From: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org (alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest) To: ammf-digest@smoe.org Subject: alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V3 #736 Reply-To: ammf@fruvous.com Sender: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest Monday, August 23 1999 Volume 03 : Number 736 Today's Subjects: ----------------- [FAQ] alt.music.moxy-fruvous FAQ (2/4) [Keeper of the FAQ ] Re: OT: DC area navigation [Groovy Spice ] Canadian Release... [true north records ] Re: OT: chad alleges Trace and Lori get lost easily [Veronica J Gruneberg] A.J.'s Thornhill Impressions ["A.J. LoCicero" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 13:15:53 -0500 From: Keeper of the FAQ Subject: [FAQ] alt.music.moxy-fruvous FAQ (2/4) [Part 2/4] Section: Basic Moxy Fruvous Information 1) Who is Moxy Fruvous? "Coming from Canada," a Toronto-based quartet of singer-songwriters who double as political satirists, comedians, social commentators, etc. The band includes Mike Ford (guitar, harmonica, bongos, keyboard, occasional drum kit and vocals), Murray Foster (bass, occasional drum kit, percussion, occasional guitar, and vocals), Jian Ghomeshi (drums, percussion, occasional guitar, and vocals), and Dave Matheson (guitar, accordion, banjo, keyboards, and vocals). They've been playing together as a group since about 1990 and are known for their experimentation, dabbling in genres from barbershop quartet to grunge, retro rock to rap, ballads to Saturday morning cartoons. See http://www.fruvous.com/band.html for the Fruvous Dot Com band bios. 2) What does "Moxy Fruvous" mean? Mike: Many, many people come up to us after shows and ask us "where'd you get your name?" Jian: Or sometimes, or more usually, it's "where'd you get your stupid name." What does "Moxy Fruvous" mean? Nothing. Nada. Zilch. Anything you want it to. "What is the sound of one hand clapping?" It's a couple of nonsense words, two great tastes that taste great together, a happy coincidence, a fun sound, and to fans' everlasting delight, some gibberish that lends itself imminently to wordplay. If you ask Fruvous what their name means, you're likely to get a strange look (or several) or a cryptic reply. 3) What is a Fruhead? How can I become a Fruhead? Fruvous is aware of and frequently acknowledges their follow-band status. Some fans of the band consider themselves "Fruheads" (which is a derivation of word Deadhead used to describe specific fans of the band the Grateful Dead who followed them around, creating a whole new social atmosphere around Dead shows in addition to the actual show itself). At its most basic, a Fruhead is usually a fan of the band who goes a bit beyond what normally comes with being a fan. Many Fruheads not only attend shows in their town, but travel to nearby or even faraway towns to see shows or attend multiple shows in a row on a tour. They support the band, buying albums and other merchandise, and usually recommend the band vehemently to their friends. The band likes to describe the Fruheads as the people who "get" their music and what they are doing and support it. Many times, the word Fruhead is used interchangeably with fan, though to some, "Fruhead" has more connotations than just a fan. There is no ritual, rite of passage, or letter of recommendation needed to become a Fruhead. Despite the description given for the six-stamp mark on the old Fruhead card, there is no prerequisite number of shows you need to attend before becoming a Fruhead. You simply need to consider yourself a member of the Fruhead community and be willing to accept that label upon yourself, knowing full well it means a boatload of things to different people. People who do not travel, but see each and every show in their city and support the band by buying albums are just as important as the crazy who drives to who-knows-where to see a show. The status of Fruhead does not raise someone into the inner circle of Frudom. If you consider yourself a Fruhead, congratulations. You are. 4) What is the "Fruhead Card?" In the Fruvous Quill #9 (their mailing list fan club newsletter, also on file on FDC at http://www.fruvous.com/quill.html ), they instituted the Fruhead Card, a means of keeping track of the number of shows a fan has attended. It ran through December 1997 and was stamped and dated at the merchandise table at each show. After 3 stamps, the fan received a pin; at 6, a t-shirt signed by Fruvous (not available for purchase); at 12, a compilation of their videos (including "King of Spain," "My Baby Loves a Bunch of Authors," "Stuck in the Nineties," "Fell in Love," "Down