation Ent.
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Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 13:19:56 -0800
From: "Creation (Sharon Delaney)" <outback@creationent.com>
Subject: [chakram-refugees] Re: [Flawless] xena visors/hats POLL

>> I'll be turning in the results of the poll on Monday, Dec. 6.<
>
>Er, I think you mean Jan?<g>


Oops -- yeah, that's what I meant <blush>
Sharon
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Date: Fri, 3 Jan 2003 18:45:55 -0500
From: "Cheryl Ande" <cande@sunlink.net>
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] RE: Flirty Xena

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "cr" <cr@orcon.net.nz>

" Well no, I don't see Xena as mooning after anybody.   (This is why I get
peeved when Xena goes mooning after Gabs!  :)       I don't mind guys
mooning  after her.   I would.  ;)"

Actually that would have been interesting.  We always had some girl just
falling head over heels for Hercules or Captain Kirk.  It would have been
nice to see guys just swooning after Xena and she just goes about her
business with a quick kiss and a pat on the fanny for the infatuated guy.

CherylA
>
> cr
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Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2003 20:15:46 -0500
From: mirrordrum <aemoses@comcast.net>
Subject: [chakram-refugees] Tsianina Joelson sighting

my partner taped the CSI ep <caged> last night and showed me a small bit in 
it with TJ as a victim. i thought she did quite well. maybe a minute of 
screen time, but it was a very dramatic minute. <G> she looks good.

md

No more victims. No war on Iraq.

http://www.afsc.org/
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End of chakram-refugees-digest V3 #2
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