From: owner-avalon-digest@smoe.org (avalon-digest) To: avalon-digest@smoe.org Subject: avalon-digest V9 #240 Reply-To: avalon@smoe.org Sender: owner-avalon-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-avalon-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk avalon-digest Wednesday, September 22 2004 Volume 09 : Number 240 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [AVALON] Paris concert. ["Sjaak Versluis" ] [AVALON] Chink of light [Chandla911@aol.com] [AVALON] Censorship [KWil632057@aol.com] [AVALON] SOTW: "Boys and Girls" [Colleen Matan ] Re: [AVALON] Censorship [Colleen Matan ] Re: [AVALON] Censorship [KWil632057@aol.com] Re: [AVALON] Censorship [Colleen Matan ] Re: [AVALON] SOTW: "Boys And Girls" [Joel Hurd ] =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_[AVALON]_SOTW:_=A0"Boys_and_Girls"?= [robert@rwhitefor] Re: [AVALON] Censorship [KWil632057@aol.com] Re: [AVALON] Censorship [Jocelynfiske@aol.com] Re: [AVALON] SOTW: "Boys and Girls" [Daniel Atterbom ] Re: [AVALON] Censorship [Colleen Matan ] RE: [AVALON] new Leonard Cohen ["Guy Lawley" ] Re: [AVALON] Censorship [Jocelynfiske@aol.com] Re: [AVALON] Censorship [Helene Kremer ] Re: [AVALON] Censorship [KWil632057@aol.com] Re: [AVALON] Censorship ["Thomas Wallace" ] [AVALON] Casblanca (slightly OT) ["Thomas Wallace" ] Re: [AVALON] Censorship [Miles Goosens ] Re: [AVALON] Censorship [Heather Marie Buch ] To leave the list, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon-digest ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 09:37:16 +0200 From: "Sjaak Versluis" Subject: [AVALON] Paris concert. Does someone have the full setlist of the Bryan Ferry performance at the Grand Rex on 09 march 2000. And is this full show available on CD-R? (I hope so) Please send me your replys off-list. Sjaak ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 05:27:29 -0400 From: Chandla911@aol.com Subject: [AVALON] Chink of light Amid all the discourse (now offlist) about the rights and (surely) wrongs of fox hunting and the lethargy/apathy surrounding BF's current "career choices", I've listened the past couple of days to As Time Goes By for what is the first time since the Roxy re-union tour and Frantic took my ear off that particular recording. So the first play in a couple of years. You know, it's actually very good. Sure every single song is a cover, but there's always been an element of ATGB in Ferry's solo output. Despite the reasons for the need to cover material rather than write it, this album is very much like he decided to get it out of his system in one fell swoop. And thank goodness he did. In case you don't know, Rod Stewart has ready in the wings Volume III (yes, three) of his American Songbook project for October release. Who knew there was a way for Rod to make even more money than he was already making? Bryan Ferry's "equivalent" project gets it all out on one slim volume and his attention to detail in the arrangements (or Colin Good's, depending on your point of view) means that the setting is just right. It's easy to update this material (and I'm In The Mood For Love demonstrates this), but largely it is in the traditional settings that Ferry's voice and affection for the originals come across to best effect. I am glad the album did not sell well enough to have Virgin whisk him back into the studio for Volumes II and III. It's probably not a recording destined for ever-repeat plays, but a precious gem to treasure every so often when the pace of life is getting a bit too much (and the Andy Mackay SAMAS album hasn't been delivered yet...or the Brian Eno Thursday Afternoon isn't close to hand). Just what IS stopping these guys from recording something together? Best wishes Richard Mills n/p This Is Where You Ain't - Glenn Tilbrook ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 05:44:33 EDT From: KWil632057@aol.com Subject: [AVALON] Censorship I don't like it. J ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 06:29:51 -0400 (EDT) From: Colleen Matan Subject: [AVALON] SOTW: "Boys and Girls" Please note: - --Participation in this thread is not "mandatory". - --All other threads underway continue as before, and you are welcome to start any other on-topic threads you wish. If you hate this this thread, I'll always start it with "SOTW:" in the header so you can put it in your killfile and never have to read the discussion. Without further ado: The song of the week is "Boys and Girls" from the album _Boys and Girls_. As before the discussion is open to anything related to the song, and these are only suggestions: love it? hate it? lyrics/music it changed my life live vs. studio version(s) (if applicable) the video (if any) that reminds me... Boys And Girls (Ferry) I'm a stranger in your town That's the place I belong Laid behind the frame And the curtain's torn again A wailing saxophone You know it's all in my song All the sin that I can take But you don't even know my name Boys and girls Boys and girls Boys and girls You've got no sense of fun But you know I've one All the good has turned to bad And you know what I think of that No time to dream No time to sigh No time to kill When love walks by And who's that crying in the street? Death is a friend I've yet to meet Boys and girls Boys and girls Boys and girls Boys and girls ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 06:39:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Colleen Matan Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship On Tue, 21 Sep 2004 KWil632057@aol.com wrote: > I don't like it. I don't like it either, but sometimes I don't know what else to do. I asked that an off-topic, highly divisive discussion--which had already been hashed out in great, and sometimes nasty, detail last year--not be continued on list. I knew