From: owner-avalon-digest@smoe.org (avalon-digest) To: avalon-digest@smoe.org Subject: avalon-digest V6 #250 Reply-To: avalon@smoe.org Sender: owner-avalon-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-avalon-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk avalon-digest Sunday, June 24 2001 Volume 06 : Number 250 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: [AVALON] Wow. [LeeSullivn@aol.com] Re: [AVALON] Live trades, no tree. ["thom.wallace" ] Re: [AVALON] Jack Kirby etc. (off topic - non-comics fans ignore and delete!) [Daniel Atterbom ] [AVALON] Re: Concert length [MarlanaK@webtv.net (M.M.K.)] [AVALON] Often Un/knowing ["danilo" ] [AVALON] CDs, trees and a positive question ["Grant Goggans" ] Re: [AVALON] Express Review : worth reading [KWil632057@aol.com] Re: [AVALON] OT Kirby... (with Ferry refs!) ["Grant Goggans" :-) I was surprised, actually, at how many young > girls there were there. Most of them were in jeans, of > course, unlike myself :-) > > I also noticed an encouraging amount (purely in a dispassionate fashion as my wife will testify :O)); but I couldn't help noticing that some of them were shifting uncomfortably in their seats at the sight of crusties (is that still the term?) boogying (wow - spelling nightmare!) on down to the groovy beat. Speaking of which; one terribly disappointing aspect of Saturday's Wembley was peoples unwillingness to get up and dance; except towards the end. I still can't help feeling - and I read and thought about the previous postings on this - that if you're at a concert which at least in part features songs about dancing, then you should have a little dance; and if you can't or won't, at least be willing to let others! Gyrating in my chair as I write, Lee S ____________________________________________ Easily distracted? Displacement activity a problem? Me too. Going to: www.LeeSullivan.co.uk won't help either . . . ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 10:47:23 +0100 From: "thom.wallace" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Live trades, no tree. - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, June 24, 2001 3:01 AM Subject: Re: [AVALON] Live trades, no tree. > I'm sure you/we won't have to wait that long. Someone else on the list will > have copies of shows-and they will want to make them available through a > tree. It's not like Thom's friend is the only person with live Roxy from > this tour. This is true. > And if you don't like the conditions thom has made-then don't trade with him > when you get something- My sentiments exactly, it seems from the response to my posting that others on the list are quite happy with the conditions stated. After all they are not being asked not to trade them on only to ensure that they are not treed. > Let's say when a tree gets started-everyone involved could just make sure > that no copy will be sent out to thom for his friend's use under the > condition that if they break this rule-then they can never get another tree > cd from this list. > But let's not get on thom's case for waving the carrot and then snatching > away. That's his right to do just as it is your/our right never to involve > him in a cdtree again. Just as it is my right to say when I want to contribute to a tree project or not. If you read the guide lines for treeing items on the list you will note that you are not supposed to give items for treeing if you are not the source or have permission from the source. At least I asked if this could be done, the answer was no, but I could trade them. I may be mistaken but it may have been Gene who published these guidelines, perhaps he or whoever it was could clarify this one for me. My personal guidline is that if I have received a recording and the source has stated from the start that it is not to be traded on then I don't however if they change their mind latter then too bad. Tom. ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 10:50:49 +0100 From: beauxb@cwctv.net Subject: RE:Re: [AVALON] Memories of the first night at Wembley Excellent review man! BEAUX. Or contact my Mobile E-Mail at ; beaux@orange.net On Sat, 23 Jun 2001 09:22:11 +0000 "Martin Stockman" wrote: Received: from smoe.org ([66.89.201.78]) by smtp.cwctv.