From: owner-believers-digest@smoe.org (believers-digest) To: believers-digest@smoe.org Subject: believers-digest V6 #139 Reply-To: believers@smoe.org Sender: owner-believers-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-believers-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk believers-digest Monday, July 15 2002 Volume 06 : Number 139 In Today's believer's digest: ----------------- Re: Women axe-grinders [PBCoustic@aol.com] Re: Women axe-grinders [meredith ] Re: Women axe-grinders ["Ron Rosen" ] Re: Women axe-grinders ["Charisse D. Lowe" ] Re: Women axe-grinders ["Charisse D. Lowe" ] Re: Omissions [PBCoustic@aol.com] Re: getting old [Bill Page ] Re: getting old ["Charisse D. Lowe" ] first home, first report [Sdgold60@aol.com] postings [Sdgold60@aol.com] memory 61 revisted- [Sdgold60@aol.com] Re: postings (Why don't you make the rules?) ["Ron Rosen" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 09:29:00 EDT From: PBCoustic@aol.com Subject: Re: Women axe-grinders Ron wRote: > <<. The other night, while watching Dar Williams, I noticed that most of > her guitar playing is fairly simple, especially when compared to Susan...>> I find myself doing the same thing, paying particular attention to guitar styles when I see somebody new... Of the (female) performers I've seen over my admittedly brief ~4 years exposure to the folk/acoustic world, I guess these would have to be my top five "female guitarists" (in no particular order) that back up really good songwriting with impressive guitar work... Susan Werner Sara Hickman Annie Gallup Louise Taylor Christine Lavin (Terri Hendrix, honorable mention) Now, please keep in mind there are SO many performers that I haven't had the opportunity to see yet (Cheryl Wheeler comes to mind) including many true fingerstyle wizards, so feel free to chime in with your own list of recommended "axe-grinders"... Any other femme favorites out there? Paul HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:28:36 -0400 From: meredith Subject: Re: Women axe-grinders Hi, Ron noted: >The other night, while watching Dar Williams, I noticed that most of >her guitar playing is fairly simple, especially when compared to Susan... Dar is a songwriter, not a guitarist. (And early on in her career, she wasn't really a singer either.) It was years before she stopped staring at her left hand every second she was playing ... I noticed that after she went on tour with Richard Shindell for the first time, her playing got a lot better, much more confident. He obviously taught her some stuff while on the road. But I'm sure Dar herself will tell you she doesn't consider herself a real guitar player. >I find myself doing the same thing, paying particular attention to guitar >styles when I see somebody new... Of the (female) performers I've seen over >my admittedly brief ~4 years exposure to the folk/acoustic world, I guess >these would have to be my top five "female guitarists" (in no particular >order) that back up really good songwriting with impressive guitar work... > >Susan Werner >Sara Hickman >Annie Gallup >Louise Taylor >Christine Lavin >(Terri Hendrix, honorable mention) You forgot one of the greatest guitar players on the planet, gender be damned: Patty Larkin. Bow down to her brilliance with that instrument. Good lord. Other women with stunning guitar skills include Kristin Hersh, Ani DiFranco, and Pamela Means. ============================================== Meredith Tarr New Haven, CT USA mailto:meth@smoe.org http://www.smoe.org/meth ============================================== Live At The House O'Muzak House Concert Series http://www.smoe.org/meth/muzak.html ============================================== HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 10:49:43 -0700 From: "Ron Rosen" Subject: Re: Women axe-grinders > >The other night, while watching Dar Williams, I noticed that most of > >her guitar playing is fairly simple, especially when compared to Susan... > > Dar is a songwriter, not a guitarist. And it shows that if you've got the songs and the stage presence, you don't have to be a "guitarist." Actually, I think of Dar as more of a poet than a songwriter. I think of Susan as more of a pure songwriter. Why? I would explain, but I can feel the heat from the flames already, so I'll just stop right here. Listening to Cry, Cry, Cry - BTW, Cry, Cry, Cry (Dar, Lucy, Richard) is supposed to be out of print, but Dar has it available at her shows, and you can probably find it at www.half.com or ebay. It is one of my favorite albums to listen to. HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:05:13 -0500 From: "Charisse D. Lowe" Subject: Re: Women axe-grinders And Leni Stern.... - ----- Original Message ----- HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 13:10:31 -0500 From: "Charisse D. Lowe" Subject: Re: Women axe-grinders Shawn Colvin also has great guitar chops. And I just sold my Cry, Cry, Cry CD yesterday to Book-a-holic in Wichita. Didn't care for it. I don't care for Dar, and Kaplansky is just beginning to hit her stride as a writer. Shindell's okay. I bought the CD because I read a lot of hype.... It's in the category of okay, but it was one of the 53 CDs from my collection that I pulled to sell before my move to AZ. There ya go Ron, I just re-directed all those flames... Charisse > Actually, I think of Dar as more of a poet than a songwriter. I think of Susan as > more of a pure songwriter. Why? I would explain, but I can feel the heat from the > flames already, so I'll just stop right here. > > Listening to Cry, Cry, Cry - > > BTW, Cry, Cry, Cry (Dar, Lucy, Richard) is supposed to be out of print, but Dar has > it available at her shows, and you can probably find it at www.half.com or ebay. It > is one of my favorite albums to listen to. > > HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org > Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs > http://worldcafecds.com HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:43:33 EDT From: PBCoustic@aol.com Subject: Re: Omissions In a message dated 7/14/02 12:32:30 PM Central Daylight Time, meth@smoe.org writes: > You forgot one of the greatest guitar players on the planet, gender be > damned: Patty Larkin. Bow down to her brilliance with that > instrument. Good lord. > > Ah, Meth, gimme a chance... I SAID that there were many I wasn't familiar with or had seen yet... I missed PL back in February, dammit... So my list was in no way intended to be all-inclusive or final!!!! However, I must also admit to inadvertently leaving one of my favorite friends off my "top five", Lisa Rogers of the Therapy Sisters... My apologies, Lisa!!! Keep playing that thing, girl! PB HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 14:01:07 -0500 From: Bill Page Subject: Re: getting old Charisse wrote: > Hey if y'all really want to feel old, try this... I'm moving to AZ from KS > in about 2 weeks. I've been collecting music in one form or another since I > was 12. I have roughly 100 albums, boxes of tapes, and at least 1000 CDs. I > have relocated many times in my life, and I am just sick of hauling this > stuff around. I have 5 boxes of vinyl (~320 LPs) that have moved with me many, many times...five times in the past 8 years...I haven't added to the boxes for some time, and it has been a somewhat longer time since I listened to any of them...but I'm damned if I'm gonna get rid of any of them! (Hell, I kept my 8-tracks for several years after I no longer had any way to play them!) And I fondly remember the day in 1981 when I heard a young teenager say, "Look, Paul McCartney was in a different band before Wings!" Bill Page aging daily in Kenosha, Wisconsin HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 17:06:02 -0500 From: "Charisse D. Lowe" Subject: Re: getting old Hey Bill, I re-read what I wrote- typo - it's 1000 + vinyl records! I got rid of 280 of them yesterday. I had a hard time leaving the store... - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Page" To: Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2002 2:01 PM Subject: Re: getting old > Charisse wrote: > > > Hey if y'all really want to feel old, try this... I'm moving to AZ from KS > > in about 2 weeks. I've been collecting music in one form or another since I > > was 12. I have roughly 100 albums, boxes of tapes, and at least 1000 CDs. I > > have relocated many times in my life, and I am just sick of hauling this > > stuff around. > > I have 5 boxes of vinyl (~320 LPs) that have moved with me many, many > times...five times in the past 8 years...I haven't added to the boxes for some > time, and it has been a somewhat longer time since I listened to any of > them...but I'm damned if I'm gonna get rid of any of them! (Hell, I kept my > 8-tracks for several years after I no longer had any way to play them!) > > And I fondly remember the day in 1981 when I heard a young teenager say, "Look, > Paul McCartney was in a different band before Wings!" > > Bill Page > aging daily in Kenosha, Wisconsin > > HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org > Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs > http://worldcafecds.com HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 19:05:48 EDT From: Sdgold60@aol.com Subject: first home, first report saturday in new bedford i could only stay at the festival for ONe day.. i left Joanne, Simona who i never saw sheila and boyfriend, libby kristen, jeff and sandy, woj- where was meredith joe from teh dar list.. and many for.. for the special events of the new bedford summerfest.. One i must say.. that the festival was bigger .. meaning more people than the 4 years