From: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org (alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest) To: ammf-digest@smoe.org Subject: alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V4 #199 Reply-To: ammf@fruvous.com Sender: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest Thursday, April 27 2000 Volume 04 : Number 199 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) [MJ ] going to pawling? [tmbgirl@my-deja.com] i *heart* fruheads [tmbgirl@my-deja.com] Re: Welcome to the c Album [drea25@my-deja.com] Re: Welcome to the c Album [Anna! ] Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) [tmbgirl@my-deja.com] Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) [vika@attglobal.net (Vika Zafr] Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) [vika@attglobal.net (Vika Zafr] Re: i *heart* fruheads [sisterpuff@my-deja.com] Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) ["A.J. LoCicero" ] Re: Obscure Fruvous ref! [SugarFly26@aol.com] Re: Obscure Fruvous ref! [drea25@my-deja.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 00:11:29 -0400 From: MJ Subject: Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) sasu@mail.albany.net wrote: > I have to admit my interest was piqued by this > somewhat choppy (and rather quickly dropped) debate on this list. . . I'm not > sure how to delve into my thoughts on Americanism, but I'll give it my best > shot!.... BTW-Someone (i forget who) interrupted a very interesting posting > about Americanism to question if this list is a place to discuss this. I > think that this list is one of the most appropriate places to discuss > politics. Hmm... I think that that "someone" would be me, unless I'm missing a few posts somewhere... anyway, I guess AMMF is an appropriate place given that it is a public forum, as long as OT is stuck in front of your subject header (which I forgot to do as well- oops ). But I've seen some *endless* debates which get pretty nasty here (though not necessarily as bad as those of other NGs, as previously stated), and, not feeling particularly bold, I didn't feel like breaking the peace and harmony around here. Also, as to this topic being dropped so quickly, if someone made an extremely, um, ignorant statement (for lack of a better adjective), I probably would have jumped right back in. But I guess I don't have any reason to, 'cause I completely agree with what Kirsten just said: (<--- that's my head falling off by nodding at every other line or so of her post. ) I'm guessing from the lack of participation that a) I should just shut up *right now* ; c ) , b) people aren't back from their recent east coast frutripping sprees, c) this is a very touchy subject for many, or d) people just aren't interested (which really would be a shame). and then Vika said: Jian said something at the 4/21 show that sticks in my mind. He >quoted Ralph Nader's statistic that the 300 richest people in the world hold >1/3 of the wealth. Yeah, life is probably not too hard for those top 300 >people, but what about those at the bottom? Why are they stuck on the >bottom? To what end? As for people "stuck" on the very bottom... I don't really believe in being really, really "stuck" if you're in this country. It all depends on how much work you're willing to put into making sure you have the skills necessary to become "un-stuck". And I do believe that making sure you [and your family] are not at the very bottom is a 100% viable opportunity given to *everyone* by the U.S. Well, I'm not quite sure whether this is the point that Kirsten is trying to make, but I personally believe that life in the U.S. isn't necessarily all Horatio-Alger-ish-rags-to-riches-stories: I'm pretty sure that although the U.S. is a more conducive environment for such stories to happen than many, many other countries on this planet, it *is* possible to get stuck (at the bottom, though not rock-bottom. Let's just say 'lower class' for now). I can't name an example off the top of my head, but I would think that for every success story out there, there is a story of some ex-con who, no matter how hard he/she tried, without the right guidance, it was just beyond possibility to not go back into a criminal life. Maybe it was drugs; maybe it was a matter of having enough food to eat or not. Maybe it's a story of bureaucratic red tape (which doesn't necessarily apply to ex-cons and the like only) which kept people from succeeding. I know nobody was suggesting that the U.S. is a picture-perfect society, but I guess the point I'm trying to make is that a) you *can* get stuck and b) it's not as easy (or as possible) as it seems to become un-stuck. As someone who's never really been in this position, I can't really vouch that this happens as frequently as I think it does, so if someone can come up with a *wide variety* of figures, please step up and disprove me; I don't want to be passing around misinformation. ~truztno1, who's probably contributed more than the $.10 (US) equivalent in *any* currency to this discussion..... ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 04:24:43 GMT From: tmbgirl@my-deja.com Subject: going to pawling? hey hey kiddies... real quick before i fade into the shadows on the NG for a while - just wanted to remind everyone going to Pawling tonight that they should make sure they arrive very very early to ensure that they don't miss the opener - Mike Errico rocks my world like no other. *grin* take it easy, JordAN http://www.geocities.com/tmbgirl.geo/ yeah, i was hooked with springtime. Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 04:22:23 GMT From: tmbgirl@my-deja.com Subject: i *heart* fruheads hey hey... i just wanted to give a big shout out to you kiddies. After the fruvous weekend last week, I mentioned something about how I probably wouldn't be seeing the lads play for quite some time (that was, of course, two days ago when I thought i'd be able to afford next semester in Italy *sigh* no chance of that now [1]) - i did, however, mention that I may possibly be able to get up to Rhode Island for that gig on May 6th if I could get a ride back to NYC immediately after the show so I could catch a flight to denver (yay) the next morning at 7am. Kind of a bum deal for anyone that actually could do it but lo and behold, two hours later, someone had offered to help me out. Then, today, I got an email from my g-fry, Amy. In this email it says basically that she and the rest of the Virginia fru-gals want to see me at the Birchmere show and to go down and chill at JMU with them for a bit. Amy even went so far as to offer to pay for my greyhound tickets down there and everything. All after some major fiasco's and she just having gotten fired from her job so i know she doens't really have the cash to be pouring out to me. I can't go because of work and finals but the fact that she was just offering to be that generous really touched me (ooh baby). i want to shout out a public thank you to all of ya, i love you guys! :D [1]the good news about my *not* going to Italy is that it means that I'll have a bit of extra cash and may actually find myself in Cali when the lads are there. awww yeeeah! take it easy, JordAN http://www.geocities.com/tmbgirl.geo/ 13 DAYS TILL I CAN GO SNOWBOARDING AGAIN! YEEEHAW!!! THE THINGS YOU MISS WITHOUT THE ROCKY MOUNTAINS!!! np: 2 pac "changes" Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 03:07:19 GMT From: drea25@my-deja.com Subject: Re: Welcome to the c Album > Anyway only about 2 more weeks till a disc with Disco and Pisco! :) It may be more than 2 weeks.. at the Pearl St. show on Saturday Jian referred to the C album as coming out "in late May." Oh well, I wasn't expecting to be able to pick it up until Darien Lake anyway *g* Drea (Pearl St. review coming.. sometime ;>) "You're self employed, your entire life is a writeoff!" - my coworker Richard, 4/17/00 Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 04:34:23 GMT From: Anna! Subject: Re: Welcome to the c Album In article <89sN4.30479$Bs5.139485@news.rdc1.va.home.com>, hugrod@home.com (Hugo Rodrigues) wrote: > Well, not having heard much TMBG in my short stilted life... I was > kind of shocked by the circus-tune style of the welcome. It feels > very, er, cheesy for the quality of song that Moxy has been releasing > lately. Well ... I mean, I think the purpose of the song was to be silly and catchy and cute -- I somehow doubt they were aiming to match the lyrical quality of, say, Thornhill or Wood. :) I guess compared to the new(est) stuff anyone has heard, it's hugely different. But I don't think the difference is any more dramatic then when B came out after Wood. I assume that's the point of the albums, to showcase both sides of their musical coin, so to speak. (Heh - now *that* was cheesy.) Either way, I dig it. I like fun. I'm actually looking more forward to this then I was to Thornhill. - -anna- http://elements.dreamhost.com Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 12:13:05 GMT From: tmbgirl@my-deja.com Subject: Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) In article <39066C70.9D29CAF6@hotmail.com>, MJ wrote: > b) it's not as easy (or as possible) as it seems to become un-stuck. As > someone who's never really been in this position, I can't really vouch that this > happens as frequently as I think it does, so if someone can come up with a *wide > variety* of figures, please step up and disprove me; I don't want to be passing > around misinformation. so i was going to add plenty to this discussion with the last