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.447.44); Sat, 23 Jun 2001 09:33:21 +0100 Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost) by smoe.org (8.8.7/8.8.7/listq-jane) with SMTP id EAA02301; Sat, 23 Jun 2001 04:25:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: by smoe.org (bulk_mailer v1.10); Sat, 23 Jun 2001 04:25:08 -0400 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by smoe.org (8.8.7/8.8.7/listq-jane) id EAA02190 for avalon-outgoing; Sat, 23 Jun 2001 04:24:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from rhenium (rhenium.btinternet.com [194.73.73.93]) by smoe.org (8.8.7/8.8.7/daemon-mode-jane) with ESMTP id EAA02182 for ; Sat, 23 Jun 2001 04:24:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [213.122.244.4] (helo=[213.122.244.4]) by rhenium with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #9) id 15DijO-0003zL-00; Sat, 23 Jun 2001 09:25:26 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express Macintosh Edition - 4.5 (0410) Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 09:22:11 +0000 Subject: Re: [AVALON] Memories of the first night at Wembley From: "Martin Stockman" To: avalon@smoe.org Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Message-Id: X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 0.97c X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-avalon@smoe.org Reply-To: avalon@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Return-Path: owner-avalon@smoe.org * Such a rich sound ! Colin, Zev, Chris, Paul and Lucy wrap the songs in a deep velvet groove allowing the non-salaried members to do their virtuoso pieces. The mix works better than any Roxy tour and I've seen 'em all. * The dancers are a curio. Part Saturday Night at The Palladium, part La Cage Aux Folles. The Anthony Price is Right. Majorettes (a la ghastly Midnight Hour video) in the middle of the set, the girls dance, fixed-smile, blonde-bob wigs, behind Thundersticks; one isn't entirely sure that they aren't part of the video backdrop. Kitsch or cool, un coup de theatre ou un coup de fou ? Whilst the jury is out on this we can be sure that their pink flamingo feathered boa return for LITD and Strand is a triumph. the band studiously ignore them as they strut and twirl around them. Deluxe and delightful, my role is to serve you. * Bryan's voice, despite strange unconfirmed reports from rainswept Manchester, was in fine fettle. He looked fit and up for it. A tour de force. * The set is a good three songs shorter than the one I enjoyed in Dublin. Dreamhome for Avalon is a fair swap but the cutting of If There Is Something is a cruel call. Problem number More Than This will, in all probability, never be aired again, which is a shame; the Maestro's impression of Chris Turner jumping on a cat from his dormitory window will not be missed but I find it sad that Manzo's sonic guitar (that kicks in at 2.52 on the CD) will not delight these shell-likes again. Forevermore. * The band start on a big rocker and end on an avante garde, somewhat elegiac, number. A witty contrast to tradition. For Your Pleasure allows each member a fond farewell, a curtain call, one is left wanting more but cogniscant that this was the end. We are spared that tedious moment when some punters remain clamouring for a further encore as the house lights go up. * In less than twelve hours we do it all again. Cruising 'crosstown to an aircraft hangar off the North Circular. (What a toilet Wembley is ! ) Cheery Avalonions, everywhere I look I see your face, I hear your name its all over the place. The thrill of it all indeed. ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 11:08:49 +0100 From: "Guy Lawley" Subject: [AVALON] Jack Kirby etc. (off topic - non-comics fans ignore and delete!) Dear Daniel, Grant, Rick and anyone else who might be reading this: Oh dearie me, that old Kirby vs. Barks debate again! Trying to judge all of the comics medium by reference to two men's work and influence is very limiting. Kirby inspires such devotion partly because his style (and ideas) inspired a whole generation (or five) of American and Anglophone artists and writers. (And because he was very very good at what he did. (I don't like the term "genius"- too subjective in this context.)) Likewise Barks in a less visible way (to us Brits anyway). But the ongoing concentration on Kirby and/or Barks polarises the discussion too much, for and against, as we see here (again)- and on a Roxy Music list fer chrissake!! (and jolly good too! I like a bit of diversity in my mailbox) It's like discussing all written fiction by reference only to James Joyce and Agatha Christie. Seems to me there are broadly four strands in comics