From: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org (chakram-refugees-digest) To: chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Subject: chakram-refugees-digest V1 #53 Reply-To: chakram-refugees@smoe.org Sender: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk chakram-refugees-digest Wednesday, November 28 2001 Volume 01 : Number 053 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [chakram-refugees] <> [cr > [cr ] Re: [chakram-refugees] <> [Mark & Denise > [cr ] Re: [chakram-refugees] <> [IfeRae@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 16:56:43 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] <> On Tuesday 27 November 2001 12:14, Cheryl Ande wrote: > @ > @ > @ > @ > @ > @ > @ > @ > @ > > On rewatching Warrior ...Princess one of the things that struck me the most > was what a good actress LL is. She really did a good job in creating a > character very different from Xena in Princess Diane without going straying > over into caricature. As Diane her mannerisms, voice and even her poster > is different. She has wonderful comic timing also - her flight from > Gabrielle's erstwhile robber is very funny. It's also fun watch Gabrielle > being the mature one in the duo for once. Overall very good episode > especially when you can contemplate what Lucy will do with her other > doppelgangers in the future. (I think Warrior... Priestess... Tramp is > really the comic masterpiece of Xena because of LL's mastery of > characterization). It also has my favourite Xena line in it (well, one of them anyway) - "I like dark". But IMO Warrior...PRINcess...Tramp is the best of those comedies (notwithstanding that Leah in the cave lecturing X & G on morals in Priestess cracked me up). > A Royal Couple of Thieves introduces Xena to Autolycus. LL and Bruce > Campbell have a nice comic chemistry but I never saw much romantic sparks > there. This is of course a homage to Raiders of The Lost Arc ( it seems > the ancient Hebrews just can't seem to hang on to that thing although I'll > have an Oxygen moment and throw in some unless information - it seems there > is a theory that the Arc is in a church in Ethiopia spirited there during > the destruction of the temple). Anyway Lucy dances again badly but you do > see a hint of the Gurkhan dance there (thank God TPTB finally hired a good > chorographer in season 6). I liked BC here very much - I got a little > tired of him by time season 4 rolled around because I think a little of him > goes a long way. Anyway very enjoyable episode with a lot of snappy dialog. > > CherylA You know you're just 2 days ahead of us here in NZ - Fistful of Dinars screens tonight, Warrior..Princess tomorrow night. I *loved* Royal Couple of Thieves - maybe my favourite comedy. Auto kept trying to get one-up on Xena and she kept outsmarting him - or maybe they were trying to get one up on each other. Right from the start where Auto untied his hands while Xena was under the table tying his laces together - they were both just so good. That dance you mentioned - gotta love the way Xena stops for a moment to listen for the sound of the guy she put the pinch on hitting the floor. As far as the Raiders comparison goes, Renpics 'ark' weapon was simpler but way, way more stylish and effective than Raiders' ark was. IMO. Thelonius ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 17:22:01 +1200 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] <> On Tuesday 27 November 2001 12:43, Cheryl Ande wrote: > @ > @ > @ > @ > > @ > @ > @ > > @ > @ > I have now watched the director's cut twice thanks to Lynn and viewed the > original once again thanks to Panzar Davis (the Panzar Davis tape is much > clear than the original broadcast especial in the teahouse scenes - I > thought those scene were very fuzzy when I first saw them). Anyway I'm a > little torn about the value of the longer version. First off I do think > the director's makes the plot a little clearer. The introduction of enemy > general at Herguchi does show that he respects Xena as an adversary. Also > I liked the fact the "where you go I go" theme was developed in the first > scenes and carried through to the end. I also thought the expanded fight > scene if the forest was pretty nifty and showed that Xena was real threat > to the Japa army and the use of the arrow barrage was necessary to bring > her down. Also I liked the expanded Gabrielle and samurai scenes. > Gabrielle comes off tougher and more competent. > > The big