From: owner-avalon-digest@smoe.org (avalon-digest) To: avalon-digest@smoe.org Subject: avalon-digest V8 #55 Reply-To: avalon@smoe.org Sender: owner-avalon-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-avalon-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk avalon-digest Wednesday, February 26 2003 Volume 08 : Number 055 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [AVALON] Re:Grammy's/Brits [Alanandalyj@aol.com] Re: [AVALON] Fw: She Sells ["Heather Buch" ] Re: [AVALON] John Swannel ["Andrew Shearer" ] [AVALON] Re: Alphaville on Ebay [Bruce MacQueen ] Re: [AVALON] [Avalon] Alphaville on Ebay ["Colette Robertson" ] Re: [AVALON] Fw: She Sells ["Paula Brown" ] [AVALON] You say potato ["Karin Whitney" ] Re: [AVALON] Fw: She Sells [Colleen Matan ] Fwd: Re: [AVALON] You say potato [Go2Sweeney@aol.com] Re: [AVALON] Re: Fw: She Sells [DEAGLERR@aol.com] Re: [AVALON] John Swannel [OBrienFerry@aol.com] Re: [AVALON] Re: Alphaville on Ebay ["Judy Kaufman" ] Re: [AVALON] Fw: She Sells ["Heather Buch" ] [AVALON] hash browns, coffee, and cigars ["Heather Buch" ] Re: [AVALON] Re: Fw: She Sells [DEAGLERR@aol.com] [AVALON] Sad news, about sound and treatments and a thru muse! ["cor broe] Re: [AVALON] Fw: She Sells [David Neuhaus ] [AVALON] Grind it, baby ["Heather Buch" ] [AVALON] FW: She Sells ["Heather Buch" ] Re: [AVALON] She smells ["Heather Buch" ] To leave the list, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon-digest ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 04:49:28 EST From: Alanandalyj@aol.com Subject: [AVALON] Re:Grammy's/Brits I haven't seen the Grammys but surely they can't have been worse than the Brits,Full of talentless nobodies eg Will Young ,Pink,Sugarbabes,Justin Timberlake etc.Highlight of brits for me The Gary Numan sample on Sugarbabes track that's how appalling the show was.I've said it before when are Roxy /Bryan going to get the recognition they deserve in this country.At least Eno got some via U2. Alan ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Avalonians on tour 2002: http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html US ticket sale info: http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 11:02:06 +0100 From: "Heather Buch" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Fw: She Sells On Mon, 24 Feb 2003 17:28:51 -0500 (EST), Colleen Matan wrote > OK, I've been holding my tongue on this, but now I gotta say it. > "The daily grind" is not about coffee or chocolate (?). Or monkeys > or organs, for that matter. It is a metaphor and an action entwined > with something necessary to life, but it's not coffee--that's a > function of the Starbuckization of the world over the last 10 years. > > The daily grind is a metaphor for the banality of life, of the drudgery > that many face. It has its roots in the fact that prior to there > being a Safeway or a Tesco on every corner, every day grain or rice > had to be ground for (the daily) bread, and in ancient times, that > bread was over half, and as much as 3/4 of your sustenance. It was > necessary, inescapable, life-sustaining, and a daily chore. > I should also say, obviously, in She Sells, the "daily grind" could be a reference to the banality of the daily workaday world, grinding tbe daily bread, etc. But given that Ferry was also an artist and seems to appreciate Duchamp's work, I would not be surprised if he had thrown a reference to the artist's extremely rich socially critical symbolism into this song, as Ferry did with other works. Best, Heather ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Avalonians on tour 2002: http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html US ticket sale info: http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 14:19:30 +0000 From: "Andrew Shearer" Subject: Re: [AVALON] John Swannel Was the above not Ferry's photographer during some shoots in the Eighties? There's an article about him in the Times (supp) today, haven't read it but there doesn't seem to be any mention of Ferry. Regards, Andrew _________________________________________________________________ Worried what your kids see online? Protect them better with MSN 8 http://join.msn.com/?page=features/parental&pgmarket=en-gb&XAPID=186&DI=1059 ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Avalonians on tour 2002: http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html US ticket sale info: http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 06:10:29 -0800 From: Bruce MacQueen Subject: [AVALON] Re: Alphaville on Ebay This item has come up a couple of times. I have e-mailed their "fraud unit" advising them it's stolen material (and probably a cd-r) but the last one sold for over $100 as I recall. Best Regards, Bruce avalon-digest wrote: Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 