From: owner-avalon-digest@smoe.org (avalon-digest) To: avalon-digest@smoe.org Subject: avalon-digest V10 #41 Reply-To: avalon@smoe.org Sender: owner-avalon-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-avalon-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk avalon-digest Wednesday, February 23 2005 Volume 10 : Number 041 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [AVALON] Happy Birthday to Mick Green! ["Colette Robertson" ] Re: [AVALON] Roxy's legacy ? [KB Porter ] Re: [AVALON] Online Label [KB Porter ] Re: [AVALON] Roxy's legacy ? [KWil632057@aol.com] Re: [AVALON] Online Label [KWil632057@aol.com] Re: [AVALON] Online Label ["Andrew Shearer" ] Re: [AVALON] Online Label [KB Porter ] Re: [AVALON] Online Label/mass appeal ["Christian H. Soetemann" ] Re: [AVALON] Online Label [KWil632057@aol.com] To leave the list, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon-digest ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 12:51:12 -0000 From: "Colette Robertson" Subject: [AVALON] Happy Birthday to Mick Green! I hope Mick is keeping well these days and has very Happy Birthday!! Cheers, Colette ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 08:45:17 -0500 From: "Arnold Schulberg" Subject: RE: [AVALON] Jobson report Right. Anderson covers that in the liner notes. Arnie - -----Original Message----- From: owner-avalon@smoe.org [mailto:owner-avalon@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Rod LeCloux Sent: Monday, February 21, 2005 10:14 PM To: avalon@smoe.org Subject: RE: [AVALON] Jobson report A = Anderson ( it was supposed to be a solo album, but the greedy record executives....) Rod >From: "Arnold Schulberg" >To: >Subject: [AVALON] Jobson report >Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2005 20:06:05 -0500 > >Okay, maybe I'm a little late on this but I just received the >remastered(???) Jethro Tull disc, "A", which comes coupled with the DVD >"Slipstream". For those who don't remember, Eddie Jobson was a "special >guest" on this Tull album and subsequent tour. I haven't listened to this >version of the cd yet since I've listened to the original release quite a >bit and there are no bonus cuts but I've always liked it, especially since >Eddie is prominently displayed on both keyboards and violin. > > > >Well, folks, Eddie is all over "Slipstream" as well. I'd say he easily vies >with Ian Anderson for the most screen time. As on the album, he adds a very >smooth electronic sheen to the Tull compositions and his contributions to >some Tull classics are highly worthy. Most of the DVD is concert footage >but >there are a few concept videos. We have to remember that this is an 80's >production so some of the concepts and special effects seem cheesy today >but, all in all, highly worth buying. And the Lucite violin makes an >appearance. > > > >Here's a link to the US Amazon site: >http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0001XAMKO/103-2856462-060541 7 >?%5Fencoding=UTF8&v=glance > > > >Arnie > > >___________________________________________________________________________ >To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 09:51:37 -0500 From: KB Porter Subject: Re: [AVALON] Roxy's legacy ? Hi Helen: I think I see what you are getting at - there is no 'legacy' because music is so diffused and absorbed, consciously and unconsciously, by other current and future musicians? An extreme example may be that the 'legacy' or rather 'progeny' of the troubadours of the Middle Ages 'evolved' into or served as the inspiration of yesterday's touring bands, and yesterday's touring bands' progeny may be tomorrow's ?virtual internet bands? (If you will)? Regardless of the example offered, I think you are saying there can be no legacy 'left' behind because everything interacts and evolves in an open system where there are a number of influences that can not be determined? And that if it was possible to make such determination, the offspring's music would be more a 'copy' of its inspiration and therefore would not be considered unique? For instance, Bryan Ferry does Bob Dylan (and yes, Jonathan, I do know what you are thinking right now:). But we wouldn't consider Bryan Ferry to be Bob Dylan's legacy, since both artists are so much more than the Dylan songs that have inspired Ferry. Indeed, even when Ferry does a cover that is almost unrecognizable from the original because he has re-interpreted it, i.e.. Screamin' J Hawkins' "I Put A Spell On You", one probably would not claim Hawkins' legacy is Ferry since Ferry is but one musician who is influenced by Hawkins' work, and furthermore, those things that inspired Hawkins are subtly transmitted to future generations via Ferry's cover of IPASOY. A chain reaction! Of course, I may have totally misunderstood your meaning. Best wishes. KBP ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:05:44 -0500 From: KB Porter Subject: Re: [AVALON] Online Label "The trouble is that in Ferry's eyes internet only albums will