From: owner-canadian-music-digest@smoe.org (canadian-music-digest) To: canadian-music-digest@smoe.org Subject: canadian-music-digest V1 #18 Reply-To: canadian-music@smoe.org Sender: owner-canadian-music-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-canadian-music-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk canadian-music-digest Tuesday, July 14 1998 Volume 01 : Number 018 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Moxy! (WAS: Re: Sarah Slean etc.) [Colleen Campbell ] Re: Moxy! (WAS: Re: Sarah Slean etc.) [James McGarry ] New Releases for July 14th...and Alanis News [Riphug@aol.com] Re: Moxy! ["Tabassum Siddiqui" ] Re: Moxy! ["Tabassum Siddiqui" ] Cool radio! (WAS: Re: Moxy!) ["Tabassum Siddiqui" ] Rufus Wainwright [Steve I ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 01:03:46 -0400 From: Colleen Campbell Subject: Re: Moxy! (WAS: Re: Sarah Slean etc.) As one of the Americans in question. . . At 05:12 PM 7/12/98 PDT, Tabassum Siddiqui wrote: >ARGH! What? Shame on you, Steve! ;) I, for one, have never wavered in >my support of the band, even when they were completely shunned by the >Canadian music industry/fans at one point. And now that they seem to be >coming somewhat back into fashion, having garnered a strong U.S. fan >base (isn't that always the way? ), I'd like to throw something in here. Much of the rest of this post is about the fact that Canadians bands, unfortunately, gain popularity in Canada after they've made it big in the States. I wouldn't by any stretch of the imagination call Fruvous "big." I adore the guys, they're my favorite band of all time, been following them for four years, seen them 36 times in 3 different countries and driven over three thousand miles for a single show, but that doesn't mean the average joe, or even the well-informed music listener, is likely to be familiar with them. They've gained a *devoted* fan base, but not necessarily a broad-spread one. They still have almost no radio play, of course no video play (a conscious choice on their part), and a drawing power that can fill pubs and music halls but not stadiums. I'd hardly say that's "fashionable" here. Is that changing? Yes, but very slowly, if surely: they've been extremely hard-working in building their fan base in the States, and their success here is due to grass-roots support, not coming into fashion. >Ummm, no, I really don't think they were *ever* considered "Top 40" *or* >teenybopper-ish. While it would be wrong to classify them as such according to their music, I have to disagree: the reaction to them *was* strong in the teenybopper crowd, and "Stuck in the 90's" at least was getting the kind of attention that a typical top-40's song gets. Is their work the slick, commerical pap that normally passes for the tastes of hoi polloi? Nope. But they themselves couldn't halt the media machine that brought them to the attention of the crowd always on the lookout for new teen idols. >Maybe it's true that Canadians grew tired of BNL and Moxy and are only >beginning to take notice again because they've heard how big these bands >are becoming in the U.S. I think you're making too much of a parallel between Fruvous and BNL, at least in terms of the reaction they're getting in the States. To use just one example: Fruvous played a free street show here in Boston in May as part of Mayfest. They had a crowd packed around them of several hundred enthusiastic people. BNL did a free street show here last week. Newbury Comics was sponsering it and at first had decided to hold it indoors; later they estimated they'd get 1500-2000 people and that they'd better take it outdoors. It was swamped. They underestimated *tenfold* how many people would show up--twentyfold if you consult the official police estimate. Fruvous has not had a hit here like BNL did with "Brian Wilson," for example. Maybe something from _Live Noise_ will get picked up the same way (it being the analogous album to _Rock Spectacle_) and they'll suddenly be the in thing here; but I'm not holding my breath. >Moxy Fruvous is also doing >several Canadian dates for the first time in at least a year or 2, so go >out and support them as well. There's plenty of speculation among the West Canadian Fruheads that if the shows aren't suitably packed this time, it'll be another couple of years before they head west again. Not that it has any bearing on my life directly, just that I'd like to see Fruvous get some recognition across their home country--but I'll second the urging to get out there and go to their shows, if you like Fruvous and are concerned about them making independent of America. just a coupla cents' worth of babble, ceecee Colleen Campbell o/~ Fruphoria! o/~ ceecee@fruvous.com Can you imagine what the Kama Sutra would be like, if it were written by a ferret? - Matty ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 09:41:11 -0400 (EDT) From: James McGarry Subject: Re: Sarah Slean etc. On Sun, 12 Jul 1998, Yeah, I want some Cheesy Poofs! wrote: > What list might this be???? I'm really into the hip hop scene as well, > but only know of 1 or 2 artists artists out of Canada. Saw Bass Is Base The list is the idio-audio list. Its geared to an indie-industry feel. Lots of promo and how to sell youself posts. Some really interesting discussions, mainly industry oriented. I'll attach subscription instructions below. Bass is Bass is pretty funky, I've never seen or met them, though they're friends of friends. I'm starting to get taken aback at what a cozy scene this is. James. ========================================================================== James McGarry | jmcgarry@UoGuelph.CA - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- An artist should be fit for the best society and keep out of it. - - John Ruskin ========================================================================== Welcome to the idio-audio mailing list! Please save this message for future reference. Thank you. If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe idio-audio or from another account, besides Some1@Blah.CA: unsubscribe idio-audio Some1@Blah.CA If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. Here's the general information for the list you've subscribed to, in case you don't already have it: [Last updated on: Fri Feb 6 18:07:16 1998] - - - - _/_/_/ - - _/ I D I O - A U D I O - - _/ \_\_ - - _/ \_ \_ http://www.vrx.net/idio-audio - - _/_/_/ \_\_\_\_ - - \_ \_ idio-audio@syntac.net - - \_ \_ - - Welcome to the idio-audio Community. This list is intended to promote independent culture here in Toronto. To post stuff to the list send email to: idio-audio@syntac.net *** Participate! *** Are you organising an event? Tell Us! Send us your comments, tips, and reviews! Tell us about your band or a band you like! Think of idio-audio as a group of friends. Your friends. In fact if your friends are *NOT* on the list, get them to subscribe! The more of us there are on this list, the less we'll need to depend on the main stream media to tell us what to see and what to like. Keep in mind that this list will be uncensored, irreverent, and any with delicate sensibilities are encouraged to stay the fuck away. This list is maintained by Dmytri Kleiner (aka Quirk) who can be reached for interrogation at DmytriK@syntac.net and is published by Idiosyntactix Strategic Arts & Sciences. Idiosyntactix disclaims all responsibility, especially responsibility for the content of the messages on the list. In addition idio-audio publishes a web zine with kinds of related and unrelated stuff. http://www.vrx.net/idio-audio/ The web site is maintained by Alexander Braun who can be reached at Sasha@syntac.net for comments, suggested links, article submissions, etc. The web site is also the home of idio-audio's one hour (approx) RealAudio based "Radio" program called "The idio-audio Philes" http://www.vrx.net/idio-audio/philes.html Give it a listen! We like to play music that you probably wont hear played anywhere else. Tell us what you think! The idio-audio Philes are produced by John Magyar who can be contacted at JMagyar@syntac.net. Submissions of original material is encouraged. Send us your tape, record or CD and we just might put it in the show. All Ideas and comments are welcome, don't be shy. Say Something! ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 09:55:49 -0400 (EDT) From: James McGarry Subject: Re: Moxy! (WAS: Re: Sarah Slean etc.) On Sun, 12 Jul 1998, Tabassum Siddiqui wrote: > favorites, then became national favorites with their fun first albums, > and prety much bombed out on their more 'serious' follow-up records when > the public grew tired of them. They were, in a word, ubiquitous for a Sophmore jinx. The second album is pretty standardly a wash, since, as the old music adage goes, 'you have a lifetime to make your first album and six months to make your second." > of the first stations to score big with "You Oughta Know" was Toronto's > CFNY, *not* L.A.'s KROQ, as has been previously reported, so I don't This I think was the source of the Alannis backlash, CFNY had recently repositioned to a more AOR format. I swear there were times when they played YON back to back. > alt-rock bands that are just now starting to make an impact in the U.S. > *after* they became huge at home, such as Our Lady Peace, Sloan, Moist, Sloan's a different story, they did _really_ well in the US initially, big, BIG