From: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org (chakram-refugees-digest) To: chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Subject: chakram-refugees-digest V1 #21 Reply-To: chakram-refugees@smoe.org Sender: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-chakram-refugees-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk chakram-refugees-digest Friday, October 26 2001 Volume 01 : Number 021 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [chakram-refugees] I will nevernever start a subject line... ["H.J.J. Hew] [chakram-refugees] More on RAINBOW WARRIOR ["H.J.J. Hewitt" ] Re: [chakram-refugees] FIN "Director's Cut" airs on Oxygen 11/3 [Theloniu] Re: [chakram-refugees] I will nevernever start a subject line... [Sekhmet] Re: [chakram-refugees] More on RAINBOW WARRIOR [Sekhmet209@aol.com] [chakram-refugees] FIN "Director's Cut" airs on Oxygen 11/3c ["Jackie M. ] [chakram-refugees] G's Role (was <>) ["Jackie M. Young] Re: [chakram-refugees] FIN "Director's Cut" airs on Oxygen 11/3 ["~* Mega] Re: [chakram-refugees] RE: ["~* Megaera *~" ] [chakram-refugees] Tape Plan [Lynn W Ribaud ] Re: [chakram-refugees] FIN "Director's Cut" airs on Oxygen 11/3 [Sekhmet2] Re: [chakram-refugees] Tape Plan (fwd) [Lynn W Ribaud > A rumination or two [Mirrordrum > and o/s Buffy ["bookdaft" ] [chakram-refugees] Renee O'Connor Thank You Project [Hadley Subject: [chakram-refugees] I will nevernever start a subject line... ...with "help" again. And, despite how many times the internal message got re-sent around, nobody's provided any leads to how to find out where in the film Lucy's scenes are-- hopefully because there was so much chaff that folks couldn't see the message. H-E-L-L-L-L-L-PPPP! Meanwhile, even tho we get OXYGEN here in Austin, it's not included in the weekly schedules list in the newspaper. Can somebody post the URL for the channel so we can check out the times precisely? (Esp. to find out how they're going to juggle things to fit in the extra 16 mins..) TEXena ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 01:23:05 -0500 From: "H.J.J. Hewitt" Subject: [chakram-refugees] More on RAINBOW WARRIOR There was one line from the movie that got tossed around a lot... something like "I think you're obsessing about this". Can anyone recall what that scene was about? TEXena, who is sure that somewhere in Ven's archives must have been a transcription of all Lucy's scenes :-( ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 18:54:54 -0400 From: Thelonius Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] FIN "Director's Cut" airs on Oxygen 11/3 On Wed, 24 Oct 2001 20:11:42 -0400 meredith wrote: > Hi, > > Gabsfan wondered: > > >Wow! I wonder what is in those 16 extra minutes. Will it make FIN better or > >worse? Hmmmm. I'll be happy as long as part of those 16 minutes contains > >extra ROC. ;-) > > Heh. Me too. Actually, I hope it helps resolve some of the more glaring > "huh??" moments that were brought up when the ep first aired. > To be honest, I doubt if it will, much. Simply because I think TPTB would have tried, in cutting the original eps, to keep in anything that was important to the plot. Now, will everybody on the list please promise not to go ballistic all over again if the bits they feel really should be included in the extra sixteen minutes, aren't? 8-) T .,.. ever hopeful ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 19:02:21 -0400 From: Thelonius Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] RE: On Wed, 24 Oct 2001 22:34:19 -0400 meredith wrote: > Hi, > > >Just think if > >Gabrielle had brought Xena back -perhaps Xena did find peace and > >contentment > >only to be brought back to a life of violence and struggle because of her > >friends selfish desire. > > For a look at precisely how this scenario could have played out, just watch > the current season of _Buffy_. That show also killed off their name hero > at the end of last season, and she was brought back because of her friends' > selfish desire. She was perfectly happy on the other side, and had no > desire to be brought back to a life of violence and struggle, but here she > is. Things aren't going well for her at all. I think if Xena were to be > brought back we would see much the same thing happen. > > Xena certainly didn't seem over-keen at the end of Destiny.... nor the first time round either - "She says it isn't your time to die yet" "Well if not now, then _when_?" T ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 18:57:19 -0400 From: Thelonius Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] FIN "Director's Cut" airs on Oxygen 11/3 On Wed, 24 Oct 2001 17:12:46 -0800 (AKDT) KTL wrote: > > I used to just trade tapes but now I got most everything, so now I do it > for cost. And bear the price of wear and tear on my two vcr's myself, for > the "Greater Good". (Simper) > > KT Heh... we *know* you just do it for the excuse to watch all those Xena eps again.... ;-) T ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 03:38:28 EDT From: Sekhmet209@aol.com Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] I will nevernever start a subject line... In a message dated 10/25/01 2:06:36 AM, hjjh@mail.utexas.edu writes: >...with "help" again. And, despite how many times the internal message >got >re-sent around, nobody's provided any leads to how to find out where in >the >film Lucy's scenes are-- hopefully because there was so much chaff that >folks couldn't see the message. H-E-L-L-L-L-L-PPPP! Oh, that. The answer is that she has scenes scattered all through the movie, but doesn't get to talk much. Her most prominent scene is toward the end, when she and the "hero" (Jon Voight, I think?) speed toward the nuclear test zone on a smallish boat and get intercepted by the French navy. But you really oughta make your friend watch the whole thing (see Lucy dance! See Lucy stand on the dock looking sad! ...etc. ) >Meanwhile, even tho we get OXYGEN here in Austin, it's not included in >the >weekly schedules list in the newspaper. Can somebody post the URL for >the >channel so we can check out the times precisely? (Esp. to find out how >they're going to juggle things to fit in the extra 16 mins..) http://www.oxygen.com (or http://www.oxygen.com/xena/ if you want to go directly to the Xena page). - --Sekhmet ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 03:42:31 EDT From: Sekhmet209@aol.com Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] More on RAINBOW WARRIOR In a message dated 10/25/01 2:24:51 AM, hjjh@mail.utexas.edu writes: >There was one line from the movie that got tossed around a lot... something >like "I think you're obsessing about this". Can anyone recall what that >scene was about? Only very vaguely; sorry. - --Sekhmet ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 21:59:56 -1000 (HST) From: "Jackie M. Young" Subject: [chakram-refugees] FIN "Director's Cut" airs on Oxygen 11/3c md wrote: >let me know if you're willing to make and send out 5 copies + one for me. - --I dunno, I *might* be able to be *coerced* ;P into being a branch in the tree, but I do agree with KTL that the $6 charge is more reasonable/efficient than the SASE. By the time someone buys the tape, spends $$ on the postage going, and provides the postage back, it is about double the cost of just reimbursement or $6. The $6 for me usually includes just $1 for time, which I started to charge just because (believe it or not), *some fans* didn't really appreciate all the time and effort a fellow fan puts into doing this! ;P I know many people do, but au verso, many people *don't*. ;P It's really *sad* how other fans take fellow fans *for granted*. ;( (*Sorry*, Meredith, I was going to e- you privately about this, but thought the rest of the list should be able to know my reasoning on this, also.) Just MO, - --Jackie ****************************************************** * Proud to have the same birthday as Lucy Lawless! * * * * "I think New Zealand geographically comes from * * ... Hawai'i." --Lucy Lawless, Late Show, 4/9/96 * * * * "Feel the fear and do it anyway." --Lucy Lawless, * * Evening Post, 7/4/98 * * * * JACKIE YOUNG, JYOUNG@LAVA.NET * * * ****************************************************** ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2001 22:13:20 -1000 (HST) From: "Jackie M. Young" Subject: [chakram-refugees] G's Role (was <>) KTL wrote: >I think she'd be a lot more interesting and believable if they hadn't >forced her into becoming a warrior. > > and not changed them so much instead of making her into a pale >imitation of Xena (in all ways), one who could never catch up to Xena >while she lived. - --I agree with KTL; I never embraced G's evolution into a warrior as much as some others have. When the change started to happen, I felt there was a loss of contrast between the two characters, and that interesting yin/yang was being diluted somehow. It wasn't as interesting for me to hear the story of _two_ warriors (actually, one warrior-in-training), as it was to hear the story of a warrior and someone who was always questioning the warrior's way. As LL and Tapert have said, the show's called XWP, so