amount to admitting a lack of wide appeal." If that is what Ferry thinks, then he knows very little about the internet and its potential. If done correctly, he could possible sell more albums per release than he has sold since the 1980's. Plus, Mr. Ferry should face the fact that he does not have mass appeal or the recording companies would be all over him! I say, 'Swallow your foolish pride. - Get with it or wither on the vine!' Mt two cents. KBP ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:03:16 EST From: KWil632057@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Roxy's legacy ? Well I won't be crossing your palm with silver KB. The point is that Ferry covers Dylan (and virtually everybody else). But who covers Ferry (Ian McShane's classy cover of Avalon accepted)? J In a message dated 22/02/2005 14:58:22 GMT Standard Time, kbporte@attglobal.net writes: For instance, Bryan Ferry does Bob Dylan (and yes, Jonathan, I do know what you are thinking right now:). ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:17:44 EST From: KWil632057@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Online Label You only need to look at the unending Frantic tour to see that is precisely what he thinks! J In a message dated 22/02/2005 15:05:23 GMT Standard Time, kbporte@attglobal.net writes: Plus, Mr. Ferry should face the fact that he does not have mass appeal or the recording companies would be all over him! ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 15:29:48 +0000 From: "Andrew Shearer" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Online Label Then again on the other hand I'm sure a "cultish" following would appeal. I suspect he doesn't know which way to turn - Mamouna was being true to himself - but low sales/ low critical acclaim; As Time Goes By / Frantic more mainstream (though both with the Ferry tinge/ constant touring etc - he feels more popular. I think he's probably running out of "populist steam" and willl fall into himself sooner or later. Personally I don't think all is lost. I'm bored at the moment but I think he'll surprise us again. I think One Way Love* gave a hint of that. Andrew *Okay I was joking, I meant "I thought", "Cruel", "Hiroshima" "San Simeon" etc >From: KB Porter >To: "avalon@smoe.org" >Subject: Re: [AVALON] Online Label >Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 10:05:44 -0500 > >"The trouble is that in Ferry's eyes internet only albums >will amount to >admitting a lack of wide appeal." > > >If that is what Ferry thinks, then he knows very little >about the internet and its potential. If done correctly, he >could possible sell more albums per release than he has sold >since the 1980's. Plus, Mr. Ferry should face the fact that >he does not have mass appeal or the recording companies >would be all over him! > >I say, 'Swallow your foolish pride. - Get with it or wither >on the vine!' > >Mt two cents. KBP > > >___________________________________________________________________________ >To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 11:11:59 -0500 From: KB Porter Subject: Re: [AVALON] Online Label "Personally I don't think all is lost. I'm bored at the moment but I think he'll surprise us again. I think One Way Love* gave a hint of that." HA HA!!! I harbor the same hope as you, Andrew. There just has to be much more that the man hasn't tapped out - it's inside him, and perhaps he'll overcome what ever it is that is blocking his creativity. And "Cultist" is a perfect description for Ferry's following. He's too good to have 'mass appeal'! Best wishes. KBP ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 17:05:18 +0000 From: "Christian H. Soetemann" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Online Label/mass appeal For me it's: if only he let loose of the idea of mass appeal, he might get to do the music he's actually interested in. Always big production, top of the world session musicians, fourteen guitars instead of two or three - why that? He could get into a room (his home studio maybe) with Manzanera, Mackay, Thompson and a bass player (or play 'experimental bass' himself, ha, ha) and they'd be able to rehearse and record tracks, without having to release it as RM if they prefer not to. What's the improvement of recording in expensive places when it doesn't make the music better or worse? 'Mamouna' is multi-layered and that constitutes the album's identity (regardless of whether John Doe tends to like that). What became 'Frantic' has obviously gone through a billion reshapes, and not always for the better of it. Besides: even if BF didn't want to release his albums via a net label (Aimee Mann has been quite successful with this and earned more money than she ever did when releasing via big labels), he could offer rare live recordings on the www. But no, every release has got to be re-considered a million times until it's allowed to hit the public. Much of the trouble is, I would tend to say, due to a lack of flexibility, spontaneity and will to experiment. The talent, the quality is all there, but it's fenced in. So he'll be able to put out maybe one or two more records which I'm sure will be fine, but it might not be what could be. "Now, forget all of this" (Robert Fripp) CHS > You only need to look at the unending Frantic tour to see that is precisely > what he thinks! > > J > > > In a message dated 22/02/2005 15:05:23 GMT Standard Time, > kbporte@attglobal.net writes: > > > Plus, Mr. Ferry should face the fact that > he does not have mass appeal or the recording companies > would be all over him! ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 21:51:56 +0100 (CET) From: robert@rwhiteford.freeserve.co.uk Subject: [AVALON] Clink/Legacy i was probably exaggerating to make a point. The trouble is not the first 2 minutes of WWTT it's the pointless meandering for 5 minutes plus. I do quite like the song but not the dragging it out for ages. How many Ferry / Roxy Classics leave you wanting more ? Loads of 'em -Virginia Plain, YPS, etc. Others which lasted longer like MOP did so for a reason. The Name of the Game is another one thats 3 minutes too long. It smacks of lack of ideas to drag out time like this. Enjoyed the post on legacy - good quality stuff - and it reminded me of Jocelyn saying that on the Mamouna tour he lost his mystery/enigma for her. I do like solo as well as Roxy stuff. It is really sad to think that Horoscope and Alphaville in particular got turned into sterile products from what sounds like very interesting start points. Just listen to the way Cruel and Simeon have been battered into AOR songs. Ferry achieved his icon status (and isn't that a large part of his legacy?) and attracted an audience by producing non mainstream eclectic stuff which was so good, so unique, that people were fascinated by it. Things like Cruel and San Simeon in fact before they were glossed and fluffed up. And " I Thought". Put these songs on FYP and they would be hailed as Roxy classics. Water them down and they are coffee table muzak. And although I would expect disagreement from fans of old Roxy it IS Bryan Ferry who will leave a legacy, not a band who last made a ground breaking album 32 years ago. But thats cos he's cool and is of tabloid interest as well as the music.I wasn't impressed by the reunion tour. Very slick- superficial even , but a poor second to the atgb triumph. No songs speeded up on that tour. Any verses cut out ? Don't think so. After that plane near miss thing and to be honest the emotional turmoil he must have endured more recently I was hoping for a Bride Stripped Bare type response. Some EMOTION. It must seem mad to all but the most ardent of fans, but I still know he can turn it round and make something else to demand our attention before he becomes a cabaret act. You'll know that for sure when we get the first "medley" of Jealous Guy/LST/LITD with a minute of each. Cheers Rob - ----- > > Rob, I would be interested to learn how you differentiate the 'drawn out > rubbish' from the 'real' stuff? I mean, both songs have I think two chords > > > > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon > - -- Whatever you Wanadoo: http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/ This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more at: http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 19:13:34 -0000 From: "Thomas Wallace" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Online Label - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrew Shearer" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2005 3:29 PM Subject: Re: [AVALON] Online Label > Personally I don't think all is lost. I'm bored at the moment but I think > he'll surprise us again. I think One Way Love* gave a hint of that. > > *Okay I was joking, I meant "I thought", "Cruel", "Hiroshima" "San Simeon" > etc Just a pity that all of these track were about four or five years old when they were finally released. He may well be creating some new wonders, but I have this awful nagging doubt that what we may be in are some reworked originals that will date back about eight years and some "new" coverversions though these may well have their origins between eight to four years back. Loosing patience, Tom. ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2005 16:41:18 EST From: KWil632057@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Online Label Which is fine Tom, as we are not meant to have heard the unreleased stuff until it was officially released! ;0) J In a message dated 22/02/2005 21:35:43 GMT Standard Time, thom.wallace@ntlworld.com writes: Just a pity that all of these track were about four or five years old when they were finally released. ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ End of avalon-digest V10 #41 **************************** ======================================================================== For further info, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: info avalon-digest