art: (1) Superhero and related mainstream - Kirby dominates, no question, as inspiration, trendsetter and source of much influence (2) Underground (and "alternative/indy" continuing some of the strands from the UG) - R. Crumb epitomises for me and arguably dominates to the same extent (3) The great (and very varied) US newspaper strip tradition (with ongoing stories) - now pretty much dead but plenty of wonderful reprint material to enjoy. An emphasis on stylish illustrational values - whether slick (Alex Raymond dominates), rough'n'ready (Milton Caniff), "arty/quirky" (e.g. Herriman) or "cartoony" (Frank "Gasoline Alley" King for example) (4) The Funny Animal tradition - no doubt that Carl "the good duck man" Barks dominates this field but there other exemplars. (And yes I know I'm ignoring (5) Humorous daily strips with little or no continuity but that's deliberate.) Even this classification simplifies the medium to an unforgivable degree. These strands weave in and out of each other to an impressive extent. The current US mainstream has been invigorated by Underground values in the past three decades, mainly thanks to Alan Moore and Grant Morrison, but it also resembles the Newspaper Strip in some areas (Vertigo's crime books, for example). Also the influences of film, TV and various genre fictions (especially SF) have swept through the mainstream of comics to divert it away from the superhero flood which Lee and Kirby (and some DC hacks) unleashed in the 60s. So Daniel, please give Kirby his due in his corner of the field. And Grant and Rick, you (and I!) might not care much for Carl the Duck Man, but he's got his own little walled-off paddock wherein he Rools The Roost, no question. Neither individual deserves to be compared to the Spice Girls!!! They are both in the Bryan Ferry / Bryan Eno sphere! In musical terms, I I don't much like Zappa or the Beatles, but I wouldn't argue that neither of them was no good, not important, not influential etc. XXX Guy ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 11:06:43 +0100 From: "A.L. Jepson" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Live trades. One other question I forgot to ask you Tom, was are the audio boots on tape or CD? Cheers Alan "thom.wallace" wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: A.L. Jepson > To: > Sent: Saturday, June 23, 2001 11:03 AM > Subject: Re: [AVALON] Live trades. > > > Which one has the best sound quality? > > Newcastle & Manchester > > cheers, > tom. > > ___________________________________________________________________________ > The subliminable footer says: > To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: > unsubscribe avalon ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 12:29:25 +0200 From: Daniel Atterbom Subject: Re: [AVALON] Jack Kirby etc. (off topic - non-comics fans ignore and delete!) At 11.08 +0100 1-06-24, Guy Lawley wrote: >So Daniel, please give Kirby his due in his corner of the field. And Grant >and Rick, you (and I!) might not care much for Carl the Duck Man, but he's >got his own little walled-off paddock wherein he Rools The Roost, no >question. I give Kirby the merit of kicking US-Anglo comics in a direction I do not care much for. There are several Disneylands, a Tintin & Hergi museum in Bryssels, an Asterix theme park etc. But there is no Kirbyland, Kirby museum or Fantastic Four or New Gods theme park. We have a distinct cultural divide here. The funny animals, the fables, tradition is more of a continental European traditions the an US-Anglo one. Europe gave the US Santa Claus, in return we have a choice between superheroes and funny animals. Since Donald Duck, and his relatives, is one of the few comic caracters with a full set of human emotions I'll take them any day. So does the majority of comicbook buying continental European public. Daniel ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 11:35:47 +0100 From: "Niki H" Subject: [AVALON] no kidding if you think I'm kidding,you are in the wrong place.I know many people here feel the same way,but being french it's second nature for me to dramatise....of course by ordinary mortals I mean most other singers,with the exception perhaps of Neil Young and Michael Stipe,but when people dare to compare him with someone like Francis Rossi it makes my blood boil! _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com. ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 06:11:43 -0500 (CDT) From: MarlanaK@webtv.net (M.M.K.) Subject: [AVALON] Re: Concert length Thanks Terry, for the info. now somewhat of a idea how the concerts are running in length. Just hope they want get any shorter. Not much longer now & Roxy will be on American soil. Marlana............................................................. ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 13:31:07 +0200 From: "danilo" Subject: [AVALON] Often Un/knowing Ciao KB!!!!! please try to forgive me if i'm answering u after a month or more but i'm so busy with school and i'm trying to translate in italian more than 1000 avalonian letters.. i think we are so fllood-ish fans LOL a-lot-envy-about-u-all-that-already-met-Roxy-danilo :-))))))) baci dall'italia - -----Messaggio Originale----- Da: "KB Porter" A: Data invio: martedl 15 maggio 2001 13.41 Oggetto: Re: [AVALON] Always Un/known > Danny - I think you have summed up the Roxy Music albums fairly well! I > particularly like your Clockwork Orange comparison. Best wishes, KBP > > ------------------------------------------------- ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 08:27:02 -0400 From: "Grant Goggans" Subject: [AVALON] CDs, trees and a positive question Hey Thom (and everyone): All aggro, curiosity and hurt feelings aside (which may show up if I choose to get confrontational), I had a very general question about something: >The friend of mine who made the >recordings has made them available to me as long as I do the following: > >a) That anything similar I obtain through trading is also made available to >him. >b) That I do my best to keep them out of the hands of people who will then >try and make a financial profit from them. >c) That they are not made part of an internet CD tree by myself or anybody >with whom I trade them. Now, I'm not asking for justification or rationale for your friend's actions specifically. Obviously he's within his rights to add d) That every fifth copy must be shoved where the sun doesn't shine if he's so inclined. I just generally do not understand the why of point (c). Oh, I can come up with all sorts of negative reasons why someone doesn't want a show treed, but I'd like to think positive just now, and I was curious if, not necessarily Thom but anyone, could come up with a reason why "if you want this show, then it may never be treed" that doesn't make the reasoner look negative. I just wondered if maybe there was something bad about getting music into people's hands for free which I had previously missed. Grant (positive -- for this post) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 08:53:29 -0400 From: "Tim Kendrick" Subject: Re: [AVALON] Jack Kirby etc. (off topic - non-comics fans ignore and delete!) >I give Kirby the merit of kicking US-Anglo comics in a direction I do not >care much for. There are several Disneylands, a Tintin & Hergi museum in >Bryssels, an Asterix theme park etc. But there is no Kirbyland, Kirby >museum or Fantastic Four or New Gods theme park. > But again you're measuring things by commercial success. Sure, there's a Disneyland, though I wish to God there wasn't. But influence can be subtler than that. The truth is Kirby's influence is all over modern American culture, you can't escape it. I adore Kirby's work ( and have 2 pages of his original art ) but could live without the influence: he's a part of the zeitgeist which has created the worst possible corporate popular culture, and it's vile. But I think Kirby would have recognised and been pained by this. He himself was something of a maverick, and it's the sweaty and greedy people of Hollywood, the least maverick people in the world, who are getting rich on his influence. And there's a fabulous irony to all this. Comic books have never been more influential, they're at the very heart of the imagery we see each day; but at the same time they're near death, because nobody actually reads them anymore. Kids play computer games instead. Kirby introduced cinematic technique into comic books - many of his best pages look like storyboards for a movie. It's hard to overstate the importance of this. he also, in the sixties, ( with Stan Lee), created some of the most magical comic books that ever were. But later for DC he achieved, it seems to me, something greater. The NEW GODS, in their way, were a revolutionary series. ( I always loved that the first word in the first issue of this series is 'epilog'!) And though they use elements of the Superhero book, they're