From: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org (alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest) To: ammf-digest@smoe.org Subject: alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V4 #200 Reply-To: ammf@fruvous.com Sender: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest Friday, April 28 2000 Volume 04 : Number 200 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) [Donna Hunt ] Pawling review and setlist ["Neilbert" ] Pawling Set List [ScarletB23@aol.com] OT: rant: Anti-Arabism & growing up Jewish [spin0za1@aol.commmm (Spin0za1] Re: Pawling review and setlist [vika@attglobal.net (Vika Zafrin)] Re: Pawling Set List [tmbgirl@my-deja.com] Re: Obscure Fruvous ref! [Lori Martin ] Re: Pawling review and setlist [mbschick@aol.com (MBSchick)] Re: OT: rant: Anti-Arabism & growing up Jewish [Maggie Deegan Subject: Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) Vika Zafrin wrote: > Oh, no argument here. It's damn close. But to think that there's > actually a country on this planet where you can say that, that it's *not > impossible* to rise from the very bottom that opportunity (however > small) exists, is stupefying and hope-giving. That's a rare case, I'm > sure I don't need to tell you. I simply feel the need to throw this into the mix: There are so many studies that people have done that show that many, many folks who are really rockbottom homeless/jobless are actually mentally ill. Schizophrenic, Split-personality disorders, extreme bi-polar, etc. I believe that these are people who very clearly *cannot* pull themselves up from the bottom of the heap, that they do need help and protection and fostering. Just throwing a little compassion into the political debate. ciao, donna ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 06:55:22 GMT From: "Neilbert" Subject: Pawling review and setlist Well, first things first - if you ever get to see someone at the Towne Crier, it's well worth it. Small place (less than 150 people) and very cozy. The Kelly family descended upon the place about 7:45 or so, and it wasn't too crowded. By showtime tho, it was as full as the fire marshall would let it. So, the opening act was Mike Errico and he was very good... so good, I bought his disc and listened to it coming back. The man tells a wonderful story, oh, yeah, he can play too. Check him out. A blow by blow of the show itself (mostly a setlist, a few comments of what I remember) BJ Horseshoes a little bit about how most of the time, the shows are prerecorded. The Kid's Song - a favorite of my brother Andy, who got to see it live.... plus Mike's use of "I see dead people." :-) Present Tense Tureen - as Jian was bouncing around, I thought to myself "he's getting awfully close to Murray." Sure enough, he bumped into the bass with his little shaker-thingy and dropped it. Recovered quickly though... woo hoo! JOhnny Saucep'n... one of the fastest renditions I've seen. Spiderman... off mic, with the band in the audience. Whilst singing, Mike notices a (gasp) tape recorder. HE grabs it and decides to stress test the condenser mic in it... by yelling into it, of course. Sad Girl Pisco Stuck In the 90's... with an elian intro, which made the song a little more relevant Early Morning Rain... because the lads are the Sunday headliners at Fol kFestival in Ontario, and Gordon Lightfoot (one of their biggest fans, so of course, he'll be at the show :-) is headlining Saturday. Boo Time Mistra Know It All Pork Tenderloin (which will be on C) Guinea Pig (Which will also be on C) an improv jam which began with "Dave, where ya been?" "Checking the NASDAQ" and included bits of Fame, The Safety Dance, Feelin Alright, Play that Funky Music, Can't Always Get what you want and Hey Jude. Mike Errico joined them onstage to help out. River Valley Get In The Car I Will Hold On - beautiful. Every time I see this song, I come closer to crying, just because of what was in my life when I first heard it. My Poor Generation King Of Spain Michigan Militia Encore: Nowhere Man Gulf War Song, off mic. Quite possibly, the best show I've seen. My sister picked up an "I Canadian Boys" t shirt, which Tobey graciously allowed her to try on before buying. My father got his a capella singing with GWS and Spiderman. He almost got Kick In The Ass, too... a boy named Graeme yelled out a request for it and they seemed to toy with it for a moment. When's Providence again? :-) - -- - -Neil neil@neilbert.com www.neilbert.