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Subject: chakram-refugees-digest V2 #256
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chakram-refugees-digest  Tuesday, September 17 2002  Volume 02 : Number 256



                               Today's Subjects:
                               -----------------
  Re: [chakram-refugees] Season Four       [cjlnh@webtv.net (Cheryl LaScola)]
  [chakram-refugees] Xena on Oxygen        [cjlnh@webtv.net (Cheryl LaScola)]
  [chakram-refugees] whose riding whose coattails?  [KTL <fsktl@aurora.uaf.e]
  Re: [chakram-refugees] Xena Fan Club Kit #6 SURVEY   [cr <cr@orcon.net.nz>]
  Re: [chakram-refugees] whose riding whose coattails?  [cr <cr@orcon.net.nz]
  [chakram-refugees] Xena on DVD                        [<cande@sunlink.net>]
  [chakram-refugees] <<Deja Vu All Over Again>>         [<cande@sunlink.net>]
  Re: [chakram-refugees] whose riding whose coattails?       [IfeRae@aol.com]
  Re: [chakram-refugees] whose riding whose coattails?       [IfeRae@aol.com]
  Re: [chakram-refugees] <<Deja Vu All Over Again>>          [IfeRae@aol.com]
  [chakram-refugees] Creation web site problems UPDATE  ["Creation (Sharon D]
  Re: [chakram-refugees] Gina Torres in Firefly    [meredith <meth@smoe.org>]
  Re: [chakram-refugees] whose riding whose coattails?  [meredith <meth@smoe]
  Re: [chakram-refugees] whose riding whose coattails?       [IfeRae@aol.com]

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 00:45:30 -0400 (EDT)
From: cjlnh@webtv.net (Cheryl LaScola)
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Season Four

I also thought Season 4 (and three) were some of the best performances
delivered by Lucy and Renee.  I actually started watching the show
during season 4 and played catch up (on USA reruns).  I thought maybe
the reason it was my favorite was that was the storyline that pulled me
in as a fan.

But the more I think about it now, it is the depth of character that was
layered into season 3 & 4 that amazed me.  I know some fans turned away
because it got darker. but I think it just got more realistic in their
development of the characters.  Their emotions jumped out of the TV and
into our hearts....everything was harder, choices were more difficult
and had life altering consequences.  For me, it went from a campy
fantasy show to a story about characters we grew to care about.  And it
dealt with morality in a very real way.  There are no right and wrong
choices without consequences.

In one way the whole series from episode one led up to a common
theme..only through love and forgiveness do we find our true way... in
this life and the next.  Yet forgiveness is one of the hardest virtues
to maintain.  It is easy to forgive those we love, much harder with
enemies that have hurt us  (Gabby's forgiveness of Callisto at the end
of "A Necessary Evil").
That was something Xena struggled with, especially forgiving herself.

Anyway, season 4 made you think about issues bigger than ourselves, yet
part of life's choices every day.  I guess that is why I will always be
a fan of this show.  There never will be anything wuite like it again, I
think......
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 00:52:38 -0400 (EDT)
From: cjlnh@webtv.net (Cheryl LaScola)
Subject: [chakram-refugees] Xena on Oxygen

For those of you lucky enough to catch Xena in reruns on Oxygen, the
network has changed the schedule yet again.

I don't know if it will help to write to them, but I just gave them my 2
cents.  They have moved the 11 pm slot out to 1 am, and for those of us
who have to get up and go to work in the morining, that is just too late
for most of us.

I asked them if they would consider that Xena's fan base is mostly adult
and if you use late night times at least make those on weekends.  M-F
should be sometime between 7-11 if you ask me as the 6 pm is really hard
to get home in time for.  Anyway, you can wirte to them @
www.oxygen.com, ckick on Xena and chat.  Go to the "Tell Us"  section.

There must be fan power in numbers!!

Thanks,
Cheryl
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Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 23:19:01 -0800 (AKDT)
From: KTL <fsktl@aurora.uaf.edu>
Subject: [chakram-refugees] whose riding whose coattails?