something else. Strange and surreal. Clunking dialogue unfortunately, ( Kirby's own,) but they accomplish something I have rarely seen in Comics or in popular entertainment generally : In the villain Darkseid, Kirby achieves a genuine sense of evil. The loathsome George Lucas, who ripped him off and watered him down, couldn't remotely do that. A comic book show like DR WHO almost entirely lacked a sense of evil, though on a rare good day it tried. Garbage like STAR TREK can't even approach the subject. But Darkseid and his cronies on Apokolips, for all their garishness, do exude something of the cost, the meaning, of utter corruption.Later, more self-consciously adult comic books, have pretty much failed to accomplish anything on this scale. I would argue, again, that though Kirby's multi-part series were wonderful, his influence - the encouragement of endless, impenetrable, tedious multi-part sagas - has been malign, and certainly helped speed the demise of the medium. (The arrival of 'adult' comics, of which endless series is one aspect, has been a hopeless development. - they're often well-painted, but beneath the pseudo-sophistication they're usually asinine. Last year I read a sole, isolated isssue of a BATMAN comic. All very dark in a naff, Heavy Metal kind of way, skillfully enough drawn, but with a script that wouldn't have passed muster in 1940.) But we should no more blame Kirby for this, than Marlon Brando for two generations of terrible method actors! 'Nuff said! Tim ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 13:55:24 +0100 From: beauxb@cwctv.net Subject: RE:Re: [AVALON] Express Review : worth reading Travis? "Flowers In The Window"? Why so depressing? A great band! No? BEAUX. Or contact my Mobile E-Mail at ; beaux@orange.net On Sat, 23 Jun 2001 08:23:25 +0000 "Martin Stockman" wrote: Received: from smoe.org ([66.89.201.78]) by smtp.cwctv.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.5.1877.447.44); Sat, 23 Jun 2001 09:34:31 +0100 Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost) by smoe.org (8.8.7/8.8.7/listq-jane) with SMTP id EAA02325; Sat, 23 Jun 2001 04:25:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: by smoe.org (bulk_mailer v1.10); Sat, 23 Jun 2001 04:25:20 -0400 Received: (from majordom@localhost) by smoe.org (8.8.7/8.8.7/listq-jane) id EAA02188 for avalon-outgoing; Sat, 23 Jun 2001 04:24:16 -0400 (EDT) Received: from rhenium (rhenium.btinternet.com [194.73.73.93]) by smoe.org (8.8.7/8.8.7/daemon-mode-jane) with ESMTP id EAA02175 for ; Sat, 23 Jun 2001 04:24:10 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [213.122.244.4] (helo=[213.122.244.4]) by rhenium with esmtp (Exim 3.22 #9) id 15DijL-0003zL-00 for avalon@smoe.org; Sat, 23 Jun 2001 09:25:24 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express Macintosh Edition - 4.5 (0410) Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 08:23:25 +0000 Subject: Re: [AVALON] Express Review : worth reading From: "Martin Stockman" To: avalon@smoe.org Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Message-Id: X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 0.97c X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Sender: owner-avalon@smoe.org Reply-To: avalon@smoe.org Precedence: bulk Return-Path: owner-avalon@smoe.org A pal of mine called Jeremy Novick is the Music hack for the Daily Express and he wrote the following review about Glasgow. Worth reading not just for his unadulterated love of Roxy but also for the despair he imparts for a modern world that deifies Travis. June 15 LIVE Roxy Music **** SECC, Glasgow Frankly, my dear, I don9t give a damn. Who cares if Roxy Music9s reunion was inspired by a tax bill, a concern about the Greenhouse Effect or Gus Poyet signing for Spurs. The best band that ever there was (don9t you just love these impartial critics?) were back and while doubts persisted, they were outweighed by the joy. But could Ferry, at 56, still cut it? Could Andy Mackay? Would Phil Manzanera remember to hit his regulation number of bum notes? Listen, it9s been 18 years since they toured When the lights dimmed and we heard that familiar chinking glasses and party chatter - the opening to Re-Make/Re-Model, a noise that wasn9t so much a song opening as a statement of intent - you9d have had to be a soulless soul not to have felt the hairs on your neck shiver ever so slightly. Of course, they all looked depressingly good. Sharp and stylish, Ferry slipped effortlessly into