ive gone in the past.. i went in 1999 to see susan werner and cliff eberhardt and have been going back every year.. this year.. i felt. this little hidden secret on my home turf was invaded and the secret is out.. its one the best little festivals.. and its not so little the first workshop i saw was a bunch of groups, an italian duet, a local (good) old time band and Jack hardy and his band.. then there was this french group with a cute fiddle player.. i sat at the stage.. til the next workshop.. the law firm of Werner, Warner (jeff) Rogers (garnet) and Rogers (sally) the sound was out.. so Sally rogers Led the group in a 4 part harmony round.. she was the IOWA Sing Along woman from Hell.. she kept the audience going til ... first up.. presenting her case.. Susan werner.. singing .. Born too Late then the rest of the round .. Garnet rogers. Jeff Warner who plays traditional music sally rogers.. there were songs about firmness of resolve, murder ballad, susan sang.. So heavy-m Because there was a Lawyer mentioned in it.. that was her last song.. i think.. the lack of sound cancelled a third songs.. then i stayed for the LucyK, Ricahrd Shindell, Kevin Burke, and Ray Fisher from Glascow.. the topic.. song that will make you cry.cry cry... so Lucy sang.. Lach Lomand with Ray Fisher as her harmonist and ASL interpreter.. Richard opened with Wisteria with LK on harmony LK and RS did Speaking with the Angels.. Richard also did Reunion Hill I missed most of SW"s solo set.. I did catch hte end.. two songs.. then i went to see Liz Carroll, Johnny Cunningham, Kevin Burke on fiddles then i caught Richard who sang a new new song.. and had LK with HIm for Are You Happy now.. and two others.... they slip my mind.. and back to the custom stage for Love songs.. Susan Werner, Ray Fisher Lucy Kaplansky and Sally Rogers... susan opened with Midwestern Saturday night sally rogers told a story about her adopted child and the first lullybye she sang which got Lucy to sing.. I had Something.. susan and Lucy sang The water is wide and The workshop got a standing Ovation... Susan sang.. Ode to Billy Joe.. with the audience singing along... YO east coast.. look for more pairing of susan werner and Lucy Kaplansky Look to the 92nd street Y show.. and two scheduled shows in NJ in spring.. the chemistry and vocals .. of Lucy and Susan are outstanding ... this is a rare treat to see who women of such talent paired up.. and they were having Fun... susan remarked that the midwest.. has no jews.. except for in chicago where Lucy is from.. and the 3 from des moines.. the reason for this comment they are both midwest girls.. Lucy is now in NY.. susan in now in chicago... they ahve lots in common.. but no barbed wired boys.. next up... I also heard the 13 minutes of the LK interview on NPR... congrats to the DOC.... sharon There's a gypsy down on Bleecker Street I went in to see her as a kind of joke And she lit a candle for my love luck And eighteen bucks went up in smoke HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 19:12:46 EDT From: Sdgold60@aol.com Subject: postings personally.. i have a problem with a post by one author being posted by another with out consultation with the source.. if someone forwarded benays post from teh LK list.. it had benays email address and ron i think you had a responsibility to ask if you could repost it.. benay should not have had to delurk to explain herself.. .. what is she said susan sucked.. NOT that benay ever would.. i think that there is a courtesy... i get asked by members of different lists if my posts can be used and i appreciate that i am asked... i have neither been run over by a jewish therapist from chicago or a farmer from IOWA.. i have been to the hills of IOWA and I am not afraid of women or ron... sharon HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 20:35:14 EDT From: Sdgold60@aol.com Subject: memory 61 revisted- As paul simon wrote.. Im old.. work it out.. my memory of RS's set is coming back... Richard sang... Ballad of MM with Lucy on harmony... and AYHN with LK on harmony ,, then she ran off to her workshop... she also changed out of her short dress to jeans and a denim jacket NO leather at the whaling fest... at least not day.. 1 and sorry Mosh ... my dear.. i did see you too .. and even hugged you... it was late.. and i hadnt eaten.. so forgive my oversight sharon There's a gypsy down on Bleecker Street I went in to see her as a kind of joke And she lit a candle for my love luck And eighteen bucks went up in smoke HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 14 Jul 2002 20:44:50 -0700 From: "Ron Rosen" Subject: Re: postings (Why don't you make the rules?) > personally.. i have a problem with a post by one author being posted by > another with out consultation with the source.. I would suspect, sharong, that the