From Above," "Fly," and "Get in the Car"); at 18, a song composed, recorded, and mailed to them by the band; at 24, an all-expense-paid bowling trip with Fruvous; at 30, a dinner-and-dancing date with Dave; at 36, dinner and dancing with Mike, Jian, or Murray; and at 50, theoretically, a Fruvous ass-brand administered by the band. None of the songs have yet reached the fans - about forty obtained 18 stamps (though several people have been told that their songs are completed). About 20 people reached the 24 stamp mark and many of them went on a bowling trip with Fruvous during the weekend of the First Annual Fruhead Convention (FruCon) held in Toronto in February 1998. The dinner dates haven't yet materialized and seem to be in rain check mode (no figures available on how many people reached each of those marks). Two people, though, reached the fifty-stamp mark; Dan "the Shadow" Jablonski respectfully declined the fleshly acknowledgment of his accomplishment, but the other, Chris O'Malley, received a tattoo of the budgie dog (paid for by Fruvous), on camera (and broadcast on Canadian television), right where it was stipulated. 5) What is the "Frumiles Card?" The Frumiles Card is the current reincarnation of the original Fruhead Card. It began in Fruvous Quill #12 and every subscriber to the Quill received a card. The system of rewards is similar, but one must accumulate Frumiles and "spend" them, instead of simply receiving the prize after X number of shows. The prizes this time are a Fruvous key fob for 300 miles, pin for 500, racing cap for 1000, campfire songbook for 1500, mint condition indie cassette for 2500, and bowling with the band and "treats" for 3000. Note that these theoretical miles have nothing to do with actual miles, and driving from Vancouver to a Boston show will likely net you one stamp on your card, worth 100 miles. A picture of the front of the Frumiles Card is available at http://www.fruvous.com/miscpics/milefron.jpg 6) My Frumiles Card expires at the "end of the millennium." Is that December 31st, 1999, or 2000? While Quill #12 states that "Stamps will be awarded for the duration of this millenium", the front of the Frumiles card clearly states 98/99 and members of the band and crew have said that the Frumiles Card ends its run at the end of 1999. 7) Where is the band currently touring? Tour information is included in each issue of the Fruvous Quill. Simply sign up on the band's mailing list and you will get the Quill twice a year. To get on the mailing list, check at the merch table at a show or email Jude at moxy@passport.ca and ask to be placed on the mailing list. If you are on the mailing, the band will occasional send postcards to certain areas or all over to announce a stint of dates, usually as an addendum to the latest Quill. Fruvous Dot Com is also kept up to date with the latest tour info including additions and changes since the Quill went out. It also has venue information and links to venue web sites. The FDC Tour Page is found by following the Tour Dates link on the main page http://www.fruvous.com. The final say in tour date information comes from Jude Coombe, who holds down Moxy Fruvous Headquarters in Toronto ON. To get clarification on tour dates beyond what is listed on FDC, contact Jude at moxy@passport.ca or call her using the phone number listed on FDC in the Contacting Fruvous section at http://www.fruvous.com/contact.html. Fruvous has played in England, Scotland, and Denmark in the past, and recently have been touring more in Western Canada and the Western United States than in the past. Tour dates are a lot more compact in the areas around Toronto ON and in the Midwest and Northeast United States. 8) Why has the band toured more in the United States than in Canada lately? [Maintainer's Note: This question is a really an opinion question. I personally wasn't there when all this happened, though I have talked with some people about it. Colleen was not there either. Both our takes come from secondhand (or more) observations and shouldn't be taken as gospel. I left Colleen's answer in as well as adding my own to this so you can see both our sides] This is a tough question really. As of late, there has still been a bias towards the US, even though there have been tours including Western Canada for the first time in years. Jack Ross, the band's manager, said that with the release of _Thornhill_, he thought that the Canadian music industry may again be ready for Moxy Fruvous and the touring schedule would reflect that thought for the _Thornhill_ tour. The bottom line is that touring is how the band makes money, and with the media