lounge lizard mode, changing jackets to go over the leather strides - predictably the white tuxedo got the cheer - while Mackay was a revelation on oboe and sax. The requisite dancing girls filled in the spaces. Any Roxy crowd is going to be split between two camps: those tastemeisters who know that their first two albums are the finest records ever made and the misguided souls who go for the smooth mainstream soul/pop of the later years. In Glasgow there was no doubt that where crowd9s sympathies were - distressingly, the dreaded On The Radio song got the biggest cheer of the night - but by the time we got to an exhilarating Editions Of You, the 8,000 crowd were ready to "Woooo" on cue with the stinky sirens. The set slipped between the two sections - Virginia Plain, Song For Europe, Love Is The Drug, Avalon, Jealous Guy - and, allowing for a half hour or so warming up period, they blew hot. Things ended on a very Roxy note. Eschewing the big show stopping exit, they left us with the spooky, dischordant For Your Pleasure and as its fading refrain of "Old man, through every step I change. You watch me walk away Tara " filled the cavernous arena, a bittersweet mood filled the air. The problem, you see, is that the return of Roxy makes you think about Travis and that9s just depressing. ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 14:18:26 +0100 From: "David Squires " Subject: RE:Re: [AVALON] Express Review : worth reading On 24 Jun 2001, at 13:55, beauxb@cwctv.net wrote: > Travis? "Flowers In The Window"? Why so depressing? A great band! > No? No! A couple of good tunes. No emotional content. Dull, corporate fodder. David - -- David Squires, Wimbotsham, Norfolk, UK ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 09:20:22 -0400 From: "Grant Goggans" Subject: [AVALON] Positive! Positive! A good day... Be assured that I am chomping at the bit to explode with justifiably righteous indignation at people withholding and/or preventing shows from entering the public domain. But maybe recounting what a nifty, nifty day I had yesterday (in places Roxy-related) will assuage some of the (again, justifiably) hurt feelings because someone has the appearance of being a selfish little grumble grumble. The day started with Jack Kirby's work being called without merit. You know how that went. Left the house around 9.30 in a foul mood, although satisfied I'd made my point. Got my Chastain Park Atlanta tickets at 10. Pretty good seats, $68.50 each. This would be the best $147 I spent in a while. Stood in front of the counter with an 18-year old buying Crosby, Stills and Nash (for himself, even. This kid needs a copy of London Calling and he needs it now.) and a woman buying Stevie Nicks, who had no idea Stevie Nicks tix were $89.50 each. I told her hey, Stevie used to date Don Henley, and the Eagles were the ones who started the "really amazingly expensive" racket in the first place. So there, I have Roxy Music tickets. I'm going to have a good day. Drive the family up to Athens. It's AthFest this weekend, sort of our Glastonbury, only without the mud and with only local bands. We pick up Dave Prosser and meet my pal Scott for lunch at the Mean Bean, which is the best restaurant on the planet. They've got photos of their favorite customers on the bulletin board. They stuck a photo of this girl I dated (during the 18 months my wife and I were separated) directly underneath and to the left of mine. The personal space violation didn't matter; I only fumed for a few seconds because the Mean Bean's gazpacho, which they only make in the summer, is the best food in the universe. One sip makes everything right. So we headed downtown. An old friend of mine named Brian had a booth for his year-old company, athensmusic.net, selling CDs by local acts. (Yeah, that's a plug. The music in Athens is better than the music in your own town, so you should definitely stop in and buy the new Japancakes, among others.) I got the new Of Montreal, and a Pylon compilation which I had years ago but a roommate stole. We saw great shows throughout the day, from Boulevard (who own every Suede album, twice), Adam Payne, Slackdaddy, the incredible blues singer Neal Pattman, Bluestring (who own every Dave Matthews album, three times)... some great, great music. I got my comics at Bizarro Wuxtry. Mike McMahon is drawing the ABC Warriors again in 2000 AD. All is right in the world. Starman's last issue -- I read this when we stopped at the