From: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org (alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest) To: ammf-digest@smoe.org Subject: alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V5 #314 Reply-To: ammf@fruvous.com Sender: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest Thursday, November 29 2001 Volume 05 : Number 314 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: his point ["Cap'n" <"capn"@home.com (deletethistoreply)>] Re: his point ["Angela Anuszewski" ] Re: his point ["Nathan Werner" ] Re: his point [Jordan McClure ] Re: his point ["Cap'n" <"capn"@home.com (deletethistoreply)>] Re: his point [Poot Rootbeer ] Re: his point (fwd) [Lynne ] Re: his point ["A.J. LoCicero" ] Re: his point [SugarFly26@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 05:23:43 GMT From: "Cap'n" <"capn"@home.com (deletethistoreply)> Subject: Re: his point That's a great article. Thanks for posting the link, I never would have seen it if you hadn't. He's a very smart guy. Cap'n Lynne wrote: > > There's a new "Here's my point" a very interesting tale of adventures of > jian's NE US tour. > jianghomeshi.com > or direct link > > http://globeandmail.ca/servlet/GIS.Servlets.HTMLTemplate?tf=tgam/search/tgam/SearchFullStory.html&cf=tgam/search/tgam/SearchFullStory.cfg&configFileLoc=tgam/config&encoded_keywords=a+dove+in+the+land+of+the+eagle&option=&start_row=1¤t_row=1&start_row_offset1=&num_rows=1&search_results_start=1 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 09:50:28 GMT From: "Angela Anuszewski" Subject: Re: his point I didn't write him after the Rochester show, but I was deeply offended and am seriously considering not going to see him again. I don't want to kill innocent people either, but a lot of the people there are NOT innocent, and when he commented that because he could understand hat the Taliban reps were saying on TV without translation and it made them into human beings to him, I'd like to politely remind him that these people enslave their own countrymen, killing people who dare to listen to music like the stuff he's playing on stage. Those people that will starve to death? chances are they would have starved anyway under the unjust rule. The Taliban are not human beings to me, not if they inhibit those inalienable rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness in the people. - -- Those who laugh at "UHF" should inspire our admiration; in these dreary times we must treasure the easily amused. - Roger Ebert "Cap'n" <"capn"@(deletethistoreply)home.com> wrote in message news:zx_M7.378$Rp6.187799@news2.rdc1.ab.home.com... > That's a great article. Thanks for posting the link, I never would have > seen it if you hadn't. He's a very smart guy. > > Cap'n > > Lynne wrote: > > > > There's a new "Here's my point" a very interesting tale of adventures of > > jian's NE US tour. > > jianghomeshi.com > > or direct link > > > > http://globeandmail.ca/servlet/GIS.Servlets.HTMLTemplate?tf=tgam/search/tgam /SearchFullStory.html&cf=tgam/search/tgam/SearchFullStory.cfg&configFileLoc= tgam/config&encoded_keywords=a+dove+in+the+land+of+the+eagle&option=&start_r ow=1¤t_row=1&start_row_offset1=&num_rows=1&search_results_start=1 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 13:07:22 -0500 From: "Nathan Werner" Subject: Re: his point Lynne, thank you for posting that article. I know many people disagree with Jian's politics at times, but I really think that misses the point in this case. I was glad to finally see a public figure discuss that all of America isn't racing off to wage war. The modern media have taken it upon themselves to convince us that death is the only solution to the tragedy of 9/11. I applaud Jian's effort to bring light to those of us that are completely ignored by the 'free press.' Thanks again for posting. Nathan Werner wernerna_at_msu_dot_edu "Lynne" wrote in message news:Pine.LNX.4.05.10111272232500.8127-100000@jade.zeal.net... > There's a new "Here's my point" a very interesting tale of adventures of > jian's NE US tour. > jianghomeshi.com > or direct link > > http://globeandmail.ca/servlet/GIS.Servlets.HTMLTemplate?tf=tgam/search/tgam /SearchFullStory.html&cf=tgam/search/tgam/SearchFullStory.cfg&configFileLoc= tgam/config&encoded_keywords=a+dove+in+the+land+of+the+eagle&option=&start_r ow=1¤t_row=1&start_row_offset1=&num_rows=1&search_results_start=1 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 19:27:49 -0000 From: Jordan McClure Subject: Re: his point In article , Lynne wrote: > There's a new "Here's my point" a very interesting tale of > adventures of jian's NE US tour. For those who have as much trouble with that link as I did: http://makeashorterlink.com/?B2F45113 - -- Jordan McClure (jordan@fnordia.com) http://fnordia.com - -- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2001 00:57:19 GMT From: "Cap'n" <"capn"@home.com (deletethistoreply)> Subject: Re: his point Good job Nathan. You said that better than I did. That's what I was trying to say, but I got distracted as I wrote. Cap'n Nathan Werner wrote: > > Lynne, thank you for posting that article. I know many people disagree with > Jian's politics at times, but I really think that misses the point in this > case. I was glad to finally see a public figure discuss that all of America > isn't racing off to wage war. The modern media have taken it upon > themselves to convince us that death is the only solution to the tragedy of > 9/11. I applaud Jian's effort to bring light to those of us that are > completely ignored by the 'free press.' Thanks again for posting. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2001 02:08:48 GMT From: Poot Rootbeer Subject: Re: his point "Angela Anuszewski" wrote: > I'd like to politely remind him that these people enslave their own > countrymen, 'Enslave' is an inappropriate word. > killing people who dare to listen to music like the stuff he's > playing on stage. Please cite one media report that suggests the Taliban has or has ever had a policy of sentencing people to death for listening to forbidden music. Even under their twisted interpretation of Islamic law, that punishment doesn't fit the crime. > Those people that will starve to death? chances > are they would have starved anyway under the unjust rule. That sounds uncomfortably close to "we had to destroy the village in order to save it" to me... I'm not out to preach tolerance for the Taliban philosophy, but denying those people their personhood strikes me as more than a little callous. What other ethnic groups would you consider to be non-human? - -Poot ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 20:55:26 -0600 (CST) From: Lynne Subject: Re: his point (fwd) but angela, those rights you described in your last sentence, are OUR rights American rights. I don't claim to know what we should or shouldn't be doing, but to use bombs to persuade a country to be "what makes US comfortable" makes me uncomfortable. - -lynne - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 09:50:28 GMT From: Angela Anuszewski To: ammf@fruvous.com Newsgroups: alt.music.moxy-fruvous Subject: Re: his point I didn't write him after the Rochester show, but I was deeply offended and am seriously considering not going to see him again. I don't want to kill innocent people either, but a lot of the people there are NOT innocent, and when he commented that because he could understand hat the Taliban reps were saying on TV without translation and it made them into human beings to him, I'd like to politely remind him that these people enslave their own countrymen, killing people who dare to listen to music like the stuff he's playing on stage. Those people that will starve to death? chances are they would have starved anyway under the unjust rule. The Taliban are not human beings to me, not if they inhibit those inalienable rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness in the people. - -- Those who laugh at "UHF" should inspire our admiration; in these dreary times we must treasure the easily amused. - Roger Ebert "Cap'n" <"capn"@(deletethistoreply)home.com> wrote in message news:zx_M7.378$Rp6.187799@news2.rdc1.ab.home.com... > That's a great article. Thanks for posting the link, I never would have > seen it if you hadn't. He's a very smart guy. > > Cap'n > > Lynne wrote: > > > > There's a new "Here's my point" a very interesting tale of adventures of > > jian's NE US tour. > > jianghomeshi.com > > or direct link > > > > http://globeandmail.ca/servlet/GIS.Servlets.HTMLTemplate?tf=tgam/search/tgam /SearchFullStory.html&cf=tgam/search/tgam/SearchFullStory.cfg&configFileLoc= tgam/config&encoded_keywords=a+dove+in+the+land+of+the+eagle&option=&start_r ow=1¤t_row=1&start_row_offset1=&num_rows=1&search_results_start=1 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2001 04:44:00 GMT From: "A.J. LoCicero" Subject: Re: his point > I'm not out to preach tolerance for the Taliban philosophy, but > denying those people their personhood strikes me as more than a little > callous. What other ethnic groups would you consider to be non-human? The Taliban are NOT an ethnic group any more than the IRA are an ethnic group. They are a fanatical political/religious movement. Their views and goals are, to my way of thinking, evil to the level of the Nazis. To free Afghanistan from their control, even by force is a positive step in the same sense that liberating Europe from the Nazis was. (Yea, more so I would say, as the violence used against the Taliban has been neither as extreme, nor as indiscriminate as that employed against the Axis). Jian's argument (as I've sketchily heard it reported) about his ethnic ties to some Afghans make no sense to me at all. The Afghans that are culturally related to Jian (i.e.. those from the west of the country) were themselves being persecuted by the Taliban, and have been fighting against them now for six years. The US attacking the Taliban does not seem like it could hurt the situation of those people. Also I wish to point out that his situation now is no different than that faced by French Italian, German, and Japanese Americans and Canadians in the Second World War. At that time it was MY cousins in Italy that were at risk from US bombardment. Does that mean that I should be opposed those actions? Nonsense. I support the general aims of US actions in World War II, as did my grandparents and my great-grandparents at the time. They knew that those actions were necessary if their homeland was ever to be freed from Fascism (another politico-religious movement). In the same way, Jian should realize that it is in the interests of nearly everyone in the world that the Taliban be brought down, and that Al Quaida be destroyed. Doing that is going to cost a few lives. It is an awful truth, but a truth just that same. A.J. (card carrying liberal) -- "I am here to make an announcement that this Thursday, ticket counters and airplanes will fly out of Ronald Reagan Airport."--G.W. Bush, Arlington VA, Oct. 2, 2001. Email:aj@locicero.org ICQ: 13117113 AIM: locicero For some of the best Long Distance and Calling Card rates around visit http://www.ld.net/?sensible. Cheap rates and *I* get a commission! ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2001 22:38:07 EST From: SugarFly26@aol.com Subject: Re: his point Poot said: <> Political groups more than ethnic...someone in one of my classes compared Taliban and KKK in a long and lucid debate..interesting to think about. Ln ------------------------------ End of alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V5 #314 ********************************************