From: owner-believers-digest@smoe.org (believers-digest) To: believers-digest@smoe.org Subject: believers-digest V5 #218 Reply-To: believers@smoe.org Sender: owner-believers-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-believers-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk believers-digest Monday, October 29 2001 Volume 05 : Number 218 In Today's believer's digest: ----------------- the new cd [Sdgold60@aol.com] Re: the new cd ["Ron Rosen" ] Re: house, cont.'d [PBCoustic@aol.com] Re: (Everybody's Talkin') [PBCoustic@aol.com] Realism, not optimism [Rjabalos@aol.com] Re: CD availability [PBCoustic@aol.com] Which subway? Where? You Bostonians are lucky! ["Earl Higgins" ] Re: Realism, not optimism [Kellie Knott ] Re: believers-digest V5 #216 ["tony'a lemos" ] Re: Which subway? Where? You Bostonians are lucky! [charisse@pipeline.c] Re: Which subway? Where? You Bostonians are lucky! [Kellie Lin Knott ] Re: Realism, not optimism [Bodyworks4@aol.com] Re: Which subway? Where? You Bostonians are lucky! [Sherlyn Koo Subject: Re: the new cd > Ron honey...you know i dont veil my attacks or comments at anyone.. or about > anything I was being facetious, of course. The point I was making is that the problem you raise is entirely the result of the current distribution system. > i disagree with you.. i think you comment about those who have the new > cd and being excited to talk about it... and then when the entire community > gets the cd.. those early receivers are on to something else is the point > where i really dont want to read.. a handful ,,three or four people talking > about the new cd.. when the general population of the list DOESNT > have it... I don't know what you mean by "general population." This list is not very large, and there are only a handful of people who generally post. Until recently, there were even fewer. The only reason the activity has picked up lately is because of the new CD and the distribution issues it raised. Quite a few people do have the CD, and they are listening to it for the first time now. The fact that they might want to talk about it is a good thing. Later on, they probably won't even remember what their initial reactions were. Do you know how many topics on several lists I've had to see that I had no interest in or didn't have the underlying information to make much sense of? I use the delete button and moved on. I would never tell anyone to postpone a discussion. > i recommend you start your own email circle .. til the rest can catch up,, > if not.. there will be scattered discussions like scattered distribution > those who dont have the cd.. will not read the archives.. those who have it > will be on to something else later.... There will be scattered discussions. Next March you won't find me saying, "Let's not discuss this because it's old non-fiction." In fact, you will never, ever find me saying on an email list, "Let's not discuss this," about anything. HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 09:45:58 EST From: PBCoustic@aol.com Subject: Re: house, cont.'d Actually, Yellow House didn't do much for me either, in concert or recorded... but I've come to appreciate what she does with the song (agreeing with moonwatcher), although it's still not a favorite... PB In a message dated 10/28/01 11:19:14 PM Central Standard Time, moonwatcher22@yahoo.com writes: << to me, it's clear that the nod to the traditional melody is COMPLETELY intentional... to draw you into the feel of the genre and then dazzle you with the ways she's transcended it. >> HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 09:48:24 EST From: PBCoustic@aol.com Subject: Re: (Everybody's Talkin') Another perfect example of contrast in personal likes/dislikes, that Susan Krauss raises... I'm with Ron on this one -- I think the treatment is very cool... PB In a message dated 10/29/01 12:01:43 AM Central Standard Time, ronsopas@earthlink.net writes: << As one who grew up on the original Fred Neil, I loved that Susan covered the song in concert. At first, I didn't like the album version, but the more I hear it, the more it grows on me. >> HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 09:52:01 EST From: Rjabalos@aol.com Subject: Realism, not optimism In a message dated 10/28/01 6:09:01 PM Eastern Standard Time, owner-believers-digest@smoe.org writes: > "Using past performance as a guide, if Susan's camp is working on the > BIG CAR > idea you'll never hear the song on NPR. If The Gang That Doesn't Shoot > > Straight knows the "proper channels" why haven't they used them before? > > Fans, please don't sabotage the efforts to get BIG CAR on NPR. That's > Susan's management's job. They don't want any competition." > > Man, do eat lumps of coal lumps for lunch or what? > > you are hand down the most negative dude I've ever come across in the SW > I'm a realist, not a hopeless optimist. If you know anything about Susan's career and all the self-inflicted problems she's had over the years, you wouldn't be all that happy-go-lucky either. And if you think I'm negative, what do you think of Susan's music? Listen to her songs. Not many happy people in them. For every uplifting song ("I STILL BELIEVE") there are ten songs filled with lonely, unhappy, unfulfilled people ("AIN'T I LONELY TONIGHT?", "LAST OF THE GOOD STRAIGHT GIRLS", "TIME BETWEEN TRAINS", "STORY OF MY LIFE", "MUCH AT ALL", "MAYBE IF I SANG COLE PORTER", "SORRY ABOUT JESUS" and so on. I