From: owner-angry-psychos-digest@smoe.org (angry-psychos-digest) To: angry-psychos-digest@smoe.org Subject: angry-psychos-digest V7 #61 Reply-To: angry-psychos@smoe.org Sender: owner-angry-psychos-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-angry-psychos-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "angry-psychos-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. angry-psychos-digest Wednesday, February 27 2002 Volume 07 : Number 061 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) ["j." ] Re: NPR Morpheus ["aNfrey cHeng" ] NPR - Re: NPR tag reminder ["aNfrey cHeng" ] Re: WILD on KZON right now... ["sp00k@poe.org" ] NPR Morpheus [Erik Schalburg ] Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) [KrodKnid@ao] Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) [KrodKnid@ao] Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) [KrodKnid@ao] Re: NPR Morpheus [KrodKnid@aol.com] To the 'girl who came to the most shows...of anyone' [Thierry Pottier ] NPR Morpheus [Spidersrcute2@aol.com] Re: NPR philosophical blahblah [LolipopFailure@aol.com] RE: NPR Morpheus ["SteVisOK" ] Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) [KrodKnid@a] Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) [KrodKnid@a] Re: Philo-Blah ["Conor Riley" ] Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) [KrodKnid@ao] Re: NPR philosophical blahblah ["Andrea E. Jackman" ] Re: NPR philosophical blahblah ["Jess" ] NPR Blizzard CamS (spam) ["sp00k@poe.org" ] Re: NPR philosophical blahblah [LolipopFailure@aol.com] NPR:Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) ["John A, Bell" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 00:42:14 -0600 From: "j." Subject: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) On Tue, Feb 26, 2002 at 07:30:16PM -0500, John A, Bell wrote: > If this is the case, then, regardless of law (which wasn't the issue), > nothing is moral, nothing is immoral... moral nihilism all around, eh? > No. You're twisting my words around. I've said that morals don't exist in any universal, objective sense, not that they don't exist at all. There are individual morals, or sets of values, and then there are societal morals, which are simply the common elements of the individual morals of a society. That being said, however, you still have to present me with anything other than emotional appeals (see below) to the effect that there is a universal set of moral values that everyone, everywhere, as long as humans existed or will exist, values. > I wonder if the case would be the same if your girlfriend, mother, wife, or > daughter were raped and tortured, or murdered, or anything else. > > -jb > Of course I would be upset. You're missing the point, still, and I fail to see how your theoretical situation works on any level at all save emotional. How would something bad happening to somebody I care for all of a sudden convince me that there HAS to be an unchanging universal basis for everybody's notions of right and wrong? [snip] ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 01:59:13 -0500 From: Subject: trading/buying POE stuff??? read this... http://www.thedent.com/warnock.html i am simply passing along information i have found. i have not personally traded with him nor bought anything from him... however, i do know he has been / is on this list. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 07:15:12 -0500 From: "aNfrey cHeng" Subject: Re: NPR Morpheus i happen to have a copy of the old unblocked morpheus in a zip file. . . (unblocked because now mp3s shared are capped off at 192kbps/44kHz quality). if any of u want it, email me and let me know. i'm not sure if it still works or if musiccity requires an updated version or anything, but it works for me. i've never gotten a message to upgrade my morpheus. i usually find it to be a bad idea to upgrade these file-sharing apps. the common trend is for upgrades seems to be to limit some sort of functionality. oh well. peace, anfrey - --- anfrey cheng anfrey@anfrey.com www.anfrey.com - ----- Original Message ----- From: "nick nemphos" To: ; Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 00:11 Subject: Re: NPR Morpheus | | im having the same problems with my morpheus tooany suggestions out | there? Nick | | ------------------------------------------------------------------------ | | Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: Click Here | ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 07:17:19 -0500 From: "aNfrey cHeng" Subject: NPR - Re: NPR tag reminder AMEN! :) i've been wanting to post about this for a while, but i haven't cuz i really didn't feel like getting flamed and having to set up filters for that. anyway, miharu is right.... *please* npr everything that isn't poe related everyone :) thanks! peace, anfrey - --- anfrey cheng anfrey@anfrey.com www.anfrey.com - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Miharu" To: Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 