From: owner-believers-digest@smoe.org (believers-digest) To: believers-digest@smoe.org Subject: believers-digest V5 #219 Reply-To: believers@smoe.org Sender: owner-believers-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-believers-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk believers-digest Monday, October 29 2001 Volume 05 : Number 219 In Today's believer's digest: ----------------- Re: Peter Mulvey [Kellie Knott ] the new cd [Sdgold60@aol.com] Re: the new cd [Jeff Wasilko ] Re: the new cd ["Sally Green" ] Re: Which subway? [PBCoustic@aol.com] RE: the new cd [Samer Badawi ] Re: subway [PBCoustic@aol.com] Sharpen the point [Rjabalos@aol.com] Re: Realism, not optimism [Bodyworks4@aol.com] Re: Sharpen the point [Bodyworks4@aol.com] Re: Realism, not optimism [Bodyworks4@aol.com] Re: the new cd ["Chuck Ellingson" ] The Great SW Controversy [Kris Richardson ] Re: The Great SW Controversy [Jeff Wasilko ] Re: The Great SW Controversy [Jeff Wasilko ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 11:34:30 -0600 From: Kellie Knott Subject: Re: Peter Mulvey Peter was playing at Davis Square (the stop nearest my house and the Somerville Theater too) not long ago. wonder if he was recording? regardless - he sounded great! > Peter's actually working on recording an entire album in the > subway right now. I'm looking forward to that one... > > -sherlyn > -- HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 14:13:25 EST From: Sdgold60@aol.com Subject: the new cd .as there is NO official release date and no one else has voiced and opinion.. i will still stand on my request to delay the discussion of the new cd until more of the list receives a copy.. ron ..i have never nor never will dictate any discussion my request was a suggestion.. that has been one that frequents many other lists.. your position seems clear.. i think it may not serve to unite a community of listeners.. rather.. a small number of people can participate in a discussion that others cannot..it is not entertaining for those who cannot participate.. as no one else has comment.. it seems to me that the discussion of the cd as a community doesnt matter to the community... my suggestion stands.. and the majority rules... sharon HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 14:19:40 -0500 From: Jeff Wasilko Subject: Re: the new cd On Mon, Oct 29, 2001 at 02:13:25PM -0500, Sdgold60@aol.com wrote: > .as there is NO official release date and no one else has voiced and opinion.. i will still stand on my request to delay the discussion of the new cd until more of the list receives a copy.. I think you're making an unreasonable request, especially in light of the fact that EVERYONE on the list could have a CD in their mailbox next week, if they want one. > as no one else has comment.. it seems to me that the discussion of the cd as a community doesnt matter to the community... > > my suggestion stands.. and the majority rules... I think a few other people have jumped in as well. I don't see any reason to limit discussion at this point. - -jeff HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 14:35:32 -0500 From: "Sally Green" Subject: Re: the new cd I will comment - I'm enjoying reading everyone's comments about the CD and it's making me look more forward to purchasing it in two weeks! My vote is for people to discuss it as they see fit. >as no one else has comment.. it seems to me that the discussion of the >cd >as a community doesnt matter to the community... _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 14:37:10 EST From: PBCoustic@aol.com Subject: Re: Which subway? In a message dated 10/29/01 9:10:01 AM Central Standard Time, ehiggins@cms-stl.com writes: << So as not to be drowned out by noise, I hope you remember to sing in the "Time Between Trains". >> ROFL... excellent, Earl.... PB HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 14:39:28 -0500 From: Samer Badawi Subject: RE: the new cd ditto! > -----Original Message----- > From: Sally Green [mailto:sallyagreen@hotmail.com] > Sent: Monday, October 29, 2001 2:36 PM > To: believers@smoe.org > Subject: Re: the new cd > > > I will comment - I'm enjoying reading everyone's comments > about the CD and > it's making me look more forward to purchasing it in two > weeks! My vote is > for people to discuss it as they see fit. > > >as no one else has comment.. it seems to me that the > discussion of the >cd > >as a community doesnt matter to the community... > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org > Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs > http://worldcafecds.com HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 14:45:11 EST From: PBCoustic@aol.com Subject: Re: subway In a message dated 10/29/01 10:17:06 AM Central Standard Time, klknott@earthlink.net writes: << just the other day i saw two guys 'playing' outside of the station near my house. they had taken a refridgerator box and cut out two pieces of guitar shaped cardboard. they were GOING TO TOWN with air guitar! very funny stuff. they would actually take turns playing leads and rhythm. made some decent money too, from the looks of their tip jar. i actually gave 'em a buck coz i was laughing so hard. >> Which brings out the point that sometiimes the performance CAN be everything... as opposed to being a "New Folk" finalist as the Kerrville Festival, where they SAY that your performance doesn't count, it's the song itself that matters... (of course, everyone wants to do well!!!) PB PB HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 14:49:00 EST From: Rjabalos@aol.com Subject: Sharpen the point I think all the discussion of Susan's management has missed the point completely. Allow me to sharpen it. I think the decision not to release Susan's new CD, her first in more than three long years, for sale on the Internet and especially to her most devoted fans here on this list is a blunder to say the least and is typical of the narrow and shortsighted thinking her management has given to her career over the seven years I have been following her music. To then freely admit the