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 08:23:30 GMT From: ScarletB23@aol.com Subject: Pawling Set List All I can say is Wow! I think tonight's show has surpassed any other Früvous show I've ever seen. It was even better than NOHO 12/30/99 for me and I never thought I'd see a show that could top 5 Murray songs in a night but tonight's definitely did. Murray's Set List B.J. Horse Kids Tur Sauce Spidey Sad Pisco Stuck Early Booty Mistrah Tenderloin Guinea River Car Hold MPG King Mich Billie (not played) ENCORE Gord's Gold (not played) Nowhere Splat (not played) GWS (not on setlist) Opener: Mike Errico. He was awesome. What a great way to open the show. Definitely check him out. Since Neil already posted a lot of the banter already, I going to just add to it. The bit about how most of the time, the shows are prerecorded was funny but that is this small venue they might actually have to play tonight and forgive them since they don't do it often. I think it was Mike who complained how heavy the instruments were since they usually use cardboard cutouts. Before Tureen banter included the guys talking of some Canadian commercial none of the audience had seen and went on to include hobbits and such. Also before Jian could reclaim his dropped shaker, he grabbed and used the Johnny Saucepan metal one. After Guinea Pig the guys started an improve jam with "Dave, Where ya been" "Checking the NASDAQ". They then got Mike Errico to join them on stage pulled away from a waitress who he was trying to get a date from. The jam included Fame, The Last Time, into The Safety Dance, to Feelin' Alright, to Play that Funky Music to Can't Always Get What You Want back into the NASDAQ improv ending with Hey Jude. Let me say is was an incredible jam. :) The guys asked the town crier owner if they were playing too long since they said they could play all night which brought many cheer from the crowd. Personally, being a Deadhead, I adored the jamming and hope to hear the lads to do this more often!!! I think in-between IWHO and MPG is when the guys had trivia for free tickets to FRFF and the Blues festival, which I think is either a week before or after FRFF. For the Blues Festival, the question was which performer has performed at all the FRFFs but for the actual FRFF, Jian made it a little harder by asking a hockey question of who is the center of the Leafs who just got hurt. Funny, it was answered by the only Canadian in the audience. Other banter includes Jian's on going Brittany Spears is the real thing/Christina is only a fake and he even went to get a newspaper to read about Christina upcoming tour sponsored by Sears who of course is carrying a full line of her merchandise. Also Tobey gave a final score of the Knicks/Toronto Raptors gave. The Raptors who had been ahead all gave lost it in the end to our NY Knicks. Jian told a story about eating in a Denny's in Fishskill this afternoon where his young pierced and tattooed waitress keep calling him Honey or asking is everything OK dear. He say is was scary to have someone so young talk with him like he'd expect an older more motherly waitress to do. That it was sort of she was acting outside the stereo type of the younger generation. This I think was the intro to MPG after the tickets. Also the guys when saying Guinea would be on the new album as when on how so many songs were going to be about food on the new album. Then amended that to two, Guinea and Porktenderlion. I think Mike then added that Pisco could be considered as food by some in a weird way too. Well, that's all I can remember right now. Please forgive me anything I've forgotten but after driving home to Long Island from Pawling with dropping off Melinda in NYC and Gella in Brooklyn, it's almost 4am now. Though, I will say the drive home tonight though the small roads near Pawling brought up comments in the car that we driving through Blair Witch country and the bits of fog just enhanced the spookiness. All in all it was an incredible show and I can't wait for this weekend but I don't know how any show could top tonight's show. It was really nice to hear such different songs then last weeks show in such a wonderful intimate setting. Night all. Anita "Once in a while you get shown the light, in the strangest of places if you look at it right." The Grateful Dead. ------------------------------ Date: 27 Apr 2000 09:11:01 GMT From: spin0za1@aol.commmm (Spin0za1) Subject: OT: rant: Anti-Arabism & growing up Jewish (written at 4:30 AM, so please be kind) Growing up in Brooklyn, and being a "good little Jewish child" of well educated and usually pretty well off parents, I've attended Hebrew school for