00:22:04 EST From: Gal410@aol.com Subject: [AVALON] [Avalon] Alphaville on Ebay I was just searching on Ebay for the remastered version of For Your Pleasure, when to my surprise I see 'Alphaville' for sale. Currently the bidding is at 56.00 !! The cd has a collage of pictures of BF on the front. Could this be the work of someone from Avalon............................? The name sounds a bit familiar, but I should not speculate. Heidi - - "What's so funny 'bout peace, love & understanding?" Nick Lowe ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Avalonians on tour 2002: http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html US ticket sale info: http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 12:48:09 -0000 From: "Colette Robertson" Subject: Re: [AVALON] [Avalon] Alphaville on Ebay I think that's the third one from the same seller in the last few weeks I have seen on there. The last one went for about $112.00 when the auction closed. Colette - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2003 5:22 AM Subject: [AVALON] [Avalon] Alphaville on Ebay > I was just searching on Ebay for the remastered version > of For Your Pleasure, when to my surprise I see 'Alphaville' > for sale. Currently the bidding is at 56.00 !! The cd has a > collage of pictures of BF on the front. > Could this be the work of someone from Avalon............................? > The name sounds a bit familiar, but I should not speculate. > > Heidi > > NP- Kasey Chambers - Barricades and Brickwalls > > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon > Avalonians on tour 2002: http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html > US ticket sale info: http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Avalonians on tour 2002: http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html US ticket sale info: http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 10:50:06 EST From: KWil632057@aol.com Subject: [AVALON] Alphaville Just imagine my lazy attitude when now my useless self talks balletic ego comes out in nights intelligence notwithstanding grace. I think im nice. Weapon X (Thinking of Dale Cooper's key detection advice in David Lynch's Twin Peaks.) n/p Sadness 'Enigma' ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Avalonians on tour 2002: http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html US ticket sale info: http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 08:31:54 -0800 From: "Karin Whitney" Subject: [AVALON] Fw: the daily grind - ----- Original Message ----- From: Karin Whitney To: Colleen Matan Sent: Tuesday, February 25, 2003 8:31 AM Subject: the daily grind Of course most of us all know that the "daily grind" is the 9-5 or 8-6, the grimacing work day, but since the 50's it's coffee! That you need to face the daily grind. It's part of the American make-up. Karin ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Avalonians on tour 2002: http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html US ticket sale info: http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 10:34:46 -0600 From: "Paula Brown" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Fw: She Sells Did people REALLY THINK IT MEANT COFFEE? Colleen is totally right. I never thought it could be any other. "the daily grind" is a very old, very commonplace expression, at least in the central and southern US. When people say it, they're just saying they're going to work, as usual. And then the "machine" business after that is talking about the same thing and the proof is in the labored instrumentation accompanying it and, of course, the reference to 9 to 5. But really, whatever works for you. That's what's wonderful about art. XXX, Paula > On Mon, 24 Feb 2003 17:28:51 -0500 (EST), Colleen Matan wrote > > > > OK, I've been holding my tongue on this, but now I gotta say it. > > "The daily grind" is not about coffee or chocolate (?). Or monkeys > > or organs, for that matter. It is a metaphor and an action entwined > > with something necessary to life, ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Avalonians on tour 2002: http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html US ticket sale info: http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 08:51:22 -0800 From: "Karin Whitney" Subject: [AVALON] You say potato One of the greatest gifts we have is the right to freedom of expression. I realize that many folk interpret Mr. Ferry's lyrics as quasi-political. I couldn't disagree more. He is a romantic sensualist, blurry-eyed from love. Now Dylan, he's political. It's so easy when dissecting, line by line, a songs lyrics, one's own personal interpretation of the meaning. Lets agree that it is an individual lyrical interpretation. There is no way that any of us actually