Grill for a cool-off drink and Debi took the kids to her mom's for a rest -- wow. What an ending. It brought tears to my eyes. We watched some more music and went to Low Yo-Yo. I bought a Tori Amos boot and chuckled mightily that on the back cover of the Roxy Music boot "Re-make/Re-model," the designer misspelled BBC as BCC. They had that, West Side, Song for Europe (which are the same show) and Golders Green. Best shop in the world for boots. For dinner, we rejoined Deb had Gautreau's Cajun Cafe. I suffered mightily from too much cayenne. Deb returned to the kids and the rest of us went to Tasty World where we saw the 8-Track Gorilla. Now that guy puts on a hell of an act. Usually he and a friend karaoke to lounge songs while he's dressed in a monkey suit. This time, he had a "supergroup" of Athens' best female musicians playing powergrungepop while he crooned "Girl," "One Fine Day" and other chestnuts, wearing an old tuxedo, a gorilla mask with a pink stripe, and "playing" a guitar which didn't have strings, but it did have big pink fuzz on the sides, and a strobe light. His guitarist? Orenda Rocket from Little Red Rocket. My wife understands that I love Orenda like I love sunsets and private beaches and Mike McMahon art on ABC Warriors. We wrapped up the night listening to Dave and Scott jam back at Dave's place while I sobered up from the many glasses of Cointreau and OJ. Dave broke out an alto sax and encouraged me to try. I've never even touched a woodwind before, but after an hour, I was actually making music. I can't claim it was good music and my mouth hurts really bad right now, but wowza, that felt good. We left Athens around 3. I put on the Pylon collection and woke Deb and the kids up bellowing along to it. Returned at 4.30 this morning and checked the mail. Fellow Avalonian Mark Heptinstall sent me a Roxy tour program and, in a welcome break from all the CD tree rudeness I read after I got up from my nap, he did so freely, and worked out a comparable swap with me after he'd already mailed it off. Big round of applause for Mark, and for all the other Avalonians who selflessly give stuff to their fellows on the list without placing demands upon the people who receive it. Sharing is good; the tour program is nice, although I wish there were more new photos in it. But look! It's Lucy Wilkins! And what a nice smile. I bet she is super friendly in person. I went to bed feeling better about the world. Now I have to clench my teeth and remind myself how good that gazpacho was to keep from replying to every post in this thread. Suffice it to say that KB, Colleen, Heather and the rest are absolutely and categorically *right*. Suffice it to say also that, should I be fortunate enough to get a live 2001 Roxy concert from anyone, it **will** be shared, without stipulation or restriction. - --Grant http://www.geocities.com/gmslegion _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 09:32:53 -0400 From: KB Porter Subject: Re: [AVALON] Wembley 23/06/01 Dash it all, Bryan. Between you having transport problems, and Peter's work conflict regarding the Munich show, and my own inability to secure a ticket to the Washington, DC area gig, and the untold tales of other list members who have encountered similar misfortune, I'm turning blue in the face! Oh how it pings sadly at my heart. KBP ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 09:39:36 EDT From: KWil632057@aol.com Subject: Re: [AVALON] Express Review : worth reading Never a truer word spoken. Corporate dressed as indie. Jonathan In a message dated 24/06/01 14:37:23 GMT Daylight Time, d_s@lineone.net writes: > No! A couple of good tunes. No emotional content. Dull, corporate > fodder. > > David ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Jun 2001 09:52:57 -0400 From: "Grant Goggans" Subject: Re: [AVALON] OT Kirby... (with Ferry refs!) >Date: Sat, 23 Jun 2001 16:58:36 +0200 >From: Daniel Atterbom >Subject: Re: [AVALON] OT Kirby... (with Ferry refs!) >And I, living in a country with a social democratic gov't, thought that >the US was a country were sales is a main instrument. :-) ...for proving someone's art has merit? >This not being the case in Europe were Tintin and Asterix are more popular >then Kirby's superheroes, the only American figures to compete are >Disney's. Likewise, neither Tintin nor Asterix have ever sold in America. I don't even know that an American publisher has ever licensed them. But that doesn't mean I have the