change of course was in the expanded scene with Xena and Akemi > where Akemi, supposedly, tells Xena about avenging the 40,000. This does > clear up one point that a lot of people complained about. It shows that > Xena did not send Gabrielle off on a fools errand - Xena has every > confidence that Gabrielle will succeed and restore her to life. What it > doesn't do is make the reason why Xena has to stay dead any clearer. Why > does Xena believe Akemi? The Ghostkiller and the young monk apparently > didn't know about this rule because they sent Gabrielle off on her quest to > restore Xena to life. So for those who a really bothered by this point the > director's cut is no help. OK - why shouldn't Xena believe Akemi? What motive would Akemi have for lying about that? > I however did like the idea of Xena being able > to pop into a bird's body. I read that in one of the draft scripts that were circulating a while back - not realising it had actually made it to filming - and I thought it sounded too improbable or fanciful to work. But reading about it and seeing it on screen are two very different things. One thing the drafts I saw did have diferently - Xena explained to Gabs quite some time before the final fight that she would have to stay dead - I think that would have turned the final Yodoshi fight into an anticlimax. The other thing the draft scripts did make much more obvious, was Xena's motivation in seeking for redemption - in fact she explicitly said so IIRC. I don't know if that made it into the Director's Cut though. > I can only hope some fan fiction writer used > this idea - I can see Xena being Gabrielle's horse or a wolf when Gabby > needs help. > > The other big change from my point of view is the final scene. We no > longer have the final shot being Gabrielle alone on the boat. Now the > final shot is of Xena and Gabrielle together. I understand why TPTB > re-edited the ending - it certainly softens the impact of Gabrielle going > off on her own with only the spirit of Xena as her companion. So now we > have Xena and Gabrielle still as companions. I, however, liked the ending > as it originally aired. Gabrielle is now the hero in her own right. She > will always have Xena's spirit beside her but her journey will be her own. I agree about the ending (haven't seen DC yet, but I've read enough description to make a guess ;) It does soften (weaken?) the ending, but I thought the original ending worked fine. It was very sad, but IMO in keeping with the rest of the episode. There were some complaints that the final scene 'didn't make sense' - i.e. was Xena really there, was she a spirit or what? I don't think the DC ending makes any difference in that respect. (Myself, I think it was Xena's spirirt and the ending certainly made sense to me). > Overall once you see the director's cut you do miss the added footage when > you see the original. However I don't think it's going to change anyone's > feelings about the ending. IF you liked it you will still like it if you > didn't you still won't. > > CherylA ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 00:05:03 -0600 From: Mark & Denise Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] <> > I *loved* Royal Couple of Thieves - maybe my favourite comedy. Auto kept > trying to get one-up on Xena and she kept outsmarting him - or maybe they > were trying to get one up on each other. Right from the start where Auto > untied his hands while Xena was under the table tying his laces together - > they were both just so good. I too really enjoyed BC in this ep. Liked him in all the eps for that matter. I tried "Jack of All Trades" a couple of times, but that was just a bit too much 'Bruce'! > That dance you mentioned - gotta love the way Xena stops for a moment to > listen for the sound of the the pinch > guy she puton hitting the floor. Oh good... another excuse to hit the season one tapes again!! I never caught that before. I gotta say too, I really liked the lead in with all the 'walking the wire' Xena did above the streets as she chased Auto! Mark ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 00:50:20 -0600 From: "H.J.J. Hewitt" Subject: [chakram-refugees] XWP = LOTR report 11/27 I've made a start on the XWP=LOTR correspondence list... just the LOTR so far... and come across the following discrepancies in the imdb.com data. The first is for different segments, but the 2nd is not. Sure hope it turns out to be Jay for both. Nathaniel Lees Uglzk [FotR] Jay