real reason for this non-release is that they want to go into a record label negotiation with our pent-up demand and our guaranteed purchases in their pockets so they can cut a sweeter deal is downright insulting to Susan's fans and contemptuous towards the positive feelings we share for Susan and her music. I do not appreciate having my loyalty towards anyone taken for granted or my purchasing decisions assumed based on past behavior. This is what I find so outrageous and so should you. How do you feel just being numbers on a Projected Sales Figures form? Do you enjoy being manipulated this way? When Susan's management fails to perform for her, that's her business. When it fails to perform for me, it's my business. And when they slap me across my face, I'm going to slap back because, quite frankly, they need me and my dollars much more than I need new Susan songs. I bought five copies of TBT for myself and as gifts. I doubt I'll buy a single copy of this new CD at this point. I guess I just skewed management's numbers and they need to rerun those spreadsheets before hitting the negotiation table. I find this whole situation very sad. HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 14:50:59 EST From: Bodyworks4@aol.com Subject: Re: Realism, not optimism In a message dated 10/29/2001 1:47:43 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Rjabalos writes: > I suggest you listen to some of Susan's music and see some of her shows. > She not only admits how depressing and non-romantic her songs are, she > routinely makes fun of her own music. > > Learn the facts. Read the lyrics. Speak to the people who deal with > Susan's management. See more shows. > > Susan writes wonderful sad songs about lonely, unfulfilled people. Very > witty, of course. But almost always very sad. > Ah... Seee, this is where I didn't want my email to lead. I was asking questions of you, trying to understand why you seemed angry and hostile with all of your writings, and why you are determined to see the majority of Susan's music as depressive and sad. Yes, some material she draws upon (like in life) is sad, and very deep, but not nearly to the content that you allude to. And now for my second show: Do not assume (as I did not assume of you) that you know anything of me. I have seen many dozens of Susan's shows...seen her all across this nation. I have spoken to her management often, and Susan herself on many an occasion has taken out a lot of her time to talk with me of songs, life on the road, and her career. I feel very close to her in that respect. I'd say here, that I have a leg up, and when I say that no one should take songs and attatch a meaning FROM the writer that may not have been implied... I'm talking from a good viewpoint. As for lyrics...when I've had a question, I've asked Susan herself. Other times, thanks to Sherlyn, I can read them any old time I want to, and often times, I do. The world can be depressing and non-romantic, as you put it, but perspective is key here, as in all things. What I am saying is, no have no scope of what I truly know, and I am telling you...I go to plenty of shows, I listen to plenty of music, and I speak to Susan all the time. Do not tell me I need to further educate myself on the life and times of Susan Werner. For as much as I do know of her, I can never BE her, nor can you... so the bickering assaults on who knows what and how much is mute. Only Susan can say for herself what she thinks and feels about things in her life. And as for what she might say during a live set to an audience about the content of her songs... It's a SHOW, dear. She's a performer, and has license to change anything she wants to at any moment. That's what a good performer will do with any crowd. And with that, I bow gracefully, and receed into the background with a sly grin, and the knowledge that you will not let it go at that. *sigh* Can't we all just get along? I'll have to put that one to Sue. I'm sure she'd be bullsh*t that her fans have let things stew this far! My apologies to all who have to sort through this. I just don't like being told to educate myself on things I already know way more about than one could imagine. Don't ever assume you know someone!! We always surprise you! Barbara Cole, LMsT in the state of New Jersey Strength in numbers could just apply to schizophrenics... HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 14:55:11 EST From: Bodyworks4@aol.com Subject: Re: Sharpen the point In a message dated 10/29/2001 3:49:38 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Rjabalos@aol.com writes: > quite frankly, they need me and my > dollars much more than I need new Susan songs And herein lies where I begin to doubt you have the true feelings for the music. Fans are here for the Susan songs. Strength in numbers could just apply to schizophrenics... HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 15:28:55 EST From: Bodyworks4@aol.com Subject: Re: Realism, not optimism In a message dated 10/29/2001 3:59:22 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Rjabalos writes: > You might read the book many times but you don't understand the message. I > think you really need to read those lyrics again. I can't think of five > happy songs across four albums. You might think the song AIN'T I LONELY > TONIGHT is about redemption or MUCH AT ALL about personal growth but they > are about sad, lonely people desperate for love and affection----just like > nearly every Susan song. > > I guess the paranoid pistol-packing woman of LAST OF THE GOOD STRAIGHT > GIRLS is a positive role model for modern women, huh? She's a rape victim > so afraid of the world she drives a bullet-proof car and carries a gun for > protection, stripped of the innocent world she lives in by violence! > > More homework is necessary, sorry. > > > > You can't let it go, can you? Dude, I'm telling you...perspective is needed, and no amount of insult from you will change my mind. When I say I have spoken to Susan herself a number of times about certain subjects, and interpretation is needed by an individual... I