reversal post-_Bargainville_ in Canada, the United States brought in crowds and the money it takes to keep them on the road. With the grassroots success they were seeing, they also found a growing fanbase that was very dedicated, in addition to some already dedicated Canadian fans. With _Thornhill_, it seems the band has branched out to a much larger area. Where they used to play 2 or 3 (and sometimes 4) times in some of their favorite cities, they now cover more area. They have toured in 98 and 99 in Western Canada and down the West Coast including dates in Colorado. [Colleen Campbell's answer in the original FAQ] Whooboy. Touchy question, but one that deserves at least an attempt at an answer on a FAQ, as it's been a frequently-asked-and-endlessly-discussed question on the newsgroup. Thus, a caveat: the writer of this FAQ, like the people reading it, is a person with an opinion which is informed by the facts she has gathered (definitely not all the facts on the matter which exist) and which does not necessarily represent the only answer or even the correct answer, if there is one. If you find this answer demeaning, offensive, or incorrect, please remember that it is not intended to be so and may not address your personal experience or beliefs in the matter. Given that, then: Fruvous is a band which had what Murray has called "meteoric" popularity in Canada with their indie tape and _Bargainville_: the former went gold and the latter went platinum. They covered Canada thoroughly on their "Bargainville" tour, but barely dipped into their southern neighbor, even in 1994, when the album was released in the States. Their following at the time, though, wasn't one known for longevity of interest or loyalty, consisting at least in part of "teenyboppers" who were more attracted to Fruvous' novelty work. Songs like "King of Spain" received a lot more attention than songs like "Fell in Love" did. In the States, though, there was little media attention to or radio play from _Bargainville_, so when the album was heard, it was probably taken more as a whole, novelty and serious songs both. When _Wood_ came out, the media machine didn't go into play as it had before in Canada, nor was audience response the same: the album hit only #35, Fruvous was playing to much smaller crowds, and there was little notice of it by critics, as there had been for _Bargainville_. In short, Fruvous probably felt like Canadian audiences had rejected it. In the States, although the album wasn't released, the songs from it were received as "another side of Fruvous" during concerts: audiences tended to have fewer expectations about Fruvous' "novelty" work than in Canada. So Fruvous built up a stronger base of support while touring to promote _Wood_ in America. Canadian media and audiences don't seem to be as aware that Fruvous is a group of evolution and experimentation, that they are not just "the band who went platinum back in '94"; meanwhile, in the States, the response to and coverage of Fruvous has been increasing since then. And America is a relatively new and fertile ground to till, for them: a place where they're still forging a name for themselves and can attract a new following, which is important for a band of their stature to do. They have been well-received at even the largest folk festivals in America, selling out of albums at both Falcon Ridge Folk Festival and Philly Folk Festival. This is not to say that they aren't appreciated in Canada (Dave reports that both nations are "duly impressed" with the latest album), or that this trend of fewer concerts there will continue indefinitely: just that Fruvous seems to be responding to their increasing popularity in the States by "giving the people what they ask for." 9) Why does the band frequently play at restricted venues that don't allow underage people in? They do not play age-restricted venues because the band hates all underage fans. That's simply not true. Moxy Fruvous, in addition to being an incredible band and 4 wonderful people, is a business and the livelihood of those 4 members (and other people who work with the band). They need to make money and they do mainly by playing a lot of gigs across this continent. They, like many bands, have a booking agent that gets them gigs, so that in addition to writing wonderful music and thinking up silly characters, the band doesn't have to worry about calling clubs, arranging contracts, and making sure they are getting paid what they should. Many times, due to the economy of the live music industry, the place to play in a given town on a given night is a bar. And, due to local, state or provincial, or