14:57 Subject: NPR: NPR tag reminder | | Hiya gang.. | | This is just a reminder.. if your post isn't Poe-related, even if it's a | reply to a non-Poe-related topic that wasn't tagged properly to begin with, | PLEASE PLEASE *begbeg* smack a big ol NPR somewhere in the subject of the | email. Those of us (like myself, lately.. I've just gotten too damn | busy ><) that don't really participate in the NPR stuff that use trusty | email filters need everyone to tag stuff correctly. I ask this because | lately I've been getting WAY too much mail that should be tagged NPR in the | wrong folder. | I know it's easy to forget, especially when you're replying to something.. | but again, please think of us quiet people when you post. ;p | And.. I still love you all! ^^ | | -miharu ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 08:09:12 -0500 From: "sp00k@poe.org" Subject: Re: WILD on KZON right now... - ----- Original Message ----- Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 3:57 PM Subject: WILD on KZON right now... > WILD is being played on 101.5 KZON right now... > *** > I always love it when a DJ says "we haven't played POE in a while." > heh' - Because DJ's suck... > but they are playing POE, so I am happy. > *************************************************** Poe is still in heavy rotation... @ WBER as per the play list http://wber.monroe.edu 28k and 80k real audio http://summerschool.monroe.edu/wberweb/Wber/playlists.asp Bad Relgion Sorrow Process of Belief (In stores 02/12/02) Poe Haunted Haunted (In stores now) Tool Lateralas Lateralus (In stores now) And I believe that equates to 1 playing per every 4 hours... unless it is also heavily requested, then it gets bumped up, and from what I hear, it sounds like it is still being heavily requested. Hmmm maybe that was the "you're #1 salute" on the Rochester page.. from realp0e.com. sp00k etc ... Http://Poe.Org ====================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 09:47:13 -0500 From: Erik Schalburg Subject: NPR Morpheus I have an older version that works fine for me as well. Might also want to keep in mind that newer versions are often just the old version bundled with spyware. - -----Original Message----- From: aNfrey cHeng [mailto:anfrey.cheng@gte.net] Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 7:15 AM To: angry-psychos@smoe.org Subject: Re: NPR Morpheus i happen to have a copy of the old unblocked morpheus in a zip file. . . (unblocked because now mp3s shared are capped off at 192kbps/44kHz quality). if any of u want it, email me and let me know. i'm not sure if it still works or if musiccity requires an updated version or anything, but it works for me. i've never gotten a message to upgrade my morpheus. i usually find it to be a bad idea to upgrade these file-sharing apps. the common trend is for upgrades seems to be to limit some sort of functionality. oh well. peace, anfrey - --- anfrey cheng anfrey@anfrey.com www.anfrey.com - ----- Original Message ----- From: "nick nemphos" To: ; Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 00:11 Subject: Re: NPR Morpheus | | im having the same problems with my morpheus tooany suggestions out | there? Nick | | ------------------------------------------------------------------------ | | Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: Click Here | ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 10:04:49 EST From: KrodKnid@aol.com Subject: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) In a message dated 2/26/2002 11:23:00 AM Eastern Standard Time, monkeytrinket@yahoo.com writes: > All this talk of intrinsic this and intrinsic that... > Lets talk about evil, no... lets talk about an evil > chicken. I don't mean ill tempered or slightly > rotten. I mean horns poking out from its little > chicken head fireball-egg shitting evil. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > Hey! That's not evil...that's good! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 10:07:37 EST From: KrodKnid@aol.com Subject: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) In a message dated 2/26/2002 11:23:00 AM Eastern Standard Time, monkeytrinket@yahoo.com writes: > Well lets look at rape. I don't think we > need a definition here we're all pretty comfortable > with the run of the mill Hollywood embellished non > vagina monologue bad act. Well lets say we rape the > evil chicken... Is this two wrongs making a right by > punishing the evil chicken or is this simply evil > begetting evil? > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I say we grind its beak down flush, pluck all the feathers out of its neck, vaseline that sucker up real good...then let some Hollywood perv use it as an alternative to "gerbiling". ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 10:15:47 EST From: KrodKnid@aol.com Subject: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) In a message dated 2/26/2002 7:28:20 PM Eastern Standard Time, jbell126@nac.net writes: > Being the moral relativist that you are, then, do you believe is it okay to > rape and torture women for personal pleasure? > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Okay for which party? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 10:23:10 EST From: KrodKnid@aol.com Subject: Re: NPR Morpheus In a message dated 2/27/2002 12:16:09 AM Eastern Standard Time, tool326@hotmail.com writes: > im having the same problems with my morpheus tooany suggestions out > there? Nick > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OrganizedAudio.com http://organizedaudio.com/ Go there...download the "unblocked" version of Morpheus he has up (it is a European release that has minimal spyware too). Then don't upgrade to any newer version after installation. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 16:38:54 GMT+1 From: Thierry Pottier Subject: To the 'girl who came to the most shows...of anyone' Hi sweet 'girl who came to the most shows...of anyone'... You've not been posting for a while !!! What becomes of you ??? Are you OK ??? Friendly Thierry ______________________________________________________ Bonte aux lettres - Caramail - http://www.caramail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 08:51:36 -0800 (PST) From: surveyboy@address.com Subject: NPR philosophical blahblah Jess" said: >>Maybe I'm just missing something cause I'm not feeling bad for these people and I don't feel obliged to give their surviving families my money because of their loved one's mistake of working in one of the most likely targets for terrorist attacks in the U.S. The only reason most people cared about the attack is because they realized hey I might be next. << What the HE!! are you saying? What about those firefighters that got killed? What about those young people in the upper floors so excited about being in a good job? What about all of those people in the planes? Should we not feel bad for them and thier familys because 'the should have known better' also? Now YOU on the other hand, should have had your ass up there on the 100th floor. It would have made this place better. You think that we shouldn't feel bad about all of them because 'they should have known better than to work there'? WTF. The ONLY reason we cared about this is because we might be next? Not exactly. I care because it could be me, my wife, my father, my mother, my grandparents, my sister, my brother, my neighbor, my coworker, they guy who reads my water meter, that cop who let me go with a warning, he!! that cop who gave me a ticket. To me, You are so full of BULLSH!T and stupidity, you give HUMAN a bad name. Shaun - --------------------------------------------------------------- Get Free Internet Access And WebEmail At http://www.address.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 11:24:55 -0500 From: "John A, Bell" Subject: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) If there is no universal constant of good and evil, the aforementioned action occuring would present you with no basis for legitimately being angry, seeing as that person's morals may dictate that they did nothing wrong. While people do not HAVE to adhere to a universal set of standards, that doesn't mean they don't exist. I believe this standard exists whether or not humans exist. It is much the same as I believe that it is a universal constant of the universe that light travels a given speed in a vacuum; whether or not someone recognizes or accepts that fact doesn't change it. If there was a universally convincing argument that would convince everyone, philosophers would not still debate about the topic. Yet, they do. But the resolution of subjective morals in the world (not just societal) cannot ever be resolved, even if I am right - people do not have to accept truth, whatever that truth may be. They'll just be wrong if they choose to ignore it. - -jb - -jb - ----- Original Message ----- From: "j." To: Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 1:42 AM Subject: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) > > On Tue, Feb 26, 2002 at 07:30:16PM -0500, John A, Bell wrote: > > If this is the case, then, regardless of law (which wasn't the issue), > > nothing is moral, nothing is immoral... moral nihilism all around, eh? > > > No. You're twisting my words around. I've said that morals don't exist in > any universal, objective sense, not that they don't exist at all. There are > individual morals, or sets of values, and then there are societal morals, which > are simply the common elements of the individual morals of a society. > > That being said, however, you still have to present me with anything other than > emotional appeals (see below) to the effect that there is a universal set of > moral values that everyone, everywhere, as long as humans existed or will > exist, values. > > > I wonder if the case would be the same if your girlfriend, mother, wife, or > > daughter were raped and tortured, or murdered, or anything else. > > > > -jb > > > Of course I would be upset. You're missing the point, still, and I fail to see > how your theoretical situation works on any level at all save emotional. How > would something bad happening to somebody I care for all of a sudden convince > me that there HAS to be an unchanging universal basis for everybody's notions > of right and wrong? > > [snip] ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 11:26:00 -0500 From: "John A, Bell" Subject: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) Than answer/question sums up the moral relativist view. Thank you. - -jb ----- Original Message ----- From: KrodKnid@aol.com To: jbell126@nac.net ; jak@ircii.org ; angry-psychos@smoe.org Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 10:15 AM Subject: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) In a message dated 2/26/2002 7:28:20 PM Eastern Standard Time, jbell126@nac.net writes: Being the moral relativist that you are, then, do you believe is it okay to rape and torture women for personal pleasure? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Okay for which party? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 11:53:01 EST From: Spidersrcute2@aol.com Subject: Re:NPR Morpheus I'll look into it. Mine wasn't booting up last night for some reason. Once I find out why and where to go to get the latest one, I'll fill you guys in. Tracie ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 11:56:33 -0500 From: Derek Benton Subject: NPR: Philo-Blah Jess, I fail to see how working at the WTC is stupidity. Yes, it is a HUGE target for terrorists, does that mean we should live in fear and conduct our lives thus? No thanks, none for me. I won't twist your words around, but it *could* be argued that is what you are suggesting. Words like callous, cold, unfeeling came to mind when I read your post, but I won't attach them to your personal character, as I do not know you and whether or not that is how you *really* feel is up for grabs, the 'net is great for that, you can be whoever you wanna be, wear whatever mask you wish, nobody would be none the wiser. But, being that is what you are presenting, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that IS how you fee, and you certainly have that right. I strongly disagree with you. To say the people who worked in the WTC "Should have known better" is ridiculous. Yes, it was bombed before. No, its no large stretch of the imagination to think that it would be a target again. I'm sure there were people who thought about that everyday they went to work, but still went because more tangible and practical things like bills and living expenses (or if you're me, BEER MONEY =) ) overcame their fear of a possible attack. Many people likely refused to live in fear of what MAY happen. IMO, we can only live in the here and now, worrying about what "may" happen is pointless, and leads only to an early grave, there's nothing that can be done about it. I'm also just as sure many people NEVER thought something like that would happen. Does that make them naive or stupid, or even asking for trouble? Not to me, that makes them human, and living their lives and going to work to support themselves, their family. I'll not convince you to have sympathy for those that died, whether you do or not doesn't change the way I feel about it. Try as I might, I fail to grasp how the people working there were stupid and asking for trouble or "should have known better" though. Perhaps whether or not a possible place of work is a target for terrorist attack is something you consider before applying for a job, but I'd say you're in the minority. Derek ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 11:57:48 EST From: Spidersrcute2@aol.com Subject: NPR Morpheus Did you guys try going to Musiccity.com??? Just wondering. Tracie ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 12:30:45 EST From: LolipopFailure@aol.com Subject: Re: NPR philosophical blahblah i'll have to agree with derek and shaun on this one. even if they did "know better" so what. lives were lost....and these lives had husbands and wives and children that will never see then again. everyone that died, i can guarentee had at least one person who truely cared for them.....those are the people i have sympathy for....those who wake up every morning reaching across the bed to realize its empty. those who keep waiting for the phone to ring...or the doorbell to chime...those who have birthday and christmas presents waiting to never get opened. its hard not to feel something for these people. eryn ...and the way the rain comes down hard....thats how i feel inside..... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 14:48:06 -0500 From: "SteVisOK" Subject: RE: NPR Morpheus Thanks for your suggestions and links. I installed the version described in your message. Did not delete the previous, however they look like the same rev. I also want to preserve the stuff that is partially downloaded and I believe that I'll lose it if I de-install. Mebbe it's already lost. The result - still unable to connect to the Morpheus network 'cause the software version is too out of date. However, the result page afterwards has changed since yesterday - now it reads: << We understand that some of you are having difficulties connecting to your Morpheus User Network. As you know from recent newsletters, Morpheus has been preparing to substantially upgrade the Morpheus software. Unexpectedly, one of our software providers made a significant upgrade to their technology that is currently incompatible with Morpheus. We share our Morpheus users' frustration with this action and are committed to getting you back up on the network as soon as possible. As a result, we are accelerating the release of our new Morpheus software and within days expect Morpheus users to enjoy the Morpheus Preview Edition. The Morpheus Preview Edition will provide enhanced capabilities, a new, easy-to-use interface and most importantly, will provide access to more search results. In addition, we want to assure our users that, unlike other peer-to-peer networks, we remain committed to a free software product without spy ware. We appreciate our users' loyalty to the Morpheus product and are committed to providing you with the best peer-to-peer network in the world. We appreciate your patience during this short transition. Please check back for exact availability to download the new Morpheus Preview Edition.... >> looks like it's an overall situation of upgrade mania. SteVe ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 15:31:59 EST From: KrodKnid@aol.com Subject: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) In a message dated 2/27/2002 11:26:52 AM Eastern Standard Time, jbell126@nac.net writes: > While people do not HAVE to adhere to a universal set of standards, that > doesn't mean they don't exist. I believe this standard exists whether or > not > humans exist. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > Without human beings, there is still a universal code for human behavior? > Um...I don't THINK so. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 15:33:44 EST From: KrodKnid@aol.com Subject: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) In a message dated 2/27/2002 11:26:52 AM Eastern Standard Time, jbell126@nac.net writes: > It is much the same as I believe that it is a universal > constant of the universe that light travels a given speed in a vacuum; > whether or not someone recognizes or accepts that fact doesn't change it. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The speed of light in a vaccuum is a physical fact of the nature of light in this particular space/time continuum...human morality is not even in the same class of reality. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 15:44:04 -0500 From: "Conor Riley" Subject: Re: Philo-Blah Ditto Derek, that was one of the greatest posts ive ever read on this ap email list. i usually dont post that much here and just read and respond to a few but yours really moved me. nice job man. - -conor- - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Derek Benton" To: Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 11:56 AM Subject: NPR: Philo-Blah > > Jess, > > I fail to see how working at the WTC is stupidity. > > Yes, it is a HUGE target for terrorists, does that mean we should live > in fear and conduct our lives thus? No thanks, none for me. I won't twist > your words around, but it *could* be argued that is what you are suggesting. > > Words like callous, cold, unfeeling came to mind when I read your post, > but I won't attach them to your personal character, as I do not know you and > whether or not that is how you *really* feel is up for grabs, the 'net is > great for that, you can be whoever you wanna be, wear whatever mask you > wish, nobody would be none the wiser. But, being that is what you are > presenting, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that IS how > you fee, and you certainly have that right. I strongly disagree with you. > > To say the people who worked in the WTC "Should have known better" is > ridiculous. Yes, it was bombed before. No, its no large stretch of the > imagination to think that it would be a target again. I'm sure there were > people who thought about that everyday they went to work, but still went > because more tangible and practical things like bills and living expenses > (or if you're me, BEER MONEY =) ) overcame their fear of a possible attack. > Many people likely refused to live in fear of what MAY happen. IMO, we can > only live in the here and now, worrying about what "may" happen is > pointless, and leads only to an early grave, there's nothing that can be > done about it. > > I'm also just as sure many people NEVER thought something like that > would happen. Does that make them naive or stupid, or even asking for > trouble? Not to me, that makes them human, and living their lives and going > to work to support themselves, their family. > > I'll not convince you to have sympathy for those that died, whether you > do or not doesn't change the way I feel about it. Try as I might, I fail to > grasp how the people working there were stupid and asking for trouble or > "should have known better" though. Perhaps whether or not a possible place > of work is a target for terrorist attack is something you consider before > applying for a job, but I'd say you're in the minority. > > Derek ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 15:53:00 EST From: KrodKnid@aol.com Subject: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) In a message dated 2/27/2002 11:27:26 AM Eastern Standard Time, jbell126@nac.net writes: > Than answer/question sums up the moral relativist view. Thank you. > > -jb > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> A: I am not a moral relativist...or an anything-"ist" for that matter. B: I was being facetious...or ffceseous, if you prefer. Morality is entirely a matter of aesthetic choice. Let me ask you...is the commandment "Thou shalt not kill", or "Thou shalt not commit murder"? Is it okay to kill for certain motivations and not for others? Does Jesus kill? If not, why do we die? How much of the Judeo-Christian moral code is simply based stuff God doesn't like? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 16:19:33 -0500 From: "Andrea E. Jackman" Subject: Re: NPR philosophical blahblah if i may interject . . . the nature of light, its speed, and its applications/implications on space/time continuum are not really widely accepted or agreed upon theories. never have been. even Einstein began to back off in the end with uncertainties arising. astronomers are still trying to decide if red shift and blue shift are accurate measurements to determine the speed at which objects in the space field are moving towards or away (and i say ' to or from WHAT'?!?! ... even THAT is perspective based.) vacuum or no, things DO get in the way. and well --- as for human morality and reality . . . as a psychologist, you can never second guess those bits correctly either. i rely on quantum mechanics and fractals in this case. at the tiniest level, it's all connected and self-same repetitive, so i try not to muck up the system too much by adding my share of grief, dismay, disappointment, general malaise, or grossly misdirected anger. ///Andrea littleREDelf - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; > > It is much the same as I believe that it is a universal > > constant of the universe that light travels a given speed in a vacuum; > > whether or not someone recognizes or accepts that fact doesn't change it. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > The speed of light in a vaccuum is a physical fact of the nature of light in > this particular space/time continuum...human morality is not even in the same > class of reality. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 16:31:12 -0500 From: Derek Benton Subject: NPR: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) > A: I am not a moral relativist...or an anything-"ist" for that matter. > B: I was being facetious...or ffceseous, if you prefer. > > Morality is entirely a matter of aesthetic choice. > Let me ask you...is the commandment "Thou shalt not kill", or > "Thou shalt not commit murder"? Is it okay to kill for certain > motivations and not for others? Does Jesus kill? If not, why do we > die? How much of the Judeo-Christian moral code is simply based > stuff God doesn't like? See, now there's the thing of it. If someone is Christian, they more or less adapt Christian ideals. However, different denominations (and permutations thereof) agree and disagree on SEVERAL issues pertaining to morals, etc. For instance, a Catholic priest CANNOT marry while a Baptist Minister can. Some Baptist churches DO NOT allow female ministers, others do. Also, the Catholic church believes it is a sin to use contraceptives (not that all Catholics share this) whereas many Protestants don't. So, with Judeo-Christian moral CODES you have dissention, and they all believe in the same God. The same goes for all organized religions (and some non-organized ones), IMO. To me, this is why it's damn hard to affix any sort of "real" or "true" religious/moral code to just about anything. Now, someone who chooses to follow a, say, Southern Baptist paradigm is choosing to see things in that way. Perhaps they are narrow-minded for choosing to do so, perhaps seeing things this way narrows their mind, but, that is the way they choose to perceive the world around them (assuming they actually follow their moral code). It's like sunglasses that have different colors, the pair you put on "colors" how you see the world around you. Being Celtic Pagan, some, if