guess who the hero will _always_ be? ;P If it was the story of G, wannabe-warrior, there should've been more backstory to her training and her rise to *real competence* (not just second-fiddle to the legendary X). In the end, though G takes on X's journey, she doesn't necessarily take on X's mantle, if that makes any sense? I.e., I felt S2 G in XScrolls was more convincing as a *toughie* than G in S6 FIN. Just MO, - --Jackie ****************************************************** * Proud to have the same birthday as Lucy Lawless! * * * * "I think New Zealand geographically comes from * * ... Hawai'i." --Lucy Lawless, Late Show, 4/9/96 * * * * "Feel the fear and do it anyway." --Lucy Lawless, * * Evening Post, 7/4/98 * * * * JACKIE YOUNG, JYOUNG@LAVA.NET * * * ****************************************************** ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 11:55:29 +0000 From: "~* Megaera *~" Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] FIN "Director's Cut" airs on Oxygen 11/3 Has anyone found that FIN is actually scheduled on the 3d? I've checked everywhere I know of for my area, also have checked Oxygen.com, and have found nothing indicating it will be shown. There are other eps scheduled for that day. It's quite possible the current schedule is wrong, however, I wondered if anyone had found it scheduled in their area. ~Meg "We claim to be just and upright. No wrath from us will come stealthily to the one who holds out clean hands, and he will go through life unharmed; but whoever sins and hides his blood-stained hands, as avengers of bloodshed we appear against him to the end, presenting ourselves as upright witnesses for the dead." [The ERINYES (Furies). Aeschylus, Eumenides 310] _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 12:22:29 +0000 From: "~* Megaera *~" Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] RE: >>Just think if >>Gabrielle had brought Xena back -perhaps Xena did find peace and >>contentment only to be brought back to a life of violence and >>struggle >>because of her friends selfish desire. > >Meredith wrote: >For a look at precisely how this scenario could have played out, just watch >the current season of _Buffy_. That show also killed off >their name hero >at the end of last season, and she was brought back >because of her >friends' selfish desire. She was perfectly happy on >the other side, and >had no desire to be brought back to a life of >violence and struggle, but >here she is. Things aren't going well for >her at all. I think if Xena >were to be brought back we would see much >the same thing happen. > >Meredith Tarr I see this quite differently. Buffy had been dead for about 6 months, she also told Spike she was in heaven. She had no contact with the living and actually was in shock when they brought her back. Certainly bc she had to claw her way out of her grave and also bc she was in heaven--not worries, etc as you mentioned. But Xena was not dead for long when Gab could have brought her back. She wasn't in heaven, nor was she dead and away from the living. She was speaking to Gab throughout. At the end, we had no idea where Xena was going to end up. It looked as thought she were going to be a ghostly presence to Gab, however, that could also all be in Gabs mind. Xena has also died before and I don't believe she would be in shock if she came back. Though if we found out she was in a place as Buffy had been, for that length of time, I might agree with you. Yet right now, nothing about where Xena is resembles where Buffy had been. I don't know that Xena is at peace, not true peace. She died bc of a lie her friend told her. She may feel good about her contribution to letting the souls go, but her life was cut short. I guess we may never know. ~Meg _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 09:08:24 -0400 (EDT) From: Lynn W Ribaud Subject: [chakram-refugees] Tape Plan I sent an offer to md about tapes, which I will put here as well: I have, in addition to two VCR's, a hard-disk recorder (a ReplayTV). I would load the source onto that, and then I can make two copies at a shot. If the ep runs no more than 2hr30min or so, I'm recommending a T-160 run at high speed. In any case, I am willing to make *lots* of tapes, at my cost (my T-120 tapes are Sonys at about $5.70+tax for five; I'll have to see what I can do about T-160 tapes if we go that way -- but you can also request it at slow speed on a T-120) and I use priority shipping (so the canonical $3.50 for that). I get used peanuts here at the lab, so packing is no problem. I'll make dupes