most of my life. It was, after all, "the right thing" for me to have a proper Jewish education. I attended a well respected Talmud Torah at a well known Conservative (in the religious, not necessarily political sense) synagogue from kindergarten through 6th grade. The synagogue was not egalitarian. I once let it slip that for their grandchildren's Bar or Bat Mitzvahs my father's parents would give the child a Tallis, the prayer shawl traditionally worn only by men. This led to a need for further explanation that the synagogue I attended weekly for services allowed women to do all the same things as men and further to my blurting out that my rabbi was a woman. My sister and I were generally not trusted in this school. Many of the teachers in this school were Israelis or children of Israelis of eastern European descent. They taught us many things... including the fact that the Torah clearly stated that the land formerly know as Palestine now properly the State of Israel belonged to the Jews by divine right. Therefore, Arabs living there, especially those who protested the Israeli government were evil. One such teacher proudly held up a fist and declared that it was "blood land" and that we had more right to it than the filthy Arabs. This never sat well with me or with my sister. Slowly raising a hand and asking foolish questions like why the Palestinians who had lived their whole lives there should be driven out got us nothing but angry stares from militant Zionists, teachers and classmates alike. Then came the day that Yitzchak Rabin, the Prime minister of Israel, was shot dead at a peace rally. Naturally everyone was certain that an Arab had done it and a cry of outrage rose up from Brooklyn Jews... until reports came in that it had been a Jewish fundamentalist working on the belief that his action was supported by Scripture. The cry of outrage turned to anguish... that it had not been an Arab that had shot their beloved Rabin. An assembly was called that Sunday at the Hebrew school. We were seated in folding chairs and yelled at for an hour by our principal in a thick Israeli accent that Jews should not be killing Jews. The message to me was clear: Jews should be killing Arabs. Or Arabs should be killing Jews Or better yet, Arabs should kill Arabs. With one year left to graduation, one year from being the longest standing member of the choir in the school's history, I might add, I left EMJC Talmud Torah for the Prozdor program at the Jewish Theological Seminary for a somewhat more liberal alternative. Now here's the thing... I read Jian's columns. Okay, this is not about Jian's columns, this is about way more than that... reactions from people when I say that I am Jewish, for one thing. ("Oh you're Jewish? What do you think about the Jewish-Arab thing in Israel? I think the Jews are wrong. ") But I'm rereading one of Jian's articles at the moment and this is just something that really cuts me deep. Jian writes about American stereotyping of Middle Eastern peoples. He writes about the racism especially in Hollywood and the replacement of Russians by Arabs as "The Enemy" in our culture. Yes, Jian. I agree. I agree whole heartedly with all of my soul and it hurts how much I agree. It hurts because I've been in the middle of one of the stickiest anti-Arab-sentiment filled areas in America for most of my life: The not-so-liberal Brooklyn Jewish Community. So what's the problem, I hear you saying. You're not a part of that. You don't share their beliefs and you're the better for it. Here's the problem. I'm still Jewish and I still live in Brooklyn. Even now while I'm pulling away from the Jewish community in ways I'm still not sure I'm comfortable with, I still feel that I am associated with all the negative aspects of this group, and that I will be, no matter what, for the rest of my life. When I read or hear about how Americans harbour racist anti-Arab sentiments I feel like I'm being pointed at. That one. There. Her. The Jewish girl who keeps Kosher and still goes to Hebrew School. She's a RACIST! On the other hand, I remember the inverse feeling growing up: That one. There. Her. The so-called Jewish girl who wears a tallis and has a woman rabbi. She's an ARAB Lover... She's friends with TERRORISTS! Let me say now that most of this has nothing to do with Jian or even with what he wrote. Jian never says anything about Jews being more racist than other Americans and I don't think he would. I'm pretty sure he doesn't believe that, though I've never asked. This is all out of my own messed up head. The problem