know what is in the song writers mind when he/she writes a song. Only that person can hold the answer. Otherwise it is only speculation my friends. And it certainly creates an arena for lively debate! You say potato, Karin ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Avalonians on tour 2002: http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html US ticket sale info: http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 11:49:04 -0500 (EST) From: Colleen Matan Subject: Re: [AVALON] Fw: She Sells On Tue, 25 Feb 2003, Paula Brown wrote: > Did people REALLY THINK IT MEANT COFFEE? Colleen is totally right. I > never thought it could be any other. "the daily grind" is a very old, > very commonplace expression, at least in the central and southern US. > When people say it, they're just saying they're going to work, as usual. > And then the "machine" business after that is talking about the same > thing and the proof is in the labored instrumentation accompanying it > and, of course, the reference to 9 to 5. But really, whatever works for > you. That's what's wonderful about art. No, no, no. I am obviously an illiterate about things artistic. The late breaking news is that *everything* Mr. Ferry has written has to connect with something that Marcel Duchamp did, preferably _The Large Glass_, but any other item will do in a pinch. This means all of the Song of the Week discussions will have to be revisited and re-cut to fit accordingly. And because of this, the list's name is being changed immediately to "Fountain." Update your address books accordingly. Signed, R Mutt ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Avalonians on tour 2002: http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html US ticket sale info: http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 11:54:41 -0500 From: Go2Sweeney@aol.com Subject: Fwd: Re: [AVALON] You say potato Return-Path: Received: from aol.com (mow-m25.webmail.aol.com [64.12.137.2]) by air-id11.mx.aol.com (v90_r2.5) with ESMTP id MAILINID111-0225115352; Tue, 25 Feb 2003 11:53:52 -0500 Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 11:53:52 -0500 From: Go2Sweeney@aol.com To: kwjazz4@attbi.com ("Karin Whitney") Subject: Re: [AVALON] You say potato MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <78D40CFE.21E52610.0B2FDA00@aol.com> X-Mailer: Atlas Mailer 2.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In an email dated Tue, 25 Feb 2003 4:51:22 pm GMT, "Karin Whitney" writes: >One of the greatest gifts we have is the right to freedom of expression. I >realize that many folk interpret Mr. Ferry's lyrics as quasi-political. I >couldn't disagree more. He is a romantic sensualist, blurry-eyed from love. >Now Dylan, he's political. It's so easy when dissecting, line by line, a songs Political? Who thinks Bryan Ferry's lyrics are political? Nothing could be further from the truth. Also, Bob Dylan is not as political as John Lennon was (and that is not open to interpretation, it's all quite clear in his "Sometime in New York City" album. Goodie >___________________________________________________________________________ >To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon >Avalonians on tour 2002: http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html >US ticket sale info: http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Avalonians on tour 2002: http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html US ticket sale info: http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 12:54:15 EST From: DEAGLERR@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Re: Fw: She Sells Made-up eyes, make up MY mind! A closer reading of the lyric might serve. She Sells has zip to do with coffee, bread or Duchamp. >I should also say, obviously, in She Sells, the "daily grind" could be a >reference to the banality of the daily workaday world, grinding the daily >bread, etc. But given that Ferry was also an artist and seems to appreciate >Duchamp's work, I would not be surprised if he had thrown a reference to the >artist's extremely rich socially critical symbolism into this song, as Ferry >did with other works. "extremely rich socially critical symbolism" Duchamp as social critic? Not in the way you mean. Reading Marxist theory again, Heather? I thought that crap was way-tired by now. "sometimes a cigar is just a cigar", Freud Not even close, no cigar for you. - ----------------------------------------- RE: Grammys Can ANYONE on this list explain the allure of No Doubt? That Gwen Stephani chick gives me a major pain. Regards R Deagle Chocolate Grinder#1 (1913) two studies (1914) Chocolate Grinder #2 (1914) which was traced onto the Large Glass (The Bride Stripped...) (declared finished 1923) and "reproduced " on the cover of The Blind Man (1917) ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 13:57:25 EST From: OBrienFerry@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] John Swannel In a message dated 25/02/03 14:21:32 GMT Standard Time, shearerandrew@hotmail.com writes: > Was the above not Ferry's photographer during some shoots in the Eighties? > There's an article about him in the Times (supp) today, haven't read it but > > there doesn't seem to be any mention of Ferry. He is credited on The Bride Stripped Bare & The Ultimate collection http://www.vivaroxymusic.com:8080/1389 J.O'B. ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 13:47:25 -0600 From: "Judy Kaufman" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Re: Alphaville on Ebay On February 25, 2003 at 8:10 AM Bruce MacQueen wrote: >This item has come up a couple of times. I looked over the items offered on e-bay and noticed a recording of the Buenos Aires show from what - a week ago? While I would like to have it, I wouldn't pay more than B&P or a trade. Judy ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 19:49:39 -0000 From: "thom.wallace" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Production thoughts > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mark Yates" > To: "thom.wallace" > Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 11:22 PM > Subject: Re: [AVALON] Production thoughts > > > Tom I really coudn't care less about your opinions of Bowie. > > I'm sure the great man will survive without your support. > > The chain was about production....what are your views on it Tom rather > than > > contradicitng me. > > Lets hear of your choice in the production of music. > > Mark Well if you had bothered to think about it I was actually agreeing with most of your list with exception of Bowie. Producers are like the artists they produce in that the quality of their work goes up and down over a period of time and their best work can usually be placed within a certain section of their careers. Names that come to mind of people who have produced great works could include Roy Thomas Baker for his work on the Queen albums in the seventies, or Martin Rushent who produced amongst others the Human League in the eighties. Other great producers of their time could include Tom Dowd, Jerry Wexler, Quincy Jones and even Gus Dugeon. As a fan of Roxy I might even have included Chris Thomas in the above list, but for the fact that I've never really thought very highly of his work on Siren. On the mentioning of Siren I seem to remember from the interviews given at the time of it's release mentioned that it's sound was more basic than Country Life as a way of getting away from the amount of tracks used when they recorded that album. I've never really been convinced that artists actually make good producers of their own material in the long run, there's nobody there to say "no it really does sound better this way", the problems Ferry faced with Horoscope are testimony to this. Sadly when the artist gets beyond a certain level of fame it gets harder for anyone to be strong enough to put the brakes on them, having said that the same can be said of some producers over powering the views of the artist, there has to be a balance. Tom. ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 20:55:39 +0100 From: "Heather Buch" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Re: Fw: She Sells On Tue, 25 Feb 2003 12:54:15 EST, DEAGLERR wrote I don't want your cigar! And I think Duchamp is interesting because he never made it quite clear, even to Deagle, Mutt, or Man Ray, exactly what he meant. Heather "When the tobacco smoke also smells of the mouth which exhales it, the two odors are married by infra-slim." - -marcel duchamp > > Duchamp as social critic? > Not in the way you mean. > Reading Marxist theory again, Heather? > I thought that crap was way-tired by now. > > "sometimes a cigar is just a cigar", Freud > > Not even close, no cigar for you. > ----------------------------------------- > RE: Grammys > Can ANYONE on this list explain the allure of No Doubt? > That Gwen Stephani chick gives me a major pain. > > Regards R Deagle > > Chocolate Grinder#1 (1913) > two studies (1914) > Chocolate Grinder #2 (1914) which was traced onto the Large Glass > (The Bride Stripped...) (declared finished 1923) and "reproduced " > on the cover of The Blind Man (1917) > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Heather Buch ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 20:59:12 +0100 From: "Heather Buch" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Fw: She Sells On Tue, 25 Feb 2003 11:49:04 -0500 (EST), Colleen Matan wrote > Signed, > R Mutt Are you filling in for Monqui Boy? Heather Buch ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 21:12:07 +0100 