for people in the order in which I get requests, and I will make getting these out a priority. I *really* want to see this extra material!!! Lynn Lynn Ribaud, Local Contact X3A Beamline, National Synchrotron Light Source, Brookhaven National Lab ribaud@acsu.buffalo.edu Tel (631) 344-5603, (631) 344-3770 Fax (631) 344-3770 Beeper 5363 (Digital) ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 13:23:40 EDT From: Sekhmet209@aol.com Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] FIN "Director's Cut" airs on Oxygen 11/3 In a message dated 10/25/01 7:56:48 AM, megaera_@hotmail.com writes: >Has anyone found that FIN is actually scheduled on the 3d? I've checked >everywhere I know of for my area, also have checked Oxygen.com, and have >found nothing indicating it will be shown. There are other eps scheduled >for that day. It's quite possible the current schedule is wrong, however, >I >wondered if anyone had found it scheduled in their area. It's not on the schedule yet, but _is_ mentioned on Oxygen's Xena page http://www.oxygen.com/xena/ (look in the right column; it's near the top) - --Sekhmet ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 13:41:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Lynn W Ribaud Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] Tape Plan (fwd) Meredith wrote: > Too bad my TiVo can't pick up channels I don't get. > I have something in the thousands of bucks in video equipment. *None* of it seems capable of recording channels I don't get... As I wrote to md, I have the wrong satellite service -- I have Dish. If Oxygen were on that, I'd even have a digital tape... > Please put me down for one. To save shipping I could > just get it from you at Xena Night. Let me know ... > thanks! Meredith has first dibs! Obviously, Meredith knows I go there. I meant to include this in any case -- anyone who wishes to pick up their copy at the Xena Night at Meow Mix, just let me know. The cost, then, would obviously be just the tape. There should be enough lead time for me to have these done by the next MM night (which will be the 13th of November). I have looked at the Oxygen listings. Though they don't say what is showing in the movie slot on the 3rd from 9:00 to 11:30, it is a fair bet at this point that it is the Xena. In this case, it *will* fit on a T-160. Lynn Lynn Ribaud, Local Contact X3A Beamline National Synchrotron Light Source ribaud@acsu.buffalo.edu ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 15:18:00 -0500 From: Lilli Sprintz Subject: [chakram-refugees] FIN Director's Cut I don't have money or the mechanical ability to do more than copying over the tape I have at the moment. I do have access to cable and (temporarily, if the fates hold out) to Oxygen. Do you all have any suggestions? Can't afford mailing fees, and disabled and can't get to post office... Will help if I can. Lilli ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 15:20:03 -0500 From: Lilli Sprintz Subject: [chakram-refugees] FIN Director's cut Meredith, how many of us are there on this list? L ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 21:24:45 +0000 From: "~* Megaera *~" Subject: Re: [chakram-refugees] FIN "Director's Cut" airs on Oxygen 11/3 > >In a message dated 10/25/01 7:56:48 AM, megaera_@hotmail.com writes: > > > >Has anyone found that FIN is actually scheduled on the 3d? I've > >checked everywhere I know of for my area, also have checked > >Oxygen.com, and have found nothing indicating it will be shown. > >There are other eps scheduled for that day. It's quite possible the > >current schedule is wrong, however, I wondered if anyone had found > >it scheduled in their area. > >Thu, 25 Oct 2001 13:23:40 EDT, Sekhmet209@aol.com wrote: > >It's not on the schedule yet, but _is_ mentioned on Oxygen's Xena page >http://www.oxygen.com/xena/ >(look in the right column; it's near the top) > >--Sekhmet Thanks Sekhmet. I saw the update on the site page. Hopefully the schedule will change soon to reflect the new FIN eps. ~Meg _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 21:14:40 -0400 From: Mirrordrum Subject: [chakram-refugees] <> A rumination or two SS for <>, <> and <> / / / / / / / / / / / / / / / / / / just watched again and liked it again though thousands didn't. a flawed plot, major complaints about the amazons and their decisions and a lot of grumbling aside, i still really liked it. i liked it for the acting and for questions it raises for me personally. have been rewatching season 6 and lucy is just knocking my socks off--and i a gabfan. what to do, what to do. of