is that I've grown up so surrounded by such blatant racism of the sort that Jian describes in his the articles he's written that I feel soiled by it. Far from feeling proud of not believing it I feel ashamed for being in any way associated with it. I feel ashamed of my Jewish heritage- even knowing full well that Judaism itself is not the problem. I instinctively get defensive and then feel ashamed for my defensiveness. This rant has gone on too long and I'm not quite sure what my ultimate point is. It is not that Jian is wrong about what he has written, it is more just an expression of what goes through my head and heart as I read it. It's something that I have no clue how to resolve. Probably to just get over it and stop whining. "To believe that knowledge is ignorance is noble. To believe that ignorance is knowledge is evil." - -unknown "You'll have to lose your mind before you can come to your senses!" - -Socrates, Way of the Peaceful Warrior Gella ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 10:44:26 GMT From: vika@attglobal.net (Vika Zafrin) Subject: Re: Pawling review and setlist Spake "Neilbert" : >When's Providence again? :-) *bounce* *bouncebounce* A week and two days! (yay!) - -v - -------- Vika Zafrin -------- vika@attglobal.net -------- http://www.brown.edu/Research/Decameron "Are you done [with your assignment]?" "Yes! We learned how to lie in Italian!" -a conversation I had with one of my students ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 12:15:18 GMT From: tmbgirl@my-deja.com Subject: Re: Pawling Set List replying to a bunch all in one: Neilbert wrote: > So, the opening act was Mike Errico and he was very good... so good, > I bought his disc and listened to it coming back. The man tells a > wonderful story, oh, yeah, he can play too. Check him out. just a side note - he has 2 full length albums, and one EP. I would suggest any and all of them. I'm assuming you got Pictures of the Big Vacation (since it has springtime on it and everyoen is just mad impressed with him after the first song) whcih really is an amazing album but wow, "Bite Size" is just as amazing if not moreso. ScarletB23@aol.com wrote: > Opener: Mike Errico. He was awesome. What a great way to open > the show. Definitely check him out. aw yeah, i'm liking what i'm hearing. Maybe now when he plays gigs in the city with 14 year old "blues prodigy" there will be more than just the dirty old men chillign in the audience *grin* > After Guinea Pig the guys started an improve jam with "Dave, Where ya been" > "Checking the NASDAQ". They then got Mike Errico to join them on stage pulled > away from a waitress who he was trying to get a date from. ugh!! why wasn't i at this show? *sigh* > For the Blues Festival, the question was which performer has > performed at all the FRFFs but for the actual FRFF, Jian made it a little > harder that's harder than the first question? jigga wha?! > by asking a hockey question of who is the center of the Leafs who > just got hurt. Funny, it was answered by the only Canadian in the > audience. uhm, did i already ask why i wasn't at this show?! ugh. > Also Tobey gave a final score of the Knicks/Toronto Raptors gave. The > Raptors who had been ahead all gave lost it in the end to our NY > Knicks. so isn't that like the 2nd or 3rd night in a row that that's happened? I made a big mistake yesterday walking into my class discussing the Raptors/Knicks games... I should have taken a clue when my professor is 6'10" and always talking about playing ball at SHU buuuut how was I supposed to know he had buds on the Knicks?! *grin* > Night all. > Anita excellent review anita! take it easy, JordAN http://www.geocities.com/tmbgirl.geo/ np: getaway people "chocolate" Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 13:01:38 GMT From: Lori Martin Subject: Re: Obscure Fruvous ref! spake the woman in the Leafs jersey: > Drea (who can't believe her first show was almost *6 yrs ago*!) wooohooo! almost two years for me! (Drea, thanks for making me feel like a mere baby. :) ) This meaningless post has been brought to you by: - -- Lori Glitter Fairy/Tattooing Fru ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ http://members.aol.com/srm9988n/index.html ------------------------------ Date: 27 Apr 2000 16:47:42 GMT From: mbschick@aol.com (MBSchick) Subject: Re: Pawling review and setlist >Spiderman... off mic, with the band in the audience. Whilst singing, Mike >notices a (gasp) tape recorder. HE grabs it and decides to stress test the >condenser mic in it... by yelling into it, of