that without fail the on-list response from some quarters would be the same rudeness and belittling which seems now to be the automatic response to such requests on my part, so, since such discussions make a lot of extra, and unnecessary, work for me, I made things easier for myself. I let a lot of stuff just go; but I am not going to put the list through another flame fest over fox hunting. There are myriad places to discuss this topic and I don't want Avalon to be one of them. I don't think I am alone in that desire. By this point we all know who has an opinion on the subject and how to get in touch with them off-list. Colleen ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 06:57:32 EDT From: KWil632057@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship But rather than playing God why not accept that those who hate the thread and don't want a part of it can just delete when they see the header as you suggest on SOTW. J In a message dated 21/09/2004 11:46:23 GMT Daylight Time, cjem@his.com writes: I don't like it either, but sometimes I don't know what else to do. I asked that an off-topic, highly divisive discussion--which had already been hashed out in great, and sometimes nasty, detail last year--not be continued on list. I knew that without fail the on-list response from some quarters would be the same rudeness and belittling which seems now to be the automatic response to such requests on my part, so, since such discussions make a lot of extra, and unnecessary, work for me, I made things easier for myself. I let a lot of stuff just go; but I am not going to put the list through another flame fest over fox hunting. There are myriad places to discuss this topic and I don't want Avalon to be one of them. I don't think I am alone in that desire. By this point we all know who has an opinion on the subject and how to get in touch with them off-list. Colleen ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 07:10:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Colleen Matan Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship On Tue, 21 Sep 2004 KWil632057@aol.com wrote: > But rather than playing God why not accept that those who hate the > thread and don't want a part of it can just delete when they see the > header as you suggest on SOTW. Simple. The SOTW is an on-topic thread. Fox hunting--not the posts about Otis being involved, or Bryan's interviews on the subject b/c those are tangentially on-topic--but the discussion of the morality of or need for fox hunting is not. Furthermore, such discusion always ends up with people yelling at each other and that's unnecessary on Avalon. (I'll do the same thing with respect to posts about the upcoming US election.) In addition to private email between interested parties, there are plenty of other public places to discuss this topic. It is unlikely that I will change my mind about this distinction. M has kindly set up an off-topic chatter list for the folks of Avalon at: http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/OT-avalon/ (although she may not want a flamefest there either). Colleen ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 04:34:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Joel Hurd Subject: Re: [AVALON] SOTW: "Boys And Girls" I've never really focused on the lyrics to Boys And Girls much, because I'm always intent on the mysterious atmosphere that Ferry created in the song. It's a great song, certainly a top ten solo effort for me from Ferry. A slow, lurking, powerful song. Great stuff. - ---joel > The song of the week is "Boys and Girls" from the album _Boys and > Girls_. > > As before the discussion is open to anything related to the song, > and these are only suggestions: > > love it? hate it? > lyrics/music > it changed my life > live vs. studio version(s) (if applicable) > the video (if any) > that reminds me... __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail is new and improved - Check it out! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 07:45:01 EDT From: KWil632057@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship Dangerous precedents, dangerous precedents. I'm sorry but I disapprove of censorship. Most of the posts involved have reference to Ferry who, lets face it, is getting the best press coverage since the plane started to go down. It's not as if the list is clogged up with exciting news and speculation about a new album. This is the hot Ferry topic at present. I find news of Leonard Cohen's new album insufferably dull and far further away from the topic than news of a political issue which features Bryan Ferry's family at the very centre. But you won't be banning Leonard. Instead I act like a grown up and press delete when I see Leonard Cohen in my inbox. At this rate, you'll have Otis running round your house... ;0) J ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 13:27:04 +0100 From: "Thomas Wallace" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2004 12:45 PM Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship > This is the hot Ferry topic at present. It may be a hot Ferry topic, but it is a topic centred on Otis Ferry not his father. I don't remember Otis Ferry having joined Roxy Music or working on his fathers albums therfore I would sugest that it is best left off list. Tom. - ----- End forwarded message ----- ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 15:44:41 +0200 (CEST) From: robert@rwhiteford.freeserve.co.uk Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Re:_[AVALON]_SOTW:_=A0"Boys_and_Girls"?