national laws, there are just some rules that need to be obeyed. Age restriction is a big one. If this is still worrying you, or you want information about the above, go read Appendix A right now. It's a detailed account from a different perspective of why age-restricted shows happen. All that said, what can you, the underage fan, do about it? Please do your research. Find some other venues in your area that regularly play all-ages shows and get that information to the band (most likely through Jude - moxy@passport.ca - at MFHQ). She will get that info to the right people and it may work. It also may not. Just please keep in mind that when there is an age-restricted show, it isn't to spite you in particular or underage fans in general. It's usually because the club wants it that way and in order to play the club, the band abides by their rules. If you haven't read Appendix A yet, go do it. 10) There seems to be frequent mention of taping at Fruvous shows and trading of those tapes. What's the band's policy on that? Well, obviously, the newsgroup respects Fruvous's right to their own music and performances, and fans would not tape against their wishes. Those interested should first look around at a show. If there are any other tapers there setting up, strike a conversation and get to know them and what rules they abide by. If no one is visibly taping there, asking Cal Stanutz (the front of house sound engineer) or Dave Tobey (the road manager) is often easier than locating one of Fruvous before a show. The band currently allows and appreciates taping for non-commercial use on a personal level. The best way to get into taping Fruvous is to talk to other tapers at a show. Many of them know the band's position on things and may have tips and tricks on levels, show length, and board feeds. Most Fruvous tapers are very friendly beasts that would love someone to talk to about their myriad of gear. In dissemination of taped live shows, Fruvous prefers one-on-one trades. No profit is to be made of the privilege of taping their shows. Personal trading encourages a bit of accountability and it is recommended that you have purchased all the commercially available albums before getting into tape trading. There have been two Moxy Fruvous tape trees in the past. The first, disseminating a show from the Iron Horse in Northampton, August of 1995, was run by John Greene. The second, taped in New York City in December of 1996, was run by Jason Reiser. Both shows are widely available; ask for them, and you'll likely get a friendly Fruhead to tape one for you. There are, of course, many other live shows available, and many people are eager to trade or acquire them, so keep your eyes open and feel free to ask if you're looking for a particular show for your own, personal, use. FHDC ( http://www.fruhead.com ) has a section set up for finding tape traders. Please don't offer to pay someone (in money, extra tapes, or anything else) in return for copies of Fruvous live shows. This hurts the band and threatens the privilege tapers have to tape the shows. Fruvous allows taping for personal use only, and no one should be profiting off the tapes made with their permission. 11) Is there any connection between Moxy Fruvous and the soft drink Moxie? Nope. In fact, the guys have made derogatory remarks about the drink. Don't expect any cross-over advertising campaigns any time soon. Nor is there any connection between the 70's group Moxie, the 90's group Moxy, or the group Mox. 12) I ordered my merchandise four weeks ago from Fruvous and I haven't received it yet. What gives? Welcome to the world of shipping. Most ordering services stipulate that you'll receive your order within six to eight weeks, and Fruvous is no different. It'll take up to a week to receive your order, a few more weeks to get it processed and shipped back, and then a week or two more to receive your package. When customs is involved, other delays are likely as well. If you're concerned, though, that your merchandise seems to be taking an abnormally long time, you'd do well to contact Jude at MFHQ and ask her yourself. She's very busy, so if you need a quick reply, a call to (416) 368-5599 will probably yield better results than attempting to resolve the situation via email. 