Laga'aia Uglzk, Chief of the Uruk-hai [TT] Jay Laga'aia Lurtz [FotR] Lawrence Makoare Lurtz [FotR] TEXena ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 21:57:10 +1300 From: cr Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] <> On Tuesday 27 November 2001 19:05, Mark & Denise wrote: > > I *loved* Royal Couple of Thieves - maybe my favourite comedy. Auto > > kept trying to get one-up on Xena and she kept outsmarting him - or maybe > > they were trying to get one up on each other. Right from the start > > where Auto untied his hands while Xena was under the table tying his > > laces together - they were both just so good. > > I too really enjoyed BC in this ep. Liked him in all the eps for that > matter. I tried "Jack of All Trades" a couple of times, but that was just > a bit too much 'Bruce'! > Yes, and I thought 'Jack' was just a bit too silly overall. BC has a tendency to overact, IMO - when he's restrained a bit (as in The Quest or RCOT) he's brilliant. But then, I always found the 'black' humour in the dramatic Xena eps much more interesting than the 'comedies' > > That dance you mentioned - gotta love the way Xena stops for a moment to > > listen for the sound of the the pinch > > guy she puton hitting the floor. > > Oh good... another excuse to hit the season one tapes again!! I never > caught that before. I gotta say too, I really liked the lead in with all > the 'walking the wire' Xena did above the streets as she chased Auto! > > Mark And another classic moment - when she was kissing the bad guy (as a distraction) and she looks over his shoulder at Auto and raises and eyebrow at him - brilliant! (Not that I'll ever admit to *liking* Season 1 or Season 2, mind you, being a confirmed Season 3 believer ;) Thelonius ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 12:02:24 +0000 From: Hadley Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] XWP = LOTR report 11/27 >I've made a start on the XWP=LOTR correspondence list... just the LOTR so >far... and come across the following discrepancies in the imdb.com data. >The first is for different segments, but the 2nd is not. Sure hope it >turns out to be Jay for both. > >Nathaniel Lees Uglzk [FotR] >Jay Laga'aia Uglzk, Chief of the Uruk-hai [TT] > >Jay Laga'aia Lurtz [FotR] >Lawrence Makoare Lurtz [FotR] Well, I just went to check the official site hoping they might have it listed but they don't. (http://www.lordoftherings.net/) However, on a bright note, they do have Karl Urban listed which means despite rumors, his scenes probably are in there. :) BTW, the official site has some cool images if anyone is interested. Cheers, Hadley - -- The ScullyXenaverse A perfect marriage between Xena and The X-Files http://ewlyn.hispeed.com/scullyxena Look for Ryan's Guide to the Joxerverse - open now! ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 01:10:36 +1300 From: cr Subject: [chakram-refugees] OT: I'm about to disappear.... ... from the list for about 6 weeks. I have to go and lie on a beach in the sun. In Rarotonga. Should be back about 5th January. Just in case anyone wonders where I went to. T ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 18:40:18 EST From: IfeRae@aol.com Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] <> In a message dated 11/26/2001 6:37:08 PM Central Standard Time, cande@sunlink.net writes: S P O I L E R SPACE > Overall once you see the director's cut you do miss the added footage when > you > see the original. However I don't think it's going to change anyone's > feelings about the ending. IF you liked it you will still like it if you > didn't you still won't. > Yep, gotta agree with you there. However, I do think Gabfans would dislike the expanded Akemi scenes (especially the flashbacks when Xena's about to behead her -- much too reminiscent of the G&X relationship even for my tastes), but appreciate that the samurai she faced wasn't the bumbler he appeared to be. (Heck, he even caught a knife Xena threw at him.) And as much as I like seeing X&G together at the end of the director's cut, I think what we saw was -- as Lucy might say -- the "bold" choice, making it absoutely clear that Xena is with Gab now in spirit. Fascinating how a little snip here, a little add there might have influenced some impressions, but probably wouldn't have changed the aired version overall. - -- Ife ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ End of chakram-refugees-digest V1 #53 *************************************