not most or all of the Christian moral code just doesn't fit in with my view of morals or the way the world works. Some does. Right or wrong doesn't enter my mind, just different. Yeah, I may think my Bible thumping boss is off his rocker and a hypocrit, but I don't push my beliefs on him, nor do I use that to judge the X-tian moral code. I don't begrudge somebody's morals, unless/until those morals conflict with me in an unhealthy and negative way (I.E. physical harm, dispossession, alienation of rights that SHOULD NOT be based on religion). As for killing, I think if its in self defense, or even to avenge a wrongful death it is morally acceptable, but even then, for me, there is a whole 'nother checklist (so to speak) to it. So, it doesn't apply to EVERY situation (even wrongful death). Of course, we Celts no longer pillage anymore (mostly), though the neighbor with the attractive brunette wife and PS2 is pushing his luck...LOL!! That's it for now Derek ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 16:42:44 -0500 From: "Conor Riley" Subject: KPR top 10 songs IYO of 2001- early 02 This is all opinion wise, the best songs from 2001 and early 2002 10. "Slave"-Britney Spears2001--its a good song, forget its britney for 2 seconds, listen to it and stop your bitching its my damn list..haha. 09. "Tainted Love"-Marilyn Manson2002 08. "Island In The Sun"-Weezer2001 07. "Bleed American"-Jimmy Eat World2001 06. "Can't Get You Outta My Head"-Kylie Minouge 2002 05. "Shit on the radio"-Nelly Furtado2002 04. "New York, New York"-Ryan Adams2001 03. "Silence(Paul Oakenfold Remix)"-Delirium and Sarah McLachlan2001 02. "The Best Deceptions"-Dashboard Confessional2001 01. "Haunted"-POE2001 i know you probably hate my list and ill probably think of 10 better songs later but thats it for now. - -conor- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 16:44:10 EST From: KrodKnid@aol.com Subject: Re: NPR Morpheus In a message dated 2/27/2002 2:48:53 PM Eastern Standard Time, svisokay@nexet.net writes: > looks like it's an overall situation of upgrade mania. > > SteVe > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hell, just get WinMX...it is like Napster only better, and has never used any spyware. WinMX - The best way to share your media http://www.winmx.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 17:53:53 -0600 From: "Jess" Subject: Re: NPR philosophical blahblah > What the HE!! are you saying? What about those firefighters that got killed? > What about those young people in the upper floors so excited about being in a > good job? > What about all of those people in the planes? Should we not feel bad for them > and thier familys because 'the should have known better' also? Did I say anything about the people on the planes? That could have been anyone and firefighters lose their lives all the time, it's part of the danger of being a firefighter. Now I'm not going to pretend I care but I don't think firefighters 'should have known better' because they chose to save lives and sometimes that comes at a cost and that was their choice to put their life on the line. This situation is a little bit different than the people who worked in a building with the looming possiblity of something like this happening and then they were surprised when it did happen. As for the people 'so excited' about their good job, their families will probably get more out of this than the family whose father was killed by a drunk driver. Some people just have all the luck! Most (meaning not ALL) of the families whose loved ones worked there are probably pretty damn well off already or can still manage things without my money. > Now YOU on the other hand, should have had your ass up there on the 100th > floor. It would have made this place better. I'm sure there could be a good argument for that but darn assholes with their own opinions like me exist. Don't you just hate it when people think for themselves! > You think that we shouldn't feel bad about all of them because 'they should > have known better than to work there'? WTF. I can pretend I care, will that make you feel better? I honestly don't care if you feel bad for them or not, I'm just telling you I don't. The ONLY reason we cared about this is because we might be next? Not exactly. > I care because it could be me, my wife, my father, my mother, my grandparents, > my sister, my brother, my neighbor, my coworker, they guy who reads my water > meter, that cop who let me go with a warning, he!! that cop who gave me a > ticket. > To me, You are so full of BULLSH!T and stupidity, you give HUMAN a bad name. If I go along with how the rest of the nation feels will that make me less stupid because then I'll think like everyone else does? I'm so SORRY I have to have my own opinion and don't have the same morals as everyone else. But you proved my point anyways so thanks. The point is because you feel you could be (or HAVE BEEN, is that better?) affected