post claiming that just about anyone can make it in the US, but stopped because it got onto this whole rant about being homeless in the US. Without getting too far into it - i'm just going to say this, i may be totally off my rocker, no need to flame me, i'm warning you all now that this is just the way *I* see things, it may be completely naive: When you are a "bum" and have no home... how do you expect to get a job? In the US - you have to have a mailing address to receive a paycheck so already those shit-minimum wage jobs that anyone that is coherent and walks in the door asking for will get - are out. Now don't get me wrong, this is the US and we make things happen - so there are "placement" agencies that will give you a "Mailbox" that you can use. Ok... so you still don't have a place to live, but now you're making money. You can't stay in shelters now because you're making some sort of income and you're better off than all the other people that didn't bother getting your job - so you're out of all those benefits (food, shelter, sometimes clothes, etc.). Who knows, you may be working enough that you have absolutely no chance for welfare/food stamps... so you're worse off now, trying to survive, than if you just sat back and did nothing. I'm not really sure what i was getting at - just that you should step back and realize *JUST* how much it takes to get back on your feet when you're at the bottom. Also, if you ever get a chance... sit down and talk to some of these guys. nine times out of ten they're not the stereotypical "Drunk" A$$holes people like to portray them as and you'll hear some really cool stories. Hey, you might even make a friend. take it easy, JOrdaN http://www.geocities.com/tmbgirl.geo/ np: T-Spoon "sex on the beach" Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 13:16:20 GMT From: vika@attglobal.net (Vika Zafrin) Subject: Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) Spake "A.J. LoCicero" : >It isn't >impossible to rise from the very bottom, but it is uncomfortably *close* >to being so. Oh, no argument here. It's damn close. But to think that there's actually a country on this planet where you can say that, that it's *not impossible* to rise from the very bottom that opportunity (however small) exists, is stupefying and hope-giving. That's a rare case, I'm sure I don't need to tell you. - -v - -------- Vika Zafrin -------- vika@attglobal.net -------- http://www.brown.edu/Research/Decameron "Are you done [with your assignment]?" "Yes! We learned how to lie in Italian!" -a conversation I had with one of my students ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 13:10:22 GMT From: vika@attglobal.net (Vika Zafrin) Subject: Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) Spake tmbgirl@my-deja.com: [in response to my "just about anyone can make it in the U.S." thang] >I'm not really sure what i was getting at - >just that you should step back and realize *JUST* how much it takes to >get back on your feet when you're at the bottom. Jordan, I know that it's not always easy or even possible to get back on one's feet once a person is at the bottom (or rock-bottom, which is really the only scenario I was talking about). MJ made good points on this, as did you. However, not only do I realize JUST how much it takes, I know from personal experience. My parents and I came to the States in 1990 with, I think, $142 for the three of us. That's about as bottom as you get. Granted, we had help of NYANA - the New York Association for New Americans, an organization that's helped many immigrants get on their feet. They helped us pay for the first three months of living in the country, including rent and food (and that's about it). That was just enough time for us to apply for welfare (which we were only on for a year, thank you - I am very much aware how much people take advantage of the system). My point is, we did what had to be done. My father, a kickass engineer with a lifetime of experience, drove a car service cab for the first year and a half. My mom, a microbiologist, until she found a job (and even afterward), cleaned people's houses. I went to work when I was 14, the legal age for working in NY (at least at that time) as a cashier in a supermarket. Not a terrible lot of money, but it helped. My point: is it possible? Yes. I firmly believe in that. It's also hard, and involves a certain (though relatively small, imo) amount of luck. >Also, if you ever get a chance... sit down and talk to some of these >guys. nine times out of ten they're not the stereotypical "Drunk" >A$$holes people like to portray them as and you'll hear some really >cool stories. Hey, you might even make a friend. Now that almost sounds like a personal attack. For the four years I was at Boston