Oh, MONTHS ago Ife wrote:

>
>  >  And Xena seemed to like Gabrielle's scrolls, once she read them.
So, what's good enough
>  > for Xena is good enough for me.  Nanananana.  Heh.


Thel replied:

>
>  Ack!   Can't disagree without belittling Xena's literary tastes.  Oh the
> pain
>   :(>>
>

Ife answered:

> Ayup.  Sneaky, huh?  I trust KT will get around this, possibly with something
> like, "Xena didn't want to hurt Gab's feelings," or, "Xena's liking the
> writer personally isn't necessarily a reflection on her tastes regarding the
> writing," or, "So, she read the scrolls to baby Eve.  What does that prove,
> except that maybe Eve liked the sound of Xena's voice?"  or, "Pfff, so what?
> I've always said I like that Xena wasn't perfect."  Oh, the angst of having
> some sense of what's inside KT's head.  <g>
>

Why how nice--I don't even have to be around to have typical replies
sent to the list...

And from another reply on this topic, Ife wrote:


>Quite honestly, I thought one of the issues was whether or not Gab was
>appreciated in her own time by other Greeks.   Whether those listeners
>had good taste or not wasn't the point of my comments.  I was simply
>saying there seemed to be evidence that she appealed to a variety of
>audiences, even some presented as knowledgeable.    Again, I couldn't
>care less, since her words (however well written) were the supposed basis
>for Xena's legend.


No, no, no.  This is totally backwards.  Xena was famous WAY before she
met the little blond kid. Well, infamous, actually.

So Xena was a hot topic all over Greece.  Hell, even parts of the
unknown world like Chin and Japa and Scandinavi, etc. etc. etc. know of
her and loathed her.

By selecting Xena as her topic, Gabrielle ENSURED that her scrolls would
be read.  Nobody ever said the little blond kid wasn't clever.

KT
wink
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 20:42:59 +1200
From: cr <cr@orcon.net.nz>
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Xena Fan Club Kit #6 SURVEY

On Monday 16 September 2002 09:56, H.J.J. Hewitt wrote:
> >Having the same content on both VHS and DVD would be to throw away
> >the advatanges of the new technology.
>
> In what way?

For example, the commentary track on the Friend in Need DVD, which can't be 
done on tape (unless they made two tapes).    That's the sort of extra 
content you can get on DVD.

There are other advantages of DVD - like quick tracking to a selected point 
on the disk, and the fact that you can replay a scene or sit on 'still' 
indefinitely without wearing out the tape - but of course those advantages 
aren't related to Michael Klossner's comment.

> >Why do that when millions of
> >people already own DVD machines and discs?
>
> Because millions also don't?

That was my immediate reaction too, almost word for word  - but it kinda 
missed the point of MK's statement.   

I'm usually the first to demand that 'older' technology be catered for, I 
stubbornly refuse to buy the latest whizz-bang computers just so I can run 
the latest miracle bloatware, BUT so far as DVD is concerned, it does have 
major advantages over tape.   This is specially the case if you rent from 
your local video store, the quality of old rental tapes is best not talked 
about  :(

(It also has disadvantages, the biggest one at the moment being that you 
can't use your DVD player to record your own DVD's.   So VCR's are still very 
necessary).

cr
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 22:39:26 +1200
From: cr <cr@orcon.net.nz>
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] whose riding whose coattails?

On Monday 16 September 2002 19:19, KTL wrote:

> Ife answered:
> > Ayup.  Sneaky, huh?  I trust KT will get around this, possibly with
> > something like, "Xena didn't want to hurt Gab's feelings," or, "Xena's
> > liking the writer personally isn't necessarily a reflection on her tastes
> > regarding the writing," or, "So, she read the scrolls to baby Eve.  What
> > does that prove, except that maybe Eve liked the sound of Xena's voice?" 
> > or, "Pfff, so what? I've always said I like that Xena wasn't perfect." 
> > Oh, the angst of having some sense of what's inside KT's head.  <g>

Don't I know it.   Sometimes I know *exactly* what's going on in KT's head 
'cos it's going on in mine too.     Sometimes I'm not sure if I'm me or KT.