Geffen signing when DCG/Geffen was buying up smaller alternative bands at a ghastly rate. Then they backed off, regrouped, and conquered Canada. Sloan is fun, and its really neat-o looking in to the related bands and friends of Sloan. Murderrecords and Cinnamon Toast Records are mondo cool! > radio programmers here deciding to take a shot on them again, I'll > admit, but that's the stupid sheep-mentality that most pop stations > still have all over North America. Second example - like Steve, I know a AOR - Adult Oriented Rock, that's the format we can blame for this. :-P James. P.S. Heya Tabs, did you ever get to the Emm thingy on Yonge St.? ========================================================================== James McGarry | jmcgarry@UoGuelph.CA - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- An artist should be fit for the best society and keep out of it. - - John Ruskin ========================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 10:05:58 -0400 (EDT) From: James McGarry Subject: Re: Moxy! (WAS: Re: Sarah Slean etc.) On Sun, 12 Jul 1998, Steve I wrote: > As Tab points out though, here as much as anywhere else, commercial radio > programmers are largely unimaginative/unadventuresome and tend to mirror > the playlists of certain influential U.S. radio stations, in particular > KROQ in LA. To be a _bit_ more fair, this is an industry problem as well. There are formats like AOR which are stiffling for new music. Its not so much the programmers are unimaginative (not that this also isn't the case ;-) ) but that the format itself is unimaginative. But, lets face facts, we are "early adopters" of new music, otherwise we'd not bother to seek it out so voraciously. Most people aren't, they want the AOR format, they want to like every single piece of music they hear. I'll go way out on a limb and specular that this will eventually form a two (or more) tiered music scene (and it has to an extent already, indie no longer means you'll starve (for sure) :-P ). One where early adopters and newer artists are introduced and the majors... Myself, I'm really lucky to have the best of both worlds. CBC (RadioSonic & Brave New Waves), CFNY and my campus station CFRU :-) James. ========================================================================== James McGarry | jmcgarry@UoGuelph.CA - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- An artist should be fit for the best society and keep out of it. - - John Ruskin ========================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 10:58:07 -0400 (EDT) From: James McGarry Subject: Re: Sarah Slean etc. On Fri, 10 Jul 1998 Riphug@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 98-07-10 14:06:18 EDT, jmcgarry@uoguelph.ca writes: > << If ya like the above also check out: Emm Gryner, Veda Hille, Wild > Strawberries, maybe Vicky Fraser, Corduroy Leda, ..um... I had more in > mind, but my brain isn't working as usual and my notebooks are elsewhere. >> > > I have bunches of albums by the first three....but thanks for mentioning the > other two. Can you tell me a little more about Vicky and Corduroy? Corduroy Leda are a between 6 and 8 piece all-girl band, though now they've had a male bassist and drummer from time to time. They have a very distinct sound, blues/punk/funk/folk, etc. World-beat in a manner. They have one indie cassette release and I think. Neat-o deep lyrics of a manner that just shouldn't be carried off by a band that big. They have a downside of Guelph bands, too many people on stage at once (Black Cabbage our other "big" band; and a big fav of a few people at The Agency also has this problem), sometimes you get a bit of a sloppy sound with too inclusive a band. But that's Guelph too; inclusive. I've seen them live a few times and they put on a really great show. Vicki Fraser is also part of a neat-o little group called Crow's Feet who were at NxNE 1997 and does stuff with Black Cabbage and Lew Melville. She's got a lot of country feel to her, but a very rich expressive voice. She made the penultimate cut for this year's Lilith auditions (TO), so LF attendees almost got the chance to hear her. She has one CD on her own on DROG records. I've only heard bits and pieces from the CD and seen her with Crow's Feet, but she's impressive. If you like acts with a more folky feel checkout anything on DROG Records. James. ========================================================================== James McGarry | jmcgarry@UoGuelph.CA - -------------------------------------------------------------------------- An artist should be fit for the best society and keep out of it. - - John Ruskin ========================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 