University, I regularly (at least a couple times a week) stopped to talk to a bum in Kenmore Square who most often called himself Fred. Yes, I heard cool stories and even saw his "band" - four of them would get together and play cardboard instruments and sing, I kid you not. I also heard (from him) that he had no interest in getting a job or a place to live other than the street curb and the occasional shelter. Whatever floats his boat, man, honestly. But was it *possible* for him to get off the street? Yes, he knew it, he knew exactly how to do it, he just didn't want to. Which is fine with me, as long as he didn't bitch at me - and he didn't. He was/is one of the happier people I've met. - -v - -------- Vika Zafrin -------- vika@attglobal.net -------- http://www.brown.edu/Research/Decameron "Are you done [with your assignment]?" "Yes! We learned how to lie in Italian!" -a conversation I had with one of my students ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:12:40 GMT From: sisterpuff@my-deja.com Subject: Re: i *heart* fruheads > Then, today, I got an email from my g-fry, Amy. I don't know how I feel about being a g-fry...Is that one of the fry- guys from McDonalds (oops...I mean, JcDonalds)? If it is, then it's all good with me. :-) In this email it says > basically that she and the rest of the Virginia fru-gals want to see me > at the Birchmere show and to go down and chill at JMU with them for a > bit. Hells ya! I so wish you could come down! Amy even went so far as to offer to pay for my greyhound tickets > down there and everything. All after some major fiasco's and she just > having gotten fired from her job so i know she doens't really have the > cash to be pouring out to me. Even if I had the job, I still wouldn't have the money, but would offer the trip to you in a heartbeat. I can't go because of work and finals > but the fact that she was just offering to be that generous really > touched me (ooh baby). awww yeah. I know how to work it! :-) i want to shout out a public thank you to all > of ya, i love you guys! :D And here's a public you're welcome! You rock, sisterpuff! Check ya this summer sometime... California maybe? Massachusetts maybe? We'll see... Amy ps I'm sorry that you can't go to Italy. :-( We'll go to an Italian restaurant sometime...or if you come down to Florida, we'll chill in the Italy Pavilion in EPCOT at Disney World. yeehaw! Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 14:30:29 GMT From: "A.J. LoCicero" Subject: Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) Vika Zafrin wrote: > But to think that there's > actually a country on this planet where you can say that, that it's *not > impossible* to rise from the very bottom that opportunity (however > small) exists, is stupefying and hope-giving. That's a rare case, I'm > sure I don't need to tell you. Indeed! (Sorry I know I'm supposed to post more than that, but well, that sums it up!) A. - -- _____ _ / ____(_) | | _ ___ ___ _ __ ___ | | | |/ __/ _ \ '__/ _ \ | |____| | (_| __/ | | (_) | ICQ: 13117113 \_____|_|\___\___|_| \___/ @wwnet.com AIM / AOL: locicero ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 16:30:04 GMT From: tmbgirl@my-deja.com Subject: Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) In article <3906e6c0.133801898@news3.attglobal.net>, vika@attglobal.net wrote: > Now that almost sounds like a personal attack. nonono!!! that was just me going off saying that you often find great people in very strange places. *grin* sorry if it came off sounding otherwise! take it easy, JordAN http://www.geocities.com/tmbgirl.geo/ np: Iggy Pop "passenger" Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 19:24:04 GMT From: sisterpuff@my-deja.com Subject: Re: OT: Americanism: my $0.02 (US or CDN?) ok, my turn! my turn! sorry...i was reading through all of this saying, "yeah! well said!" ...ok, so it was to myself because i'm in the computer lab and the people sitting around me would look at me as if i was a weirdo if i really said it out loud... ok, anyway... so, to MJ's comment about the "red tape" that is hard to get through for some people to get back on their feet... I'm kinda experiencing the same thing here. On April 10 I was forced to resign my position as RA because I partied too much on my birthday. Ok, so it might have been a wrong decision, but that's not the issue at hand. I moved off campus to live with a couple of friends in their apartment for the remaining three weeks of the semester...rent free because I have no money. So, here i am living in the apartment with my meal plan still in tact. I leave for NJ/NY/MA on my last few cents. I had a blast and came home to an email saying that my meal plan is canceled. So, I'm in VA with absolutely no food or money to pay for food with two