honestly don't know of another performer whose songs are more consistently grim than Susan's. I think the truth is best served by discussing all the facts honestly and completely, not just placing everything said always in its best and most positive light. HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 09:58:41 EST From: PBCoustic@aol.com Subject: Re: CD availability In a message dated 10/29/01 8:53:27 AM Central Standard Time, ronsopas@earthlink.net writes: << Hey Paul - Please don't discuss the CD until New England and New York get it !! How dare you? ;-) >> Sorry to burst your bubble, Ron.. but Texas DOESN"T have it yet.... LOL I got it from a good friend in CHICAGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Suze doesn't come down HERE until FEBRUARY.... Paul HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 09:09:19 -0600 From: "Earl Higgins" Subject: Which subway? Where? You Bostonians are lucky! Kellie wrote alot of stuff about "Yellow House" which I didn't necessarily understand because I'm not really all that bright, and then: > From: Kellie Knott > Subject: Re: yellow house ... > so, anyway, now i've said way too much and it's way too late and i gotta get > up early to sing in the subway tomorrow, so i'll stop... So as not to be drowned out by noise, I hope you remember to sing in the "Time Between Trains". Earl HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 07:12:01 -0800 (PST) From: Charlie Sweeney Subject: Karen Savoca song on NBC Hi all, Some of you may know that I also run a list for Karen Savoca. Karen has some exciting news I thought I would share with you folks. FYI, Karen and her cohort Pete Heitzman produce some of the most original music around, with Pete playing guitar and bass, and Karen on vocals and percussion. They sound like a whole band with just the two of them. ~~~~~~~~~~~Announcement~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ NBC's popular Wednesday night TV program, "Ed", has chosen Karen Savoca's song, RAIN ON A TIN ROOF, for a pivotal and climactic scene in the upcoming Oct 31,2001 episode (8:00 EST). The website for the Ed show is: http://www.nbc.com/Ed/ RAIN ON A TIN ROOF is from Savoca's most recent CD, "Here We Go", available from karensavoca.com. Charlie Sweeney (=}===# owner-believers@smoe.org owner-alcove@smoe.org Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals. http://personals.yahoo.com HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 09:34:43 -0600 From: Kellie Knott Subject: Re: Realism, not optimism > I think the truth is best served by discussing all the facts honestly and > completely, not just placing everything said always in its best and most > positive light. or in its most negative light. yes, there is a difference between realism and optimism. There are also big differences between realism and pessimism - which are all too often confused. and discussing the facts *completely* is a great idea, but considering that we don't have the complete facts relating to this discussion, it doesn't seem possible at this time. (no need to reiterate your list of complaints in response to this statement - i read them all the first 10 times). also, i'm not quite sure what your intent was in comparing your attacks on susan's management with her songwriting. she writes some (not all) sad songs. you write *many* angry emails. is this supposed to be a parralel that affects how we feel about susan, or some sort of ploy to encourage sympathy for your cause? i fail to see the logic there. i'm not saying that you shouldn't voice your thoughts on this forum. i'm just saying that you *have*. we understand your position. you are extremely unhappy with the management for a number of reasons that you have painstakingly described to the list numerous times. we've got it. it is clear. some of us wish to refrain from judgement at this time, *despite* your best efforts. i'm just asking that, instead of immediatly hitting your reply button and responding on the defensive, you try to accept that we are where we are. continue discussing, if need be. some of us will disagree, and some won't. also note that this response is *not* an attack on YOU, rjabalos, or your expertise in the music business. just a respectful request for returned respect. thanks in advance for considering this before responding. Best - Kellie Lin Knott p.s. - i am curious about one thing - why is it that you never sign your name when you post to the list? you obviously have strong convictions that you're willing to fearlessly defend. so why the anonymous posts? HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 10:38:07 -0500 From: "tony'a lemos" Subject: Re: believers-digest V5 #216 hi all, I too am feel lucky to have heard many of the most the songson the new cd at shows earlier this year .... many more than once....though i have yet to hear the new cd. I am so looking forward to getting a copy as susun finally makes it back this way this week, yeah (I am going to try to make the New London NH show and will be at the Iron Horse show in Northampton). From the first time i heard the Yellow House tune it's been my favorite, the complete symplicity of a song whose meaning goes layers deep. The familiarity of the traditional tune allows the listener to really be drawn into to the depth of the song, in this case the dispair, i find it so gripping. I agree susan nails it. so charisse you're a banjo player, me too. what style do you