by this directly which is probably a lot of people's only reason for caring but I doubt anyone would actually say so. If Americans don't think it has anything to do with them then they don't care and you can argue with that all you want but I can think of a million examples throughout history. I never expected people to admit to being self centered and I didn't say everyone was either, that's why I had some phrase in these (little things). I actually put things in my email to show I didn't think this way about everyone but that doesn't even work so I give up. Jessica I don't know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying to please everybody. -Bill Cosby ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 18:00:22 -0600 From: "Jess" Subject: Re: NPR philosophical blahblah I can understand why you'd feel bad for them but no amount of money makes people come back. I just don't have enough sympathy to go around so I choose to care about my close friends and people I know personally. Jessica - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 11:30 AM Subject: Re: NPR philosophical blahblah > > i'll have to agree with derek and shaun on this one. even if they did "know > better" so what. lives were lost....and these lives had husbands and wives > and children that will never see then again. everyone that died, i can > guarentee had at least one person who truely cared for them.....those are the > people i have sympathy for....those who wake up every morning reaching across > the bed to realize its empty. those who keep waiting for the phone to > ring...or the doorbell to chime...those who have birthday and christmas > presents waiting to never get opened. its hard not to feel something for > these people. > eryn > > > ...and the way the rain comes down hard....thats how i feel inside..... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 20:36:41 -0500 From: "sp00k@poe.org" Subject: NPR Blizzard CamS (spam) It's a blizzard here, a white out at times, and if you never seen snow, or ain't used to seeing it, OR you wonder why it is that people bother to set up webcams, stop by and see what will draw 700 to 1000 people in the next 24 hours because it is snowing out. AND these aint no little dinky pictures, these are 3 webcams putting out a 640 X 480 image each 15 seconds. If you have the new Internet Explorer with the image auto resize feature turned on, set your screen resolution to 600 x 800 for some very clear night time viewing... http://digitalster.com sp00k etc ... Http://Poe.Org Http://DigitalSter.Com ================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 21:39:53 EST From: LolipopFailure@aol.com Subject: Re: NPR philosophical blahblah its not so much the money as it is the fact that someone cares I can understand why you'd feel bad for them but no amount of money makes people come back. I just don't have enough sympathy to go around so I choose to care about my close friends and people I know personally. ...and the way the rain comes down hard....thats how i feel inside..... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 22:32:22 -0500 From: "John A, Bell" Subject: NPR:Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) Sorry, that was supposed to go to this message. My argument was: Good and evil are absolutes in the universe. They don't necessarily apply to human behaviour. - -jb - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 3:31 PM Subject: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) > > In a message dated 2/27/2002 11:26:52 AM Eastern Standard Time, > jbell126@nac.net writes: > > > > While people do not HAVE to adhere to a universal set of standards, that > > doesn't mean they don't exist. I believe this standard exists whether or > > not > > humans exist. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > Without human beings, there is still a universal code for human behavior? > > Um...I don't THINK so. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Feb 2002 22:33:05 -0500 From: "John A, Bell" Subject: NPR DAMN NPR DAMN NPR I keep forgetting that Outlook filters the NPR. Sorry, guys. - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; Sent: Wednesday, February 27, 2002 3:33 PM Subject: Re: philosophical blahblah (renamed from the bitching-about-survey thread) > > In a message dated 2/27/2002 11:26:52 AM Eastern Standard Time, > jbell126@nac.net writes: > > > > It is much the same as I believe that it is a universal > > constant of the universe that light travels a given speed in a vacuum; > > whether or not someone recognizes or accepts that fact doesn't change it. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > The speed of light in a vaccuum is a physical fact of the nature of light in > this particular space/time continuum...human morality is not even in the same > class of reality. ------------------------------ End of angry-psychos-digest V7 #61 **********************************