weeks remaining. On top of that, I applied for a volunteer position for the beginning of the fall semester, working for freshman orientation. Well, I didn't get the position. EVERYONE got the job. The simple reason why I didn't get the position? Because of the politics surrounding my leaving. An organization that I have worked for for over three years has taken away my food and has basically black listed me in everything on the campus. I cannot get a job here at school. Don't you love administration schmucks? I could call my parents and ask them for money, but they have none. Absolutely no money. so, i'm stuck. i've decided to fast until these people give me some money (don't worry...it'll be on friday or tuesday at the latest)...a refund for moving off campus and canceling my contract... So, that's my part to add to the discussion.... amy Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 21:33:06 GMT From: neil@nospam.flipse.com (Neil Bardhan) Subject: Re: Fredonia Show Update On 26 Apr 2000 04:48:17 GMT, dgodwin01@aol.com (DGodwin01) wrote: >According to the Fredonia Web Site, This is the schedule for the show friday. >4:45 DJ Ripple >5:00 Moxy Fruvous >6:15 DJ POOT >6:30 moe. Wow, Moxy Früvous and moe. in the same show. So these DJs... one is named after a Grateful Dead song (well, probably not) and the other - -- a creature in one of those weeeird "sci-fi" novels we all read in like 4th grade? (My Teacher Is An Alien series, I think!) Bizarre. Neil Neil Bardhan: neil@flipse.com | PGP user http://demon.ceh.servtech.com | Scrawny Ferret "You sure do eat a lot, for a little guy."--Doc Loomis If you need to, remove NOSPAM from my address. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 00:03:17 GMT From: krgzfg@email.com Subject: Get PAID to place free ads! 2992 An Actual Job that you CAN Work From Home!!$$ Thank you for your interest in Adplacing, an actual job that you can work at your leisure from home! This is a legitimate offer to contract with us from home by simply typing and placing classified ads. We are CJ Holdings, an International Marketing Firm who design and implement advertising campaigns for our many clients. NO Selling! Just type and place our clients ads that we provide on the FREE Internet Sites that we give you or place the ads in print. You are paid PER RESPONSE-no one has to buy anything from the ads-just reply! You have to see this! http://www.adplacing.com/member/pt643 ysfdeqwueyfgxvouqqjv ------------------------------ Date: 27 Apr 2000 01:36:56 GMT From: spychicr@aol.compoot (Rai-Marie) Subject: Re: Fredonia Show Update Neil hath spaken: <> Poot is a character in the My Teacher is an Alien Series. And I REALLY want to see this guy just 'cause of that... where is this show again? --Rai "Poot" Marie --Poot. ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ Rai is also known as the CANADIAN POSER! Fighter for liberty, justice, and the right to use a "u" in the word colour. I like pink. But only if it's a manly pink. A "Butch, the prom queen" pink. ~Gotta love the Lizard ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 22:11:52 -0400 From: MJ Subject: Re: Fredonia Show Update Neil Bardhan wrote: > >According to the Fredonia Web Site, This is the schedule for the show friday. > >5:00 Moxy Fruvous > >6:15 DJ POOT > >6:30 moe. > > Wow, Moxy Früvous and moe. in the same show. Hmmm... what kind of band is moe. anyways? I've heard someone in one of my classes talk about them, and he sorta described them as "country-ish", but not quite... ~truztno1 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 02:48:37 GMT From: SugarFly26@aol.com Subject: Re: Obscure Fruvous ref! No one else found part of that wicked familiar? As in on the Bargainville liner? I know I'm really tired and all, but I swear it's in there. At least the yogurt and monk and board game parts. - ------------> Ln, going to bed:) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Apr 2000 03:30:07 GMT From: drea25@my-deja.com Subject: Re: Obscure Fruvous ref! > No one else found part of that wicked familiar? As in on the > > Bargainville liner? I know I'm really tired and all, but I swear it's > in there. At least the yogurt and monk and board game parts. I can't remember whether it's on the liner (been a while since I listened to my Bargainville cassette), but I do know it's on the original definition t-shirts from '94. I have one :) Drea (who can't believe her first show was almost *6 yrs ago*!) "What doesn't kill you will make you stronger I'm not dead yet so I must be stronger..." - The Nields Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Before you buy. ------------------------------ End of alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V4 #199 ********************************************