14:20:36 EDT From: Riphug@aol.com Subject: New Releases for July 14th...and Alanis News << REPRISE Records has announced a November 3rd release date for Alanis Morissette's new album. http://www.RepriseRec.com/reprise_html_pages/alanis -----> NEW RELEASES: '*' = Recommended by ZEN - July 14th - ***BEASTIE BOYS Hello Nasty (Grand Royal) **A TRIBE CALLED QUEST The Love Movement (Jive) **HOOVERPHONIC Blue Wonder Powder Milk (Epic) **CULTURE CLUB Storytellers - Best Of (Virgin) **HUMAN LEAGUE The Very Best Of (Ark 21) **Various AMP 2 (Astralwerks) *THE MURMURS Blender (MCA) *DES'REE Supernatural (550) *HOWARD JONES People (Ark 21) PRIMUS Rhinoplasty (Interscope) MONICA The Boy Is Mine (Arista) BAABA MAAL Nomad Soul (Palm Pictures) ERNEST RANGLIN In Search of The Lost Riddim (Palm Pictures) BR5-49 Big Backyard Beat Show (Arista) THE FIXX 1011 Woodland (CMC) COUNTING CROWS Across a Wire - Live in New York (DGC) JEFF BLACK Birmingham Road (Arista Austin) AGNOSTIC FRONT Something's Gotta Give (Epitaph) VOODOO GLOW SKULLS Band Geek Mafia (Epitaph) TRAGICALLY HIP Phantom Power (Sire) Plus.... *MUDHONEY, BUFFALO TOM, MARTIN MULL, GWAR, The KINGS, The KNACK, the UNINVITED, NIGHT RANGER, MICHELLE LEWIS, SUNCATCHER, ROD STEWART, 10cc, VAN MORRISON, ELVIN BISHOP, DIXIE DREGS, SEA LEVEL, WET WILLIE, TRISHA YEARWOOD, LISA BROKOP, CHOCOLATE GENIUS, PHUNK JUNKEEZ, AMNESIA, 69 BOYZ, BAHA MEN, ANOUK, DREAMHOUSE, FEAR FACTORY, HARDAMAN, GRINSPOON, KIM BURRELL, GILLIAN WELCH, COLOR ME BADD, DJIVAN GASPARYAN & MICHAEL BROOK, and the soundtracks to BASEKETBALL, WICKED CITY, WATERMELON WOMAN, and FLASHDANCE (remastered).>> ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 20:49:30 PDT From: "Tabassum Siddiqui" Subject: Re: Moxy! Colleen wrote: >As one of the Americans in question. . . > >At 05:12 PM 7/12/98 PDT, Tabassum Siddiqui wrote: >>ARGH! What? Shame on you, Steve! ;) I, for one, have never >>wavered in my support of the band, even when they were completely >>shunned by the Canadian music industry/fans at one point. And now >>that they seem to be coming somewhat back into fashion, having >>garnered a strong U.S. fan base (isn't that always the way? >>), > >I'd like to throw something in here. Much of the rest of this post >is about the fact that Canadians bands, unfortunately, gain >popularity in Canada after they've made it big in the States. I >wouldn't by any stretch of the imagination call Fruvous "big." I I didn't say they were "big". I said that they'd amassed a "strong U.S. fan base". I wouldn't call them big by any stretch of the imagination, either. Which is both too bad, because I'd love to see them get wider recognition, but also good, because they're content with having the devoted, small, but heartfelt fanbase that they *do* have. >well-informed music listener, is likely to be familiar with them. >They've gained a *devoted* fan base, but not necessarily a broad->spread one. They still have almost no radio play, of course no >video play (a conscious choice on their part), and a drawing power >that can fill pubs and music halls but not stadiums. I'd hardly say >that's "fashionable" here. Is that changing? Yes, but very slowly, >if surely: they've been extremely hard-working in building their fan >base in the States, and their success here is due to grass-roots >support, not coming into fashion. I didn't say they were "coming back into fashion" in the U.S. - what I meant is that they are now slowly losing the backlash here at home and coming back into favor, *after* garnering a measure of support in the U.S. Perhaps "fashion" was the wrong word to use. ;) >>Ummm, no, I really don't think they were *ever* considered "Top 40" >>*or* teenybopper-ish. > >While it would be wrong to classify them as such according to their >music, I have to disagree: the reaction to them *was* strong in the >teenybopper crowd, and "Stuck in the 90's" at least was getting the >kind of attention that a typical top-40's song gets. Is their work >the slick, commerical pap that normally passes for the tastes of hoi >polloi? Nope. But they themselves couldn't halt the media machine >that brought them to the attention of the crowd always on the >lookout for new teen idols. Very true. But perhaps what I meant is, I've been to countless shows and have been a fan of theirs since *before* they even really began to play as a professional band, and I've always marvelled at the diversity of their fans. That's not to say that there wasn't a "teenybopper" element at one time, there certainly was, but it was never all that overwhelming from what I've seen. >>Maybe it's true that Canadians grew tired of BNL and Moxy and are >>only beginning to take notice again because they've