play? i have been taking lessons for about a year now and am having much fun mainly clawhammer style old timey traditional folk tunes with a little bluegrass infused. hope to see some of you this weekend- who is going where? tony(a) herbalist/food activist _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 10:39:39 -0500 From: charisse@pipeline.com Subject: Re: Which subway? Where? You Bostonians are lucky! I'm impressed - cops would arrest you in Boston for playing anywhere when I lived there in the early 70s!!! Charisse Earl Higgins wrote: > Kellie wrote alot of stuff about "Yellow House" which I didn't necessarily understand because I'm not really all that bright, and then: > From: Kellie Knott > Subject: Re: yellow house ... > so, anyway, now i've said way too much and it's way too late and i gotta get > up early to sing in the subway tomorrow, so i'll stop... HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 09:56:11 -0600 From: Kellie Lin Knott Subject: Re: Which subway? Where? You Bostonians are lucky! > I'm impressed - cops would arrest you in Boston for playing anywhere when I > lived there in the early 70s!!! > > it's allllllllll good now! you have to obtain a free pass, so the city knows how many crazies are out hustling for tips, but then you can pretty much play anywhere you like. just the other day i saw two guys 'playing' outside of the station near my house. they had taken a refridgerator box and cut out two pieces of guitar shaped cardboard. they were GOING TO TOWN with air guitar! very funny stuff. they would actually take turns playing leads and rhythm. made some decent money too, from the looks of their tip jar. i actually gave 'em a buck coz i was laughing so hard. Kellie Lin HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 10:10:38 -0600 From: Kellie Knott Subject: Re: Realism, not optimism >Feel free to withhold your judgment for the moment. thank you. >But if you examine the situation without a jaundiced eye you will come to the same conclusion >as me and a whole lot of other List members. not necessarily. but thank you for your response - i do appreciate it. still wondering, though - why the anonymous posts? i'm utterly puzzled by that. thanks again for writing back - Kellie Lin Knott HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 12:18:49 EST From: Bodyworks4@aol.com Subject: Re: Realism, not optimism Return-Path: Received: from web28.aolmail.aol.com (web28.aolmail.aol.com [205.188.222.4]) by air-id06.mx.aol.com (v81.9) with ESMTP id MAILINID65-1029121742; Mon, 29 Oct 2001 12:17:42 -0400 Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 12:17:41 EST From: Bodyworks4@aol.com To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Unknown (No Version) Message-ID: <29.1ce1542f.290ee936@aol.com> Take this as you will, all... It's my honest questioning here... but Rjabalos~~~ Do you even LIKE Susan's music? I'm not saying that with sarcastic infliction, but damn, man! Half the songs you listed as "grim" are all in the opinion of the listener. The true meaning of songs, no matter how intended by the writer/singer are always dependent upon interpretation. I appreciate that yours seems to be very negative and hopless, but I find a lot of joy in that music, and use it as such. I'm just wondering how you can bring yourself to listen to the music if your interpretation is quite guided to the extreme. Far be it from me to suggest that Susan's music might not be someone's taste, but for a fan, she doesn't seem to be yours. This is ONLY an opinion based upon what you've been writing, and I am ONLY expressing my own questioning interpretation. It boils down in my mind to this: If you hate the management, AND you think Susan is self-inflicting a horrible career, AND her music is way too depressing for you, then why are you listening, and why do you bother to become involved in the supportive list? Just questioning your motives, dude. Realism isn't always an angry lynch-mob of one. B HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 09:24:14 -0800 From: Sherlyn Koo Subject: Re: Which subway? Where? You Bostonians are lucky! Hey folks, Kellie Lin said: >it's allllllllll good now! you have to obtain a free pass, so the city >knows how many crazies are out hustling for tips, but then you can pretty >much play anywhere you like. Just to briefly plug Peter Mulvey, another one of my favourite artists - the last track on his incredible Eastern Front debut album "Rapture" is a version of the Waterboys song "Whole of the Moon", recorded in the Boston subway. Near the end of the song you can hear a train come in and pull out again, and there's a point where he pauses to thank someone for giving him money as well. It's incredibly cool. Peter's actually working on recording an entire album in the subway right now. I'm looking forward to that one... - -sherlyn - -- Sherlyn Koo - sherlyn@fl.net.au "It really is that simple, It really is that fragile" - Peter Mulvey HELP! owner-believers@smoe.org Send mail to believers@smoe.org Susan's CD's are available on your desktop at World Cafe CDs http://worldcafecds.com ------------------------------ End of believers-digest V5 #218 ******************************* --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------------------- This has been a posting from the Susan Werner believers-digest To unsubscribe send mail to Majordomo@smoe.org with "unsubscribe believers-digest" in the body of the message