problem you have is shared by only a handful. If someone posts to a public list, their post is just that, public. A private post is a different matter. No one should say anything on a public list that they don't want repeated. >if someone forwarded benays > post from teh LK list.. it had benays email address and ron i think you had a > responsibility to ask if you could repost it.. I do not believe it did have the email address, nor do I believe I had any such responsibilty. Nor do I need you to explain to me what my responsibilities are. It might have been nice if I had asked, I didn't think about it, because it didn't occur to me that someone who had made a public post, that was not negative, would mind if it were shared. > benay should not have had to delurk > to explain herself.. .. Benay did not have to delurk, because there was nothing wrong or offensive with what she said, and I told her so in a subsequent post. To the extent that she is at all sensitive about this, I'm sure she appreciates you bringing it up again. >what i[f] she said susan sucked.. NOT that benay ever > would.. i think that there is a courtesy... If she said Susan sucked, I would not have reposted it. On the few occasions that I have reposted anything to this list, it is always because someone is saying good things about Susan. > i get asked by members of different > lists if my posts can be used and i appreciate that i am asked... That's nice for you. I've never thought about reposting yours, but I might to a list devoted to how to communicate clearly in print, as an example of what not to do. > i have neither been run over by a jewish therapist from chicago or a > farmer from IOWA.. i have been to the hills of IOWA and I am not afraid of > women > or ron... Interesting that you should say that, you who intimidate so many with your rules and regulations and your presentation that you know just a little bit more than anyone else about the folk world even if they have to work three times as hard to ferret it out. Why would being afraid of me even be an issue here? I did something you didn't like, and you decided to criticise me publicly, knowing that I would respond. So what? Ron, whose self-restraint was severely tested here. Do ya'll realize how many great lines I had to suppress? Because I am intimidated... HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 15 Jul 2002 00:17:01 -0400 From: meredith Subject: Re: postings (Why don't you make the rules?) Hi, Ron posted: >I would suspect, sharong, that the problem you have is shared by only a >handful. If >someone posts to a public list, their post is just that, public. A >private post is a >different matter. No one should say anything on a public list that they >don't want >repeated. Actually, you broke a basic rule of netiquette. If you're going to forward a post to another list, it's common courtesy to ask the poster first. Some lists *are* private. Unlike believers, some lists aren't archived, so once the post is posted it doesn't exist for future consumption by others. I have no experience with the Kaplansky list so I don't know how it's set up, but there is always the possibility that it's not as public as you assume. >I do not believe it did have the email address, nor do I believe I had any >such >responsibilty. Even worse. Forwarding something anonymously doesn't give the poster the ability to know that their post was forwarded. In this case, it just so happened that Benay is on both lists, so she saw it. What if her post had kicked off a flamewar and she had no way of defending herself? Luckily that didn't happen, but the possibility's there. > Nor do I need you to explain to me what my responsibilities are. It >might have been nice if I had asked, I didn't think about it, because it >didn't occur >to me that someone who had made a public post, that was not negative, >would mind if >it were shared. Sorry, Ron, but it should have. It's just common courtesy on the Net. There's no need to get all over Sharon for pointing it out. Truth be told I was going to mention something about this very thing, but got caught up in other things and Sharon got there first. ============================================== Meredith Tarr New Haven, CT USA mailto:meth@smoe.org http://www.smoe.org/meth ============================================== Live At The House O'Muzak House Concert Series http://www.smoe.org/meth/muzak.html ============================================== HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ End of believers-digest V6 #139 ******************************* --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------- This has been a posting from the Susan Werner believers-digest To unsubscribe send mail to Majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe believers-digest" in the body of the message