MEAN IT. Your email states the meaning of at least 2 Susan songs. You state the meaning. Hello??? You cannot STATE the meaning of a song. Do you understand the human ability to have an opinion other than yours?? Do you think Susan sits up all night, sleepless, thinking "How will Rjabalos take this meaning? I need to make it REEEEEAAALLLYYYY depressing!" No way. She writes for herself. We take in from that what we want to. That's the human mind. Try to open yours, and do NOT attempt to understand the minds of people who can think for themselves. I do NOT need to do more homework. My PhD is plenty for me, thanks. Barbara Cole ~student of life, love, and the pursuit of happiness. All other subjects have been mastered in universities. Strength in numbers could just apply to schizophrenics... HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 14:38:25 -0600 From: "Chuck Ellingson" Subject: Re: the new cd I second that emotion (though it'll be three weeks for me... sigh)! Peace, Chuck >From: "Sally Green" >To: believers@smoe.org >Subject: Re: the new cd >Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 14:35:32 -0500 > >I will comment - I'm enjoying reading everyone's comments about the CD and >it's making me look more forward to purchasing it in two weeks! My vote is >for people to discuss it as they see fit. > >>as no one else has comment.. it seems to me that the discussion of the >cd >>as a community doesnt matter to the community... _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 01 16:06:54 -0500 From: Kris Richardson Subject: The Great SW Controversy Some of us by nature are purely logical animals... we know that Susan's management is lacking to say the least. Others of us are are ruled by our hearts... we'd buy a SW cd if she recorded it in a pickle barrel, through a phone line, with strep throat! I think most here lie somewhere in the middle, and while we don't really like the fact that Suze isn't as big a star as we know she could be, and that her management over the years certainly has made some questionable decisions (yes, like not having a distribution deal for the new cd), we'll get our hands on her music however we can because her lyrics and melodies speak to us. We're devoted fans... that's why we're on this list... that's why we love whatever Susan and her team give us pretty much unconditionally. It's okay to question things. It's okay to defend things. But whether Susan gets nominated for a Grammy, or decides to throw away her guitars and move to Sri Lanka, I'll still go home after work tonight, kiss my wife & daughter goodnight, wake up tomorrow and head back to work again. And I'll listen to my SW cd's all the way there! Kris HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 16:16:54 -0500 From: Jeff Wasilko Subject: Re: The Great SW Controversy On Mon, Oct 29, 2001 at 04:06:54PM -0500, Kris Richardson wrote: > I think most here lie somewhere in the middle, and while we don't really > like the fact that Suze isn't as big a star as we know she could be, and > that her management over the years certainly has made some questionable > decisions (yes, like not having a distribution deal for the new cd), > we'll get our hands on her music however we can because her lyrics and > melodies speak to us. We're devoted fans... that's why we're on this > list... that's why we love whatever Susan and her team give us pretty > much unconditionally. Kris...this isn't directed at you....just comments that happened to pop to mind at this moment. I don't understand why people are 'worked up' that there isn't a record deal yet. People seem to overlook the fact that without a record company behind her, she was able to fund and record a CD with a big-name producer and talented musicians. That was not an expensive undertaking. The result is that Susan owns the CD and all the rights (as opposed to the typical situation where the record company usually ends up owning the rights). If you follow the Nields at all, you probably know that they had to beg and plead to be able to buy access to the CDs they produced while they were on a major label. The idea that a corporation can hold an artist's work hostage repulses me. Also, Susan had complete creative control, as opposed to having to please one or more record company execs. Deals like this don't happen overnight. Records don't get made overnight. It was only June when Susan was getting ready to go into the studio. - -j HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 16:24:13 -0500 From: Jeff Wasilko Subject: Re: The Great SW Controversy On Mon, Oct 29, 2001 at 04:16:54PM -0500, Jeff Wasilko wrote: > On Mon, Oct 29, 2001 at 04:06:54PM -0500, Kris Richardson wrote: > > I think most here lie somewhere in the middle, and while we don't really > > like the fact that Suze isn't as big a star as we know she could be, and > > that her management over the years certainly has made some questionable > > decisions (yes, like not having a distribution deal for the new cd), > > we'll get our hands on her music however we can because her lyrics and > > melodies speak to us. We're devoted fans... that's why we're on this > > list... that's why we love whatever Susan and her team give us pretty > > much unconditionally. > > Kris...this isn't directed at you....just comments that happened > to pop to mind at this moment. > > I don't understand why people are 'worked up' that there isn't a > record deal yet. People seem to overlook the fact that without a > record company behind her, she was able to fund and record a CD > with a big-name producer and talented musicians. That was not an > expensive undertaking. Err, I should proofread a bit better. Make that 'an inexpensive undertaking'. - -j HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ End of believers-digest V5 #219 ******************************* --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------- This has been a posting from the Susan Werner believers-digest To unsubscribe send mail to Majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe believers-digest" in the body of the message