Ummm, the only way I can tell us apart is to put WFC on the video.   If I 
don't mind it, I'm me.   If I *hate* it, I'm KT.      ;)

> Why how nice--I don't even have to be around to have typical replies
> sent to the list...


Well we never know when you're going to disappear or for how long.   Maybe we 
just need to take turns at being KT to cover your absence?   ;-)


(snip)

>
> By selecting Xena as her topic, Gabrielle ENSURED that her scrolls would
> be read.  Nobody ever said the little blond kid wasn't clever.

Oh I love ya KT!   Beautifully argued!    No wonder Xena couldn't shake off 
the little blond limpet - I mean, kid.    Gabby knew a meal ticket when she 
saw one.   ;)

cr
(... or is it KT?     Looks outside...  any snow?  No.  OK, I'm not KT   :)
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 08:58:12 -0400
From: <cande@sunlink.net>
Subject: [chakram-refugees] Xena on DVD

Now I was over at MaryD's site and she had blurb up by Lunacy saying she got a
call from Panzar Davis selling season 1 on DVD to be shipped in 6 - 8 weeks. 
I wrote Sharon to see if Creations has decided on making any DVDs with
commentaries and she said nothing has been decided yet.  So maybe Creations if
they decide to do it could start at 6 with Panzar Davis startint at 1 or they
could work together (slim chance there) but now I'm rambling - BYE.

CherylA
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 13:13:07 -0400
From: <cande@sunlink.net>
Subject: [chakram-refugees] <<Deja Vu All Over Again>>

#
#
#
#
#
#


I'm a little out of order here.  Ides should have been next but I'm going to
watch again so I thought I'd do Deja now.

Again this was a more enjoyable episode than I remembered.  I still have real
problems with it but I laughed and it was a nice antidote to the grime Ides.

A lot of credit goes to ROC's direction and Lucy's Annie for making this
episode work.  ROC had some clever ideas.  I like Annie meeting up Joan of Arc
and her snide remarks after being bested in a sword fight ("Rude even for a
French woman.  Yeah saint jezz").  She also diected a nice fight scene with
Ares - I liked Harry using the umbrella as a sword and the paperwieght as a
baseball.  She also get credit for making three rather unpleasant characters
somewhat sympathetic.  Her only real misstep was when Harry socks Annie to
stop her from attacking the bomb with her teeth - it looked mean.  Annie just
got done telling Harry off and the punched seemed more in retaliation for that
than just a device to stop Annie.  It certainly would have been better for
Matties to slug Annie (after all Gabby was always hitting Joxer) with Harry
protesting a bit.

Lucy Lawless was having a ball as Annie.  I loved her agonized lament as she
found out she was Joxer in her past.  She was able to bring a touch of
sweetness to the character as she leaves Harry to rediscover his soulmate. 
Then she is wonderfully resiliant as she sings her brave little Annie song at
the end - did you ever notice Lucy has very sexy walk as to walks down the
street at the end.  ROC is good as Mattie but there is more Janice here than
Gabrielle.  Ted Raimi, however, really misses as Xena.  He said that to play
Xena he was just mean and it tells.  I think Xena would be skeptical about
past lives therapy, impatient and even insensative but I don't think of her as
mean.  His confrontation with Ares really suffers when he tries to ape LL
inflection and attitude - he just can't do it.

Now the real problem is with R. J. Stewart's script.  Does anyone believe
Xena, and Gabrielle would be reincarnated as Harry and Mattie.  Last time we
saw their reincarnations they were repectively the Mother of Peace and a
gallant prince.  What happened?!  Did Amenestra and Shati clean out the
kingdom's treasury and go off to Tahiti together in order to come back as a
nasty boyfriend and a con woman.  Can you really believe Gabrielle as a
conwoman - a sincere dippy hippy past lives consulor yes but not as a thief. 
Harry is just plain abusive to Annie and I don't think Xena would be that
nasty to someone she has chosen to live with (now no rift comments here -
Annie didn't get any sons killed here).  R.J. dide a beautiful soliloquoy for
Mattie which ROC did beautifully with a nice selection clips.