13) What's the best thing I can do to help support the band? The absolute best thing you can do to help support the band is to tell all your friends about them. If you feel that Moxy Fruvous is the best thing since sliced bread, tell your friends. Sit them down and ask them to take a listen to a song you think they'll like. Take them to a live show and let Fruvous do the selling for you. You can do the normal fan things. Go to Fruvous shows (and don't forget to invite friends). Buy Fruvous albums for yourself. You can also do the abnormal fan things that many Fruvous fans and Fruheads do. Drive to see that show in the next town over. Drive to see that show in the next Province over. Arrange your work flights so that you have a convenient stop-over in a city where Fruvous is playing that night. Please request Moxy Fruvous at your favorite (and least favorite) radio stations. If you are familiar with radio formats, AAA stations would probably be best. Call them up and request your favorite song or the current single off the newest album. If they give you the line about not having the album, email Jude ( moxy@passport.ca ) and give her the information about the station you called. She can make sure that a promo copy of some Fruvous stuff has been sent or will be sent there. Make the radio stations know that people out there want to hear Moxy Fruvous. When you go into a record store, check for Fruvous albums. Some people even go so far as to helpfully rearrange the albums so that the more important bands (i.e. Moxy Fruvous) are up front. We here at the FAQ don't condone this behavior, but do what you like! If you don't see any Moxy Fruvous CDs there at the store, ask them to order some for you. It'll give them an idea that people want to buy Fruvous albums. If you already own the disc, just tell them you found it at their competitor's store already in stock and bought it there, but thank them for ordering it for you and reassure them you'll check there next for other Moxy Fruvous albums now that they've gotten their act together. Also, you can forward record store info to Jude ( moxy@passport.ca ) and she can get that info to the record label so they can use that information to get the album well distributed. Each person's work in helping and supporting the band is important. Moxy Fruvous was built upon grassroots efforts and friendly word of mouth and that comes from you. Keep up the good work! Section: Mike, Murray, Jian, and Dave 1) On stage, who is who? In standard position, the lads on stage are (from left to right): Murray, Jian, Mike, Dave. Murray wears the stylish shirts and usually is found playing the bass. Jian is the self-proclaimed (and born that way) "brown guy" with black curls usually behind the stand-up drum kit. Dave is the bald one with the accordion, banjo, or guitar. Finally, Mike is the crazy Kirk Cameron looking guy usually found with a guitar. From their standard positions on stage, stage left (or left when you are standing on stage looking at the audience) has been deemed "Stage Dave" while stage right has been called "Stage Murray." People standing towards the middle can be "Stage Jian" and "Stage Mike." 2) Why is Jian's name written as Jean in liner notes and older articles? "Jian Ghomeshi" is the original spelling of his name. When his family moved to Canada in his youth, his mother changed it to "Jean," perhaps because it seemed easier to pronounce that way; but it's always been, officially, "Jian" (including on his driver's license), his friends have always known him as "Jian," and he's been spelling it "Jian" across the board for a good while now. 3) How do you pronounce Jian Ghomeshi? Jian's heritage is Persian (Iranian). It's not possible to exactly reproduce the phonetic sound of his name in English letters, but "ZHEE-on" comes closest (where that ZH is kinda like the Z sound from Zsa Zsa Gabor). Ghomeshi is pronounced like it's spelled - "GO-mesh-ee." 4) Is Dave gay? bisexual? How about Murray? Jian? Mike? The matters of the band members' personal lives are NOT something for this FAQ to discuss. The band, being open-minded individuals, do bring up homosexuality occasionally on stage, usually through jokes with the intent of unsettling members of the audience that aren't so comfortable with it. The other members of Moxy Fruvous frequently tease Dave onstage about proclivities other than strictly heterosexual. "Lee," from _You Will Go to the Moon_, is sung by Dave and can be interpreted to be voiced by a gay man to a lover dying of AIDS. Dave is usually nodded at by Mike during the word "gays" from the line "paranoid minorities, and gays" from "Greatest Man in America." Jian frequently dons a bright orange shirt proclaiming "I dig your boyfriend" for shows; he also alters lyrics, such as saying "I was looking straight" instead of "straight ahead" in "My Baby Loves a Bunch of Authors." But the bottom line here is that it is none of your business. If you feel it is your business, take it up with the band members