From: "Heather Buch" Subject: [AVALON] hash browns, coffee, and cigars Karin, I'll agree to that. I have my interpretation of Ferry's lyrics. They might have nothing to do with what he intended. Maybe they have a little. I throw in the symbolism that I like, and try not to "make up my mind". It's fun to tell stories about the lyrics - saves me from the "daily grind". Heather On Tue, 25 Feb 2003 08:51:22 -0800, Karin Whitney wrote Lets agree that it is an > individual lyrical interpretation. There is no way that any of us > actually know what is in the song writers mind when he/she writes a > song. Only that person can hold the answer. Otherwise it is only > speculation my friends. And it certainly creates an arena for lively > debate! > > You say potato, > > Karin > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon > Avalonians on tour 2002: > http://helios.unive.it/~tcecilia/meetup.html US ticket sale info: > http://www.thewebgal.com/roxymusic/ (updated weekly) Heather Buch ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 16:56:51 EST From: Gal410@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Re: Fw: She Sells I completely agree with the statements below. Personally, I don't think Ferry's lyrics are meant to be as super-intellectual and analytical as some of you seem to think they are. They are clever, witty, introspective, romantic, etc.. Alot of people look for hidden agendas where, maybe there are none? Heidi In a message dated 2/25/2003 12:55:49 PM Eastern Standard Time, DEAGLERR@aol.com writes: > Made-up eyes, make up MY mind! > > A closer reading of the lyric might serve. > She Sells has zip to do with coffee, bread or Duchamp "sometimes a cigar is just a cigar", Freud ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 17:29:46 EST From: KWil632057@aol.com Subject: [AVALON] She smells This is one of my favourite Roxy songs and it is interesting to hear it at the centre of fierce analysis. Listening to it again recently due to all this furore I noticed that Bryan Ferry is a very cheeky man. The reference to daily grind might well refer to his carnal antics with Jerry 'actually quite a nice lady' Hall. Jonathan n/p Magarita Pracatan 'Which Way To Turn' ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 17:13:03 -0600 (CST) From: MarlanaK@webtv.net (M.M.K.) Subject: [AVALON] Re; Coffee, tea or me! Besides the "daily grind" we sometime refer to a phrase -- I have an" axe to grind" with you.--Meaning I have a "disagreement" I want to discuss. Don't you just love all kinds of words? Can mean so many different things.Marlana....................................... ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 17:33:59 -0600 From: "Paula Brown" Subject: Re: [AVALON] She smells I think you're being conservative. Paula The reference to daily grind might well refer to > his carnal antics with Jerry 'actually quite a nice lady' Hall. > > > Jonathan ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 18:39:37 EST From: DEAGLERR@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Re: Fw: She Sells In a message dated 2/25/03 4:18:59 PM, hbuch@www.thebuchs.dk writes: << This: > Reading Marxist theory again, Heather? > I thought that crap was way-tired by now. >is out of line. Why the hell is it so easy to flame people you don't even know? >It sucks!!!!! >> Dear Heather, If disagreeing with you constitutes a flame-job, I hope you have asbestos lingerie. I really hate Marxist, Lancanian, Feminist, what-have-you-ist theory based criticisim, where the object (or lyric) at hand is completely discarded, in favor of some pipe dream hand-job. I know some of the OCTOBER Magazine folks personally, That stuff is indecipherable, as well as insufferable. I think it's that way so as to shroud the lack of ideas under an avalanche of adjectives. Such muck constitutes nothing more than an art/lit version of conspiracy theory wacko-ism. I.E. A Maoist reading of a Cimabue Madonna would be ludicrous. Pay attention to the given, it'll be more productive. Regards, R Deagle ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 01:59:55 +0100 From: "cor broersen" Subject: [AVALON] Sad news, about sound and treatments and a thru muse! Hi, Don't now If this was a topic before. But only just today I found out that one of my heroines passed away age '77 in januari. Daphne Blake Oram Link to very cool early studio foto and audio (Tardis a.o. and interview from 1972!! realy interesting!) http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2669735.stm Daphne practicaly invented electronic music and bizar instrument too. She is to Brain Eno what Chuck Berry is to Keef Wichard She did all the Doktor Who stuff and looking at her middle name, I wonder if the name Blake's Seven, the serie's for wich she also did the soundtrack beeing