course, being a gabfan does not preclude appreciating la luce by any means. i think she is on hit in --very poignant acting and excellent direction for the most part. i must say that watching varia walk blindfolded down the dune i kept flashing on "young frankenstein" and expecting to hear somebody say in a gene wilder voice: "take. . . .the blindfold. . . .off." god that scene leaves me in stitches. but then i do get to watch gabrielle running with all the background explosions. *sigh* and xena looking deeply troubled. a lot. another sigh. also i don't always share MH's vision tho i do generally like his direction. the closing pull away to the arrows about 100 feet up in a tree still leaves me clueless. he does like those "statements," doesn't he? i'm sure the full essence of that one escaped me but i know he had something profound in mind. as i was watching this time it was w/ FIN2 in mind, as well as some discussions about whether gabrielle's character would have been more interesting as a warrior. i was also reflecting on the marvelous spatty interchange in where xena tells gab she can take the pinch off but not put it on (i'll not digress here into my belief that that's *exactly* the kind of argument two people get into who love each other) and the denouement of where gab ends up w/ the chakram and the ability to use it and the pinch. i think xena was right. there are a whole lot of us who really shouldn't be armed. given what she and xena both learned in , i find it unlikely that gabrielle would be given a field commission following xena's death beyond what she'd already received. xena's said "i'm glad i know i can trust you to cover my back," they actually fight back-to-back in , and that's saying a lot. to be trusted to cover xena's back. . .wow, that would be something. so she gets to do her queenly duty in and try out xena's old gig and, in a reversal of roles (sort of), xena gets to watch what gab's been watching all these years. she gets the honor and privilege of being responsible for trying to bring xena back and then of having to let her go. i just find that awesome. but for gab to take it on the road alone. . .to me, that seems even more of a stretch after rewatching . it was clearly painful for xena to watch gabrielle trying to make commander-in-chief decisions in and it was agonizing for gabrielle and she wasn't suited for it. xena says "you won" but gabrielle didn't win and knows it. if there was a win, it was a joint win and a very sloppy one at that. xena was, of course, the deciding factor and gabrielle still had to suffer the cost of command. so she had the losses but none of the supposed gain. no glory, no forged honor, none of that great legendary stuff. and she got sucked into kill mode just like xena used to do. and gabrielle's comment that with each battle she loses more of herself and xena's rejoinder that "war's tough on the soul" seem to lead directly to the conclusion in FIN2 for xena; not so directly for gabrielle. xena's free at last. at least the way i see it; she and gab together freed her. i don't like it, but there're a lot of things i don't like. in gabrielle, in her "rallying the troops" speech, talks about death not being the end but a pathway to another life. she talks about expecting to meet her sisters and look them in the eye and know she's done the best she could, she talks about an eternal amazon nation and about eternal honor. my interpretation of the direction both of xena's expression and of the interchange following that is that it was basically what she was supposed to do, what she thought she needed to say--not necessarily what she believed. the politics of war. i'm sure it's necessary to say such things. i wonder how many commanders have been left with a bitter taste in their mouths afterward. i think in a lot of ways that episode made FIN2 a good ending for me. i really watched seriously and i was very much moved by what lucy did with her role. she just looks so haunted and i imagine that it's memories, seeing someone she loves in pain, knowing she could take over and can't and mustn't--just very complex stuff. and also in the early fight scene against bellerophon in the village, seeing gabrielle doing her best against two guys, getting decked and xena tearing across the village to bail her out. i mean, at some point she's got to lay all that down. i'd think, and i get this largely from off-list discussions with a friend, that it would be like parenthood. it's certainly something i'm trying to learn with regard to younger people in my life: i've got to let it