= Its a terrific song from a terrific album. He called the album after this one because he thought it would get more attention. This is the sort of weird but compelling atmospheric track that I wish he still made. Your Painted Smile could have been treated similarly. One of his best and he has performed it a lots of shows. Although Live Aid was surely not the occasion........Well produced too - unlike Bete Noire and Mamouna. Other artists don't do songs like Boys and Girls, because they can't. - -- Whatever you Wanadoo: http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/time/ This email has been checked for most known viruses - find out more at: http://www.wanadoo.co.uk/help/id/7098.htm ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 10:12:07 EDT From: KWil632057@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship In a message dated 21/09/2004 15:08:34 GMT Daylight Time, thom.wallace@ntlworld.com writes: I don't remember Otis Ferry having joined Roxy Music or working on his fathers albums He is credited on 'Cruel' on Ferry's most recent album, Frantic actually Tom. J ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 10:22:43 -0400 From: Jocelynfiske@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship Otis "played" whip on Cruel, so still on topic as far as your argument goes, mate. Personally, I love censorship, the minute I see a censorship warning on something I buy it. ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 16:23:43 +0200 From: Daniel Atterbom Subject: Re: [AVALON] SOTW: "Boys and Girls" >Well produced too - >unlike Bete Noire and Mamouna. Why is this, you think? I like the production of Mamouna. Is Rhett Davies a better co-producer then Robin Trower for Mr Ferry? NP Boys & Girls, the CD - -- Daniel ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 18:43:24 +0200 (METDST) From: Heather Marie Buch Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship On Tue, 21 Sep 2004, Colleen Matan wrote: > Furthermore, such discusion always ends up with people yelling at each > other and that's unnecessary on Avalon. (I'll do the same thing with > respect to posts about the upcoming US election.) In addition to private > email between interested parties, there are plenty of other public places > to discuss this topic. As someone who yelled about politics on Avalon a few years ago, I agree with Colleen. There are many debates which may be good to discuss someplace else, but can easily consume the list for weeks. Besides, differences on these issues divide list members who might otherwise get along just fine as fellow Roxy Music fans. Sorry to those who were offended or bored by my Leonard Cohen posting. I doubt it'll start a big discussion. Anyway, are postings about other musicians off-topic? Heather ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 13:03:56 -0400 From: Colleen Matan Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship Quoting "" : > I'm sorry but I disapprove of censorship. Most of the posts involved have > reference to Ferry who, lets face it, is getting the best press coverage > since the plane started to go down. Discussion of the press coverage (links to articles, questions they raise, etc.) is fine. The only thing off limits is the on-list discussion of the pros and cons of fox hunting itself. > It's not as if the list is clogged up with exciting news and speculation > about a new album. This is the hot Ferry topic at present. The list being quiet has nothing to do with the suitability of this topic. I am under the assumption that folks here would prefer silence to many divisive, off-topic posts. (or am I wrong?) > I find news of Leonard Cohen's new album insufferably dull and far further > away from the topic than news of a political issue which features Bryan > Ferry's family at the very centre. But you won't be banning Leonard. Instead > I act like a grown up and press delete when I see Leonard Cohen in my inbox. I prefer that the list keep its focus, but I understand that from time to time we'll have some OT stuff crop up. And no, I won't be banning Leonard Cohen for the simple reason that discussion about LC doesn't devolve into people yelling at each other. That's the problem with fox hunting (and political discussion). Is there another way I can put this so it will make sense? > At this rate, you'll have Otis running round your house... ;0) He's welcome to try! Colleen ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 19:12:53 +0100 From: "Guy Lawley" Subject: RE: [AVALON] new Leonard Cohen Well, dear Heather, you've certainly got me sussed! Guy - -----Original Message----- From: owner-avalon@smoe.org [mailto:owner-avalon@smoe.org] On Behalf Of Heather Marie Buch Sent: 20 September 2004 06:57 To: avalon@smoe.org Subject: RE: [AVALON] new Leonard Cohen You're just jealous because it's not called "Dear Guy"! Heather On Sun, 19 Sep 2004, Guy Lawley wrote: > I hear it's a concept album about the exorbitant price of moorland > vegetation these days > > Guy > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-avalon@smoe.org [mailto:owner-avalon@smoe.org] On Behalf Of > Heather Marie Buch > Sent: 19 September 2004 19:21 > To: avalon@smoe.org > Subject: [AVALON] new Leonard Cohen > > Wow, I just looked on Amazon and discovered that Leonard's new album is > called "Dear Heather". I like that title! > > Heather ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 14:15:50 EDT From: Jocelynfiske@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship In a message dated 21/09/2004 18:52:06 GMT Standard Time, thom.wallace@ntlworld.com writes: <... it is a topic centred on Otis Ferry not his father. I don't remember Otis Ferry having joined Roxy Music or working on his fathers albums Tom. > Otis "played" whip on Cruel, so still on topic as far as your argument > > goes, mate. >Don't agree as the discussion being put forward is his involvment in what can loosly be described as a sport and his illegal activities in supporting it, > Oh sorry Tom, the inference from your sentence structure was that if Otis had joined Roxy Music or played on his father's album, then it was an on topic subject. My mistake....or then again.... ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 09:40:11 -0700 From: Helene Kremer Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship Yes, but we haven't joined this group to discuss Otis or his politics. We joined to discuss his father and his father's former band..... Helene On Tuesday, September 21, 2004, at 07:12 AM, KWil632057@aol.com wrote: > IHe is credited on 'Cruel' on Ferry's most recent album, Frantic > actually > Tom. > > > J ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 14:26:08 EDT From: KWil632057@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship And Lucy, who Tom might like to know was on the cover of Avalon, was arrested on the same day and at the same protest as Otis! Hooray it's On Topic!!! J In a message dated 21/09/2004 19:19:49 GMT Daylight Time, Jocelynfiske@aol.com writes: In a message dated 21/09/2004 18:52:06 GMT Standard Time, thom.wallace@ntlworld.com writes: <... it is a topic centred on Otis Ferry not his father. I don't remember Otis Ferry having joined Roxy Music or working on his fathers albums Tom. > Otis "played" whip on Cruel, so still on topic as far as your argument > > goes, mate. >Don't agree as the discussion being put forward is his involvment in what can loosly be described as a sport and his illegal activities in supporting it, > Oh sorry Tom, the inference from your sentence structure was that if Otis had joined Roxy Music or played on his father's album, then it was an on topic subject. My mistake....or then again.... ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 18:51:51 +0100 From: "Thomas Wallace" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ""Thomas Wallace"" ; ""Avalon"" Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2004 3:22 PM Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship > Otis "played" whip on Cruel, so still on topic as far as your argument goes, mate. Don't agree as the discussion being put forward is his involvment in what can loosly be described as a sport and his illegal activities in supporting it, now if the postings were about him playing with his whip as a percussion instrument then it would be on topic if rather limited in it's scope. Tom. ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 19:18:01 +0100 From: "Thomas Wallace" Subject: [AVALON] Casblanca (slightly OT) I was wondering if any of our members from across the pond have ever seen the colourized version of Casablanca and could let me know how well done/poorly done the conversion was carried out, likewise with the colourized versions of The Maltese Falcon and The Longest Day which I don't think were shown/released over here. Now I say slightly OT because there have been so many references to Casablanca in Ferry's work over the years I see it as a great indicator to what influenced him. Here's lookin' at you kid, Tom ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 17:10:02 EDT From: KWil632057@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship And you really think Otis' politics are so very different from his fathers? J In a message dated 21/09/2004 19:53:49 GMT Daylight Time, helchat@earthlink.net writes: Yes, but we haven't joined this group to discuss Otis or his politics. We joined to discuss his father and his father's former band..... Helene ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 23:50:10 +0100 (BST) From: Chris Turner Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship Mrs F appears at Bow Street Court tomorrow I believe, charged with 'obstructing a public highway'. When arrested, she gave her occupation as 'student'. Lucy was famously photgraphed by the late Robert Mapplethorpe. Bet he would have been able to tell Otis what to do with his whip... Chris --- KWil632057@aol.com wrote: > And Lucy, who Tom might like to know was on the cover of Avalon, was > arrested on the same day and at the same protest as Otis! > > Hooray it's On Topic!!! > > J ___________________________________________________________ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Sep 2004 16:42:13 -0500 From: Miles Goosens Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship At 07:10 AM 9/21/2004 -0400, Colleen Matan wrote: >It is unlikely that I will change my mind about this distinction. And in a world where some of us live under the USA Patriot Act, calling Colleen's choice "censorship" seems a bit much. later, Miles ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Sep 2004 08:41:55 +0200 (METDST) From: Heather Marie Buch Subject: Re: [AVALON] Censorship Y'all are taking this a little too far... I think a discussion of Ferry's family in the news, a discussion of old Bogart movies or other rock musicians from the 70's cannot possibly be construed as "off-topic". I am certain that the list welcomes broad discussions inspired by a variety of outside topics. It's just the really politically contentious stuff that doesn't belong, simply because once it starts, it never stops! Heather On Tue, 21 Sep 2004, Helene Kremer wrote: > Yes, but we haven't joined this group to discuss Otis or his politics. > We joined to discuss his father and his father's former band..... > > Helene > > On Tuesday, September 21, 2004, at 07:12 AM, KWil632057@aol.com wrote: > > > IHe is credited on 'Cruel' on Ferry's most recent album, Frantic > > actually > > Tom. > > > > > > J > > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ End of avalon-digest V9 #240 **************************** ======================================================================== For further info, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: info avalon-digest