heard how big >>these bands are becoming in the U.S. > >I think you're making too much of a parallel between Fruvous and >BNL, at least in terms of the reaction they're getting in the >States. To use just one example: Fruvous played a free street show That is true. As I did mention in my post, they have had similar careers, but where they're at now is quite, quite different in terms of popularity and whatnot. >here in Boston in May as part of Mayfest. They had a crowd packed >around them of several hundred enthusiastic people. BNL did a free >street show here last week. Newbury Comics was sponsering it and at >first had decided to hold it indoors; later they estimated they'd >get 1500-2000 people and that they'd better take it outdoors. It >was swamped. They underestimated *tenfold* how many people would >show up--twentyfold if you consult the official police estimate. Yes, I did hear about that - the Boston show was estimated at 80,000 pople outside in the city square. That's a mind-blowing figure for our boys who used to have trouble just playing *our* City Hall! LOL! But I'm really thrilled for them and am just glad to see that so many people are now enjoying their music. 'Cause that's what it's about! :) >Fruvous has not had a hit here like BNL did with "Brian Wilson," for >example. Maybe something from _Live Noise_ will get picked up the >same way (it being the analogous album to _Rock Spectacle_) and >they'll suddenly be the in thing here; but I'm not holding my breath. Neither. ;) But my sister and I were making that parallel the other day, and it's just something that's interesting to think about just because the two bands *did* have a very similar career for some years. >>Moxy Fruvous is also doing several Canadian dates for the first >>time in at least a year or 2, so go out and support them as well. > >There's plenty of speculation among the West Canadian Fruheads that >if the shows aren't suitably packed this time, it'll be another >couple of years before they head west again. Not that it has any Exactly. >bearing on my life directly, just that I'd like to see Fruvous get >some recognition across their home country--but I'll second the >urging to get out there and go to their shows, if you like Fruvous >and are concerned about them making independent of America. Hear, hear! :) - - Tab :) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 20:54:00 PDT From: "Tabassum Siddiqui" Subject: Re: Moxy! James wrote: >> alt-rock bands that are just now starting to make an impact in the >> U.S. *after* they became huge at home, such as Our Lady Peace, >> Sloan, Moist, > >Sloan's a different story, they did _really_ well in the US >initially, big, BIG Geffen signing when DCG/Geffen was buying up >smaller alternative bands at a ghastly rate. Then they backed off, Yeah, true, but where did that get them? Dumped from the label when they didn't meet selling expectations! No matter - we still loved our lads, and now they're back at it going strong! :) >regrouped, and conquered Canada. Sloan is fun, and its really neat-o >looking in to the related bands and friends of Sloan. Murderrecords >and Cinnamon Toast Records are mondo cool! Yep, great grassroots marketing there. :) >> radio programmers here deciding to take a shot on them again, I'll >> admit, but that's the stupid sheep-mentality that most pop >>stations still have all over North America. Second example - like >AOR - Adult Oriented Rock, that's the format we can blame for this. >:-P LOL! Too true. ;) >P.S. Heya Tabs, did you ever get to the Emm thingy on Yonge St.? Nope, I had this stupid seminar for summer school! :( Sorry to all of you guys I missed - sounds like it was great fun despite the rain! Oh, how I miss Emm - she'd better be back soon to play, or I might not last! ;) Cheers, Tab :) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 13 Jul 1998 20:56:24 PDT From: "Tabassum Siddiqui" Subject: Cool radio! (WAS: Re: Moxy!) James wrote: >Myself, I'm really lucky to have the best of both worlds. CBC >(RadioSonic & Brave New Waves), CFNY and my campus station CFRU :-) We should count our lucky stars, eh, James? :) Radiosonic rulez! (R.I.P. RealTime), Tab :) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 14 Jul 1998 00:05:43 -0400 From: Steve I Subject: Rufus Wainwright Is anyone here going to the Rufus Wainwright/Sean Lennon show in Toronto on Wednesday (James?)? I finally listened to some of his songs and this is another bizarre coincidence but he sounds *exactly* like Kevin Fox. Rufus is from Montreal btw, and the son of Loudon Wainwright and Kate McGarrigle. Steve ------------------------------ End of canadian-music-digest V1 #18 ***********************************