course. Actually, he had noticed it a bit earlier, while he was sitting in the audience waiting for the song to start. He picked it up, looked it over, and put it back -- so it wasn't THAT spontaneous when he grabbed it while singing. After the song Mike patted the guy on the back. Also, which you may have missed if you weren't in the back, right before the tape thing there was a girl taking photos kneeling in the aisle (actually from the table whose tape recorder it was). Mike kept on walking over to her and pulling up his shirt, pretending to take his pants off. He was totally right on top of her, and she was falling over. The other guys were cracking up. She kept on taking photos. (After the show I heard her say it was her first Fruvous show live, so I'd say she handled it all pretty well!) >an improv jam which began with "Dave, where ya been?" "Checking the NASDAQ" I think it was Jian-"Dave, where were ya?" Dave-"Checkin' the NASDAQ" Murray-"Nearly gave me a heart attack, Jack" Mike was tuning or something, although he did some sort of British accent thing in there. It was one great show! - -Melissa ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 18:34:44 GMT From: Maggie Deegan Subject: Re: OT: rant: Anti-Arabism & growing up Jewish *huge hugs* sweetie i can't say that i can identify (because honestly i can't) but i can see where you're coming from and all i have to say is that you're in a tough spot. i wanna let you know that you've got me. :) - -- ~Maggie~ "The Hawaiian alphabet has 22 letters, 6 of which are K." ~ Taylor Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 21:18:46 GMT From: FruCake1@aol.com Subject: Jian's hat Does anyone have a picture of Jian wearing the "new" black cowboy hat? If you do, could you send it to me? I would really appreciate it! Thanks! Lisa Bills ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:15:28 -0400 From: MJ Subject: Re: OT: rant: Anti-Arabism & growing up Jewish Spin0za1 wrote: > regarding conflicts between arabs and jews... > Here's the problem. I'm still Jewish and I still live in Brooklyn. Even now while > I'm pulling away from the Jewish community in ways I'm still not sure I'm > comfortable with, I still feel > that I am associated with all the negative aspects of this group, and that I will > be, no matter what, for the rest of my life. When I read or hear about how > Americans harbour racist anti-Arab sentiments I feel like I'm being pointed at. > That one. There. Her. The Jewish girl who keeps Kosher and still goes to Hebrew > School. She's a RACIST! On the other hand, I remember the inverse feeling growing > up: That one. There. Her. The so-called Jewish girl who wears a tallis and has a > woman rabbi. She's an ARAB Lover... She's friends with TERRORISTS! ...I feel > ashamed of my Jewish heritage... Being *really* far from being Jewish, I guess I can't really understand what you're going through- but I can reassure you that not everybody is pointing at people like you for being a "racist" or for being friends with "terrorists"... until a year ago, I had been living in a town with *lots* of Jews (two temples in a borough that is, I think, less than 1 sq. mile big, and with prolly *at least* 10% of the general population having Jewish heritage if not Jewish themselves), and let me tell you, many of them had been to camps where they had been fast friends with Arabs. I also had friends who were Arabs (who, if the average American met them, would probably change their minds about the whole terrorist stereotype). So, spending a third of my life in the environment that I did, I would be the last person to do major, heavy-duty finger pointing. I guess what I'm trying to say is that although I may be the minority, many, many people won't finger point (unless they're really ignorant, which is their loss), that you don't need to be ashamed of your heritage, and that you won't be judged in the long run by your heritage, but more so by your actions. If you feel that what your community is doing is really wrong, gather up a few people who think like you do and try to fix the problem. Sure, it'll be an uphill task (easier said than done, eh?), but organize it correctly, and you may not have a reason to be ashamed so much anymore. It may seem hopeless, but at least it's a start... you *do* have to begin somewhere. And why not at the grassroots level? ~truztno1 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 23:14:03 GMT From: jewelee@my-deja.com Subject: Re: Jian's hat FruCake1@aol.com wrote: > Does anyone have a picture of Jian wearing the "new" black > cowboy hat? If you do, could you send it to me? I would > really appreciate it! um, I know I'm failry new here. And the New Jersey show was my first Moxy Fruvous concert ever but I'd just like to share my two cents about that hat... DOES ANYONE REALLY WANTS TO SEE A PICTURE OF IT? ::shudder:: I'm j/k, Jian is beautiful no matter what he's wearing!!! I'm just not the biggest fan of him in that hat. =) I know I'm not alone on this one, am I? love, jewelee!! Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 17:59:48 -0500 From: Chad Maloney Subject: Re: Sheet Music for "Gotta Get a Message to You" MagicHat85@aol.com wrote: > > Hey all of you Fruheads! > A group of friends and myself are singing "Gotta Get a Message to You" but > acapella like off of Live Noise, for Spring Concert, on May 18. We are > working out parts, but if anyone already has them could u respond to me? The MIDI files on FDC (http://www.fruvous.com/media.html) can be expanded to sheet music somehow. I've never done it before, though, so you'll have to do some research on your own. But the work has been done for you, you just need to download a tool to read it. - Chad ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 01:25:07 GMT From: FruCake1@aol.com Subject: Re: Jian's hat In a message dated 4/27/2000 8:06:24 PM Eastern Daylight Time, jewelee@my-deja.com writes: << DOES ANYONE REALLY WANTS TO SEE A PICTURE OF IT? >> Yes, I do. I would like to put it up on the Ji-Spot's photo gallery. :) Thanks! Lisa Bills ------------------------------ Date: 27 Apr 2000 23:20:27 GMT From: spychicr@aol.compoot (Rai-Marie) Subject: Re: Fredonia Show Update <> Si, en fraçais, n'est-ce pas? Ou est-ce j'ai tort? I'm still learning... someone told me I was a Canadian Poser, and I thought that 'twas quite funny... sounded like a superhero.... --Rai --Canadian Whate'er. ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Rai is also known as the CANADIAN POSER! Fighter for liberty, justice, and the right to use a "u" in the word colour. I like pink. But only if it's a manly pink. A "Butch, the prom queen" pink. ~Gotta love the Lizard ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 21:18:05 -0400 From: Luella Benn Subject: Re: OT: rant: Anti-Arabism & growing up Jewish Hey, Hey... I've been following this thread, and though I don't have anything to really contribute. I do know that there have been questions about whether or not this is the appropriate context. While I agree with whomever said that this is a more than appropriate place, I just thought I would shout out a quick reminder that there is a message board devoted to *exactly* this thing at the ji-spot. = ) - -- luella ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 01:45:09 GMT From: SugarFly26@aol.com Subject: Re: the sheet music thing Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't MusicTime a separate program you have to go buy? Because I read and download free sheet music in Adobe Acrobat, but it has to be in a .pdf which obviously a midi file isn't...I'm confused. What else is new? :) - ---------------> Ln :o) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 02:49:41 GMT From: FruCake1@aol.com Subject: Re: OT: rant: Anti-Arabism & growing up Jewish Oh and one more thing about this discussion being transferred to the Ji-Spot......Jian is waiting to chime in on something over there. ;) Lisa Bee http://www.mypoorgeneration.com The Ji-Spot at http://www.gojian.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 23:03:32 -0400 From: MJ Subject: Re: Sheet Music for "Gotta Get a Message to You" MagicHat85@aol.com wrote: > Hey all of you Fruheads! > A group of friends and myself are singing "Gotta Get a Message to You" but > acapella like off of Live Noise, for Spring Concert, on May 18. We are > working out parts, but if anyone already has them could u respond to me? Uh, I'm probably just adding to the confusion, but NoteWorthy Composer was/is a free download, which, I think *does* transcribe for you... I'd probably take a quick look around at http://www.tucows.com and see if there's any useful share/freeware around. I'm sure time limits wouldn't really matter to you, since you'd have to transcribe it in less than 30 days from now anyways- or, if your a capella group is at an institution (school, college, etc.), ask around- there might be a MusicTime-like program installed somewhere in your music department! ~truztno1 ------------------------------ End of alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V4 #200 ********************************************