right to call Herge's work without merit. Even without having read very much Tintin (and no Asterix), I can certainly see how hugely popular they are in Europe, and I wouldn't dare dis their creator as being without merit. Now, there are 240 million people in my nation, and every man jack one of us knows who Captain America is, even if only a teeny tiny number buy Captain America comics today. If you're just talking popularity, why isn't Kirby deserving of your respect, but Herge is deserving of mine? >That Kirby inspired people to draw is like saying that Velvet Underground >inspired people to play. *blank stare*. If you're comparing Jack Kirby to Lou Reed and John Cale, then congratulations. You've just conceded the argument, as far as I can see... >But Barks is held in high esteem in Europe... Yeah, but my point is that the US media doesn't hold *any* comics creator, with the exception of Schulz, in any sort of esteem. Hank Ketchum died last month. The American "Dennis the Menace" runs in the Atlanta paper, and they buried his obit somewhere on page B6 or something. Don't get me wrong; Barks was a genius, and your media was correct to eulogize him like they did. But you're using his local eulogy to prove your point by saying that Kirby wasn't eulogized in America, but you're overlooking American media's disdain or apathy towards comics. >Barks created Scrooge McDuck, a better symbol for the US then Kirby's (and >Simon's) Captain America. A capitalistic, greedy, money-hoarding asshole is a better symbol for the US than a character who loves his country, fights for truth and justice and spent the early 1940s inspiring our kids to support their fathers and older brothers dying on the battlefield in World War Two?? A "more accurate" symbol, tragically, yes. I have, to put it politely, "issues" with your use of the word "better." >My view is that few of Kirby's stories are worthwhile re-reading as an >adult. If there was money to make on Kirby, why isn't he reprinted like >Carl Barks or Hergi? You are perhaps unaware that: a) There's very little money to make on comics period in the US and b) Great big chunks of Kirby are still in print. > >Kirby's comics are for juveniles. Superheroes is something I left behind >when I discovered girls... If you want to use apocyphal examples, I personally left talking ducks behind when I discovered how to spell. >The editor of The Comics Journal, Gary Groth, was the driving force behind >the now cancelled Kirby awards. And I imagine the editors of heavy metal magazines might own a few Beatles records. Their readers, however, tend to not. And the overwhelming majority of Comic Journal readers are readers who actively and vocally hate the publishers and genres where Kirby worked! >To answer Grant Goggans' question: Well, how exactly do you qualify >"genius"? > >That's a bit harder, me writing in a strange language and all. I would say >that their work have been inventive and lasting. From my viewpoint Kirby >does not qualify. Well, here's the difference between you and I. Tintin has had zero impact in America. Asterix? That big expensive, high-grossing feature film hasn't even found a *direct-to-videotape* distributor in America. Yet I would never dare call the work of their creators "meritless" simply because I have the insight to know and the wisdom to see that they have had major cultural impact on the people of yours' and others' nations, and they fuel readers' imaginations, and they inspire your countrymen to create. Why you can't give Kirby the same respect utterly baffles me. Kirby's work has left little impact on Europe, apart from >the UK. Not being American I can hardly be expected to have an American >point of view -- I dislike capital punishment and not standing by the Kyoto >protocol as well :-) Gee, thanks, dude. I don't particularly like Ace of Base or those shit films that Bergman's untalented boy is directing, either, but I'll be sure to qualify those as being a Swedish point of view. - --G. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ___________________________________________________________________________ The subliminable footer says: To unsub, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: unsubscribe avalon ------------------------------ End of avalon-digest V6 #250 **************************** ======================================================================== For further info, mail majordomo@smoe.org with: info avalon-digest