I also though all the relationships were off.  Shouldn't Joxer as Annie have
some kind of affection for Mattie.  Certainly Annie who is familar with the TV
series should know Joxer has crush on Gabby shouldn't least acknowledge this
Would Xena (Harry)really be attracted to Joxer (Annie) sexually (they were
living together)?  Why is Annie (Joxer) kind of ogoling Ares at the end - did
Joxer have a thing for Ares (maybe I am still reeling for the discovery of
Ares/Joxer fan fiction).  It sort gives you headache if you think about long
enough.

Anyway I did enjoy R. J. 's digs at the series.  Mattie's dismissal of Xena as
chop-socky and Marco's deft critique of the show as melodrama on week and
Three Stoodges the next and way too serialzed to boot.  TPTB have sense a
humor about themselves.

Next post will be the stunning The Ides Of March.

CherylA
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 15:06:08 EDT
From: IfeRae@aol.com
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] whose riding whose coattails?

In a message dated 9/16/2002 2:19:31 AM Central Daylight Time, 
fsktl@aurora.uaf.edu writes:

> Ife wrote:
>  
>  
>  >Quite honestly, I thought one of the issues was whether or not Gab was
>  >appreciated in her own time by other Greeks.   Whether those listeners
>  >had good taste or not wasn't the point of my comments.  I was simply
>  >saying there seemed to be evidence that she appealed to a variety of
>  >audiences, even some presented as knowledgeable.    Again, I couldn't
>  >care less, since her words (however well written) were the supposed basis
>  >for Xena's legend.
>  
>  
>  No, no, no.  This is totally backwards.  Xena was famous WAY before she
>  met the little blond kid. Well, infamous, actually.
>  
>  So Xena was a hot topic all over Greece.  Hell, even parts of the
>  unknown world like Chin and Japa and Scandinavi, etc. etc. etc. know of
>  her and loathed her.
>  
>  By selecting Xena as her topic, Gabrielle ENSURED that her scrolls would
>  be read.  Nobody ever said the little blond kid wasn't clever.

LOL!  Agreed.  I meant that her scrolls were the presumed basis for *our* 
being able to appreciate the legend.  Tappy et al just adapted them for the 
screen.  <g.

- -- Ife
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 15:06:10 EDT
From: IfeRae@aol.com
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] whose riding whose coattails?

In a message dated 9/16/2002 4:10:16 AM Central Daylight Time, 
cr@orcon.net.nz writes:

> 
>  > Why how nice--I don't even have to be around to have typical replies
>  > sent to the list...
>  
>  
>  Well we never know when you're going to disappear or for how long.   Maybe 
> we 
>  just need to take turns at being KT to cover your absence?   ;-)
>  
>  

Oh, excellent idea!  We write/see stuff we know she's going to have something 
to say about, then have to wait weeks to read her response.  How about I take 
on the comments she'll probably make about Gabrielle?  Which ones would you 
like?  Any other volunteers?  

- -- Ife
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 15:06:20 EDT
From: IfeRae@aol.com
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] <<Deja Vu All Over Again>>

In a message dated 9/16/2002 12:13:59 PM Central Daylight Time, 
cande@sunlink.net writes:

>  Does anyone believe
>  Xena, and Gabrielle would be reincarnated as Harry and Mattie.  Last time 
we
>  saw their reincarnations they were repectively the Mother of Peace and a
>  gallant prince.  What happened?!  Did Amenestra and Shati clean out the
>  kingdom's treasury and go off to Tahiti together in order to come back as a
>  nasty boyfriend and a con woman.  Can you really believe Gabrielle as a
>  conwoman - a sincere dippy hippy past lives consulor yes but not as a 
thief. 
> 

LOL!  Maybe it had to do with the lost scroll.  Things weren't as they should 
be until the scroll was found and destroyed?