BBC's?? is some kind of insiders tribute to her at the time rather scifi musical scores. Beethovens Fifth and Blake's Seventh or something like that. I think its fair to say that without Daphne's pioneering work there would have never been the early Roxy Music as we know it. Judge for yourselfs: see you, Cor Blimey! Story from guardian Daphne Oram Pioneer of electronic music who stayed true to the classics Hugh Davies Friday January 24, 2003 The Guardian In 1943, the electronic music pioneer Daphne Oram, who has died aged 77, began work as a music balancer for the BBC in London. Within five years, she was making her own experiments with synthetically created sound. Among her early instrumental compositions, the unperformed, 30-minute Still Point (1950) stands out. In it, the orchestra is combined with prerecorded instrumental sounds and live treatments - using standard radio equipment of the period. It is almost certainly the earliest composition to specify the real-time electronic transformation of instrumental sounds. By 1956, Oram's attempts to convince the BBC of the value of electronic music and musique concrite were bearing fruit. She assembled a temporary, late-night studio - which operated after broadcasting had finished - to produce background music. Two years later, she was appointed the first director of the BBC's new radiophonic workshop, but by January 1959, unhappy with the music department's lack of interest, she went freelance, moving to Tower Folly, a converted oast-house, near Wrotham, Kent, with her studio located in a circular room at the base of the tower. To earn a living, she created electronic music for theatre, radio, television and industrial and publicity films - her sinister electronic underlays featured in the 1961 Deborah Kerr film, The Innocents. She composed music for two ballets and several concert works, including Four Aspects (1960). She released Electronic Sound Patterns, from the LP series Listen, Move And Dance, and provided the melody for the Nestea television advertisement. In 1968-70, she produced tape parts for three compositions by Thea Musgrave, two for a solo instrument and tape, and the ballet Beauty And The Beast. Oram was born in Devizes, Wiltshire. She studied at Sherborne school for girls, and had private lessons for piano, organ and composition. Her dream was to create a machine with which the composer could "convert graphic information into sound", bypassing the more laborious methods of cutting and splicing tapes used in electronic music studios. This became a reality in the 1960s, with Gulbenkian Foundation funding, after which she reduced her commercial work, although in 1982-89 she gave electronic music classes at Christ Church College, Canterbury. The Oramics system (1962-65) was probably the most sophisticated of several graphically-based composition machines that were constructed between the 1930s and 1960s. In the 1980s, new digital techniques made it increasingly obsolete; it is in a private collection in Devon, in need of restoration. Funded by the RVW Trust and the Arts Council, from the mid-1980s Oram began working on a digital version with an Archimedes RISC computer. My first contact with Oram was in 1961, while I was a music student, when she generously invited me and a friend to stay for a weekend; it was my first experience of working in an electronic music studio. She never lost her love for the classical music repertoire; Schubert's string quintet was her favourite piece of music. In the late 1980s, she initiated Out And Round About With Music (Oram), playing music in the open-air to less mobile older people. During the 1980s and early 1990s, she was active in the Performing Rights Society, introducing the provision of Christmas hampers. Oram's death follows that of the other woman pioneer in the medium, Delia Derbyshire (obituary, July 7 2001). But unlike Derbyshire, who was able to work in electronic music studios, Oram came from the generation that had founded the studios, despite resistance and indifference. Her independent outlook is illustrated in her idiosyncratic, almost mystical, book An Individual Note Of Music, Sound And Electronics (1972). _________________________________________________________________ Chatten met je online vrienden via MSN Messenger. http://messenger.msn.nl/ ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 25 Feb 2003 20:43:44 -0500 From: David Neuhaus Subject: Re: [AVALON] Fw: She Sells > The late > breaking news is that *everything* Mr. Ferry has written has to connect > with something that Marcel Duchamp did... It continues past the music. Don't forget Duchamp's "Bicycle Wheel" Readymade, and Ferry's youthful interest in cycling. Rose Selavy ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 07:09:09 +0100 From: "Heather Buch" Subject: [AVALON] Grind it, baby Oh, that's a good one. "Axe to grind," and it could also refer to heavy metal imagery tropes such as "Axel Rose", or "Molly Hatchet". Hell, even "Rrose Selavey". Given the relationship between the pre-glam and post-glam movements, I don't think such a reading would be too absurd. Ciao, Heather Krauss On Tue, 25 Feb 2003 17:13:03 -0600 (CST), M.M.K. wrote > Besides the "daily grind" we sometime refer to a phrase -- I have an" > axe to grind" with you.