go, let them go into all the risks and dangers and wonders of their lives and i can ultimately only do that fully by dying. the final thing i'll discuss that i liked in both FIN and helicon was the idea that however one defines it, stewardship is passed on, the work is passed on. you can't rely on the hero to do all the work and be constantly available. it's a nice fantasy, but the torch must get passed. so the idea of the amazon nation, which is very meaningful to many of us, is passed on and the stewardship of power is passed on. we have to decide what to do with our turn as stewards, teach our children well, and then pass it on. that is the way of it. md To love another you have to undertake some fragment of their destiny. Quentin Crisp ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 21:20:40 -0400 From: "bookdaft" Subject: [chakram-refugees] RE: (No subject renamed to--) <> and o/s Buffy Minor spoilers for Frine In Need Mirrordrum, in part, wrote: <<<<>I don't know if you watch Buffy but I just saw this weeks episode and it >made me think of Xena. Last week Buffy was brought back from the dead by >her friends. At end of this weeks episode she thanks them because she says >she was in hell and in torment. A little while later she confesses to >another character that she actually was happy, at peace and felt great love. >She assumes she was in heaven but her friends now have brought her back to >world of violence and pain and now she is truly in hell.>>>> <<<>>> <<<<>Just think if >Gabrielle had brought Xena back -perhaps Xena did find peace and contentment >only to be brought back to a life of violence and struggle because of her >friends selfish desire.>>>> I only thought of this after I went to bed and so wasn't able to respond until now. In all fairness to the Scooby gang, the situation is not wholly comparable. As the episode opened, it was clear that they were struggling to protect and defend Sunnydale - and not succeeding. Yes, there was a measure of a desire to return their friend to life out of selfishness, but as a group they weren't able to replace Buffy. In fact, the demon Hell's Angels broke into Willow's spell, causing them all to leave before completing it and getting Buffy out of the casket and the ground. Xena, on the other hand, tried to make sure Garbrielle could continue doing the work she, Xena, had set out to do. At the end of the finale, it seems Gabrielle was probably up to the task. We'll never know for sure because that's another television series. bd ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2001 21:29:58 -0400 From: "Cheryl Ande" Subject: [chakram-refugees] RE: Oxygen tape I volunteer to tape. I have two VCR's and will gladly copy 6 tapes for you and 5 others who want them. I'll probably do two for myself. I usually use high quality tapes that are a little more expensive but I think $6 for tape and postage is reasonable. Now I'm no organizational genius but perhaps someone can keep a list of who wants tapes. I'll do this if you want. CherylA ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2001 02:17:18 +0100 From: Hadley Subject: [chakram-refugees] Renee O'Connor Thank You Project Greetings Everyone, This is something I had tried to post to the original Chakram list around when it went down and it never got posted. It just dawned on me that the deadline is drawing near, so I thought I'd pass out the info in case anyone is interested. The Simply Renee O'Connor website is putting together a thank you project for Renee for the 6 years she spent portraying Gabrielle. Sharon has agreed to pass this on to Renee once it is complete and Melissa W. - who runs the site - is collecting things from the fans - letters, drawings, poems, etc. - and putting them into a scrapbook for her. If anyone would like to contribute something or want more info, the URL is: http://www.efanguide.com/~roc/theproject.htm The deadline for submissions is November 31, 2001. Cheers, Hadley - -- The ScullyXenaverse A perfect marriage between Xena and The X-Files http://ewlyn.hispeed.com/scullyxena Look for Ryan's Guide to the Joxerverse - open now! ========================================================= This has been a message to the chakram-refugees list. To unsubscribe, send a message to majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe chakram-refugees" in the message body. Contact meth@smoe.org with any questions or problems. ========================================================= ------------------------------ End of chakram-refugees-digest V1 #21 *************************************