- -- Ife
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 14:41:20 -0700
From: "Creation (Sharon Delaney)" <outback@creationent.com>
Subject: [chakram-refugees] Creation web site problems UPDATE

I can't place an order from my office computer yet either
*sigh*  Still bugs in the system.

I've got all the messages people are sending.  I've forwarded the
individual order check queries to the order dept to look up.

They're still making major software changes over this week and when they're
done, I'll make a post.  If people still have problems at that time, we'll
deal with them individually.

Sharon
outback@creationent.com
Creation Ent.
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 21:21:06 -0400
From: meredith <meth@smoe.org>
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Gina Torres in Firefly

Hi,

Boeotian reminded:

>My local TV schedule says that Firefly, a Fox TV series beginning on
>Friday, produced by Joss Wheon of Buffy, co-stars Gina Torres.

It does indeed!  It's on at 8 pm Eastern time.

As I said a little while ago, don't blink of you might miss it.  Joss 
Whedon may be a god, but there's only so much he can do to keep a show on 
the air at Fox, the network of incomprehensible scheduling decisions.


==============================================
Meredith Tarr
New Haven, CT USA
mailto:meth@smoe.org
http://www.smoe.org/meth
==============================================
Live At The House O'Muzak House Concert Series
http://muzak.smoe.org
NEXT UP: Annie Gallup, Saturday, 9/28 at 8 pm
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 21:30:21 -0400
From: meredith <meth@smoe.org>
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] whose riding whose coattails?

Hi,

Ife proposed:

>Oh, excellent idea!  We write/see stuff we know she's going to have something
>to say about, then have to wait weeks to read her response.  How about I take
>on the comments she'll probably make about Gabrielle?  Which ones would you
>like?  Any other volunteers?

<snort>

Anybody have a simple bot script?  We could create a KT bot and have it 
auto-respond at regular intervals.  It'd be great!  <g>


==============================================
Meredith Tarr
New Haven, CT USA
mailto:meth@smoe.org
http://www.smoe.org/meth
==============================================
Live At The House O'Muzak House Concert Series
http://muzak.smoe.org
NEXT UP: Annie Gallup, Saturday, 9/28 at 8 pm
==============================================
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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 23:20:34 EDT
From: IfeRae@aol.com
Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] whose riding whose coattails?

In a message dated 09/16/2002 8:33:15 PM Central Daylight Time, meth@smoe.org 
writes:

<< Ife proposed:
 
 >Oh, excellent idea!  We write/see stuff we know she's going to have 
something
 >to say about, then have to wait weeks to read her response.  How about I 
take
 >on the comments she'll probably make about Gabrielle?  Which ones would you
 >like?  Any other volunteers?
 
 <snort>
 
 Anybody have a simple bot script?  We could create a KT bot and have it 
 auto-respond at regular intervals.  It'd be great!  <g> >>

First, let's make sure CR retains credit for this original idea.  OK, maybe I 
kinda helped him to it, but I wanna make sure KT goes after ... um, I mean 
... compliments him first.  Heh.  

Now, as to the KT bot, don't we still have to create the script for it?  Or 
has maybe someone recorded some of KT's classics on tape?  Personally, I'm 
not keen on the auto-response aspect.  I'd rather we categorize the responses 
so they can be tailored for the appropriate situation.  Some would be fairly 
easy, like the ones extolling Lucy/Xena (e.g., "Lucy rocks!", "Xena rocks!," 
"Gabrielle?  Was she in that scene?")  I think CR and I could handle those, 
given our slight bias for the warrior.  What I like about this is that KT can 
save herself for those wonderful "I've been thinking and reviewing the eps" 
pieces, instead of keeping up with two-month old posts.  

- -- Ife (busy checking out plastic surgeons)
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End of chakram-refugees-digest V2 #256
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