--Meaning I have a "disagreement" I want to > discuss. Don't you just love all kinds of words? Can mean so many > different things.Marlana....................................... > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Heather Buch ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:51:27 +0100 From: "Heather Buch" Subject: [AVALON] FW: She Sells Richard, OK, now that you have aired my asbestos lingerie publicly, time to set it on fire! Now I think I understand where you are coming from. I was a little confused by that "been reading marxist theory again, Heather?" message. You don't like a lot of the kind of art theory that was popular in the 90's. That I understand....I used to hate it too. The feminist stuff I can take or leave, but I like marxism. Read on, folks, before you judge me..... I'm not trying to preach political idealogy to anyone. I'm cool with your politics, whatever they are. I like marxism because I like 20th century history. Marxism, freudianism, etc. seemed to be a big part of it. A lot of the movements it influenced - bohemian culture, the early avant-garde, revolutions, hippies - is really interesting. All these young people thinking they could change the world, all the manifestos and discussions and passion and philosophy. That is what I like about marxism. To me, the idea of wanting to change the world is romantic stuff....whether it works or not it makes a good story, and that's why I like it. Now you might say "it caused a lot of problems and Stalin killed a lot of people." Yes, but I'm not talking about politics. I'm talking about intellectual movements. Ferry, like MacLaren's Maoist-red clad New York Dolls, were part of the 20th century. They (Roxy Music, not New York Dolls) were romantic and sensual yes, and there is no doubt that they were writing about love and sex. But they were also thinking about the world, about history and literature and maybe even 19th-20th century philosophies like marxism. That doesn't mean they were leftists. Maybe they were just showing off their historical acumen to make themselves seem intellectual and sexy. Oh sure, I could say "Ferry's lyrics are nice. They are about working." Or I could say "The Duchamp picture is pretty. It is green and blue." But if I did, would anyone care? "Hold out when you're in doubt question what you see and when you find an answer bring it home to me" Heather On Tue, 25 Feb 2003 18:39:37 EST, DEAGLERR wrote > Dear Heather, > If disagreeing with you constitutes a flame-job, I hope you have > asbestos lingerie. > > I really hate Marxist, Lancanian, Feminist, what-have-you-ist theory > based criticisim, where the object (or lyric) at hand is completely > discarded, in favor of some pipe dream hand-job. > > I know some of the OCTOBER Magazine folks personally, > That stuff is indecipherable, as well as insufferable. > I think it's that way so as to shroud the lack of ideas under an > avalanche of adjectives. Such muck constitutes nothing more than an > art/lit version of conspiracy theory wacko-ism. > > I.E. A Maoist reading of a Cimabue Madonna would be ludicrous. > > Pay attention to the given, it'll be more productive. > > Regards, R Deagle Heather Buch ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2003 09:53:06 +0100 From: "Heather Buch" Subject: Re: [AVALON] She smells Ooooh, that's good. When did he say that about Jerry? Aren't they both single now? Heather On Tue, 25 Feb 2003 17:29:46 EST, KWil632057 wrote > This is one of my favourite Roxy songs and it is interesting to hear > it at the centre of fierce analysis. Listening to it again recently > due to all this furore I noticed that Bryan Ferry is a very cheeky > man. The reference to daily grind might well refer to his carnal > antics with Jerry 'actually quite a nice lady' Hall. > > Jonathan > > n/p Magarita Pracatan 'Which Way To Turn' > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon Heather Buch ___________________________________________________________________________ To unsubscribe, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ End of avalon-digest V8 #55 *************************** ======================================================================== For further info, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: info avalon-digest