themselves and see what they have to say. It is inappropriate for the newsgroup to discuss such things. [Part 2/4] ------------------------------ Date: 23 Aug 1999 19:47:39 GMT From: krazy924@aol.com (Kristin) Subject: I flipped out.. Yesterday I was cleaning my room and organizing my cds and things on my desk (which I haven't done for years it seems). Anyways, I like to have all my cds in alphabetical order and I was looking at my Fruvous section (it has its own spot, no abc order for them:) and I noticed that Thornhill was awall. I looked around me, couldn't find. Looked on my bed, in my dresser, in my closet, couldn't find it. By then I was almost hyperventilating (sp?), I screamed to my mom asking her if she borrowed it (she likes to sneak into my room and "borrow" my cds), she said she didn't. I was on the verge of tears (ok, I almost was) when sat down in my comfy chair, which was a little harder than usual.. I stood up, and what was there under my blanket? Thornhill.. >shakehead< all that worry for nothing! - -Kristin "Gordon is our destiny. Gordon is the light. All hail Gordon! Actually it was a typo we wanted the album to be a tribute to Charles Grodin." - BNL "Support Search and Rescue: Get Lost." - Anonymous ------------------------------ Date: 23 Aug 1999 19:53:55 GMT From: limezinger@aol.commmmmmmm (my friend goo) Subject: Re: GEH on WBER :) >Just thought I would share the moment that made my entire day :) > >I was driving around Rochester, thinking to myself that I hadn't heard >Moxy in a while on WBER, and all of a sudden, a strangely familiar song >started to play. I turned it up, and lo and behold, in was Green Eggs >and Ham, from the indie tape. I couldn't believe it! So, after the song >was over, the dj starts talking about the origin of the song, and how >people were asking where they could get it. He mentioned all of the >albums. It was quite cool :) LOL! i was driving around as well, and some psychic power made me eject the sloan tape i was listening to, and i caught the end of some song (i think it was the chachacha one, yes?) and suddenly GE&H started up... i was having such a bad day up until then, but the song just totally cheered me up. aww. :) sarah linnellgirl@tmbg.org http://members.aol.com/limezinger "i never said i was a smoothie!" - conan o'brien ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 19:34:15 GMT From: Groovy Spice Subject: Re: a new fruvous radio station??? In article <19990823133330.23723.00002295@ng-cn1.aol.com>, srm9988n@aol.comicrelief (Lori at fruhead dot com) wrote: > Way to go, Genna! Sounds like you'll be getting Früvous onto your > local airwaves, and with any luck, if one station in the SUNY system > starts playing them the rest will follow suit. Kudos! speaking of which, how about some DC people get off their butts and start calling WRNR more? ;) the last time i called to request something off thornhill, jay peterson said, "oh, you must be my moxy fruvous fan." i said, "i'm not the ONLY one, y'know," and he said, "yes, you are, you're the only one that calls me to ask for moxy fruvous." this must be rectified. show that smartass that i'm right. 410-269-1031. peace, ellen (this means YOU, chad) *************************************************** Airborne with nothing to land on... Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 19:29:58 GMT From: Groovy Spice Subject: Re: OT: DC area navigation In article <7ps0mf$dmv$1@knot.queensu.ca>, Veronica J Gruneberg <6vjg@qlink.queensu.ca> wrote: > But it only didn't help when I got to Baltimore. I swear, taking the > 695 West into DC and the 695 West out again > is the most backwards thing I have *ever* heard!! :) > Then I make them drive me back to the B-W Pkwy, 'cause there is no > *way* I'm finding it on my own! (Although, improvement, I can now find > it from 295!) ummmm... where to start. taking 695 into DC would require bending some laws of physics, since 695 circles baltimore, not DC. ;) and 295 *is* the b-w parkway, so i'm glad you can find it from there. ;) hee. seriously, DC makes no sense, this much i will agree with. baltimore, OTOH, is easy to find your way around. and as for taking beltways, just remember they're circles, so which way to go on them depends on a LOT where you're starting from. peace, ellen (what i hate is places where "north" splits and you have to choose "south" or "west" when you really want to go east.) *************************************************** Airborne with nothing to land on... Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 16:20:42 -0400 From: true north records Subject: Canadian Release... Just a quick note to remind everyone that tomorrow, August 24, Thornhill is available at all major Canadian retail outlets! Also, here's a tip, dial in to Toronto's radio station Mix 99.9 for their Morning Show this Wednesday, August 25, at 8:30 am eastern time. Thanks, Doug F. ------------------------------ Date: 23 Aug 1999 20:27:22 GMT From: Veronica J Gruneberg <6vjg@qlink.queensu.ca> Subject: Re: OT: chad alleges Trace and Lori get lost easily See, this is how little this damned city makes sense!! :) Toronto has a few roads that come into it in a nice east-west north-south type direction in a straight line!! In fact, Southern Ontario is more or less one giant grid! According to my map and the signs, these highways are different things! Grrr... And yes, I know 695 goes around Baltimore - I should have said coming *towards* DC, rather than coming into it. But Baltimore seems to be the beginning and the end of all my directional problems! ;) NY, PA - no problem. It's Baltimore that confuses me. And the sad part? I'm seriously considering another trip in the very near future! But not until *after* my friend has driven up here! :) :) Veronica - -- *************************************************************************** "Never look at the trombones, | Veronica Gruneberg it only encourages them." | Dept. of Biology - Richard Strauss | Queen's University | Kingston, Ontario ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 20:13:14 GMT From: "A.J. LoCicero" Subject: A.J.'s Thornhill Impressions Ok, I've listened to the CD a few times now (in the car. A headphone listening is needed and yet to come. I've also read a lot of what various people have said already about the new album. Warning: what follows is highly subjective. General impressions: Hmmm. I have to agree with whoever said the album was like wood. I am reacting to it much like I did to wood. It is taking me time to appreciate it. (It took me months to actually learn to love wood.) My experience with wood is actually very helpful to me in terms of understanding this album, because with wood I learned that there is no "direction that Fruvous is moving" There is just stuff that they do, and then other stuff that they do, and doing one kind of stuff does not preclude them doing other types of stuff in the future. Having said that I will admit that neither wood nor Thornhill are my favorite fruvous albums. Frankly Bargainville is STILL my favorite fruvous album. I'm don't think musical maturity is the highest form of art. I can't exactly tell you what it is that I'm into--it is some kind of weird energy thing or something--but frankly for me, Bargainville is still their best showcase because it has so much inside it. Thornhill is certainly a concept album. Wood was too. Both albums had a theme. (Frankly, I don't think I am particularly enamored of concept albums--fruvous's or any others--Sgt. Pepper would be my LEAST favorite Beatles album). This is particularly true of Fruvous. I think one of my favorite things about them is their eclecticism, and while Thornhill certainly represents eclecticism on the album level, I really like it better on the track level (a la Bargainville and YWGTTM). I am sure this is blasphemy to some people, but frankly I've always thought that good as wood is, it is missing some variation in mood that it needs. I feel like Johnny Sausep'n is some kind of lost wood track that really should be there to complete the balance. For me that would not destroy the mood, it would add another dimension. Why is he talking so much about wood you may wonder? I'm wondering too. I guess it is kind of a disclaimer so that you have some idea where I'm coming from. OK, now Thornhill: (really) I like the album. I like some of it a lot. I have a feeling I'm going to like it even more with more listens because there are A LOT of complex layers in there. The fact that it is a more straight ahead pop style than they've done before (and not entirely--it is STILL fruvous pop) doesn't bother me at all. I'm confident that subsequent albums will go in other directions. (Personally if they want to do another concept album, I'd love to hear ALL a capella, maybe with a jazz bent!). Thornhill IS less eclectic than I would like, and I think a bit too wedded to the Beatleseque sound. I feel like even songs that previously did not sound like the Beatles to me, now sound like the Beatles. There's that concept again. Ah well. Lets go song by song: Half as Much I liked this song from the first or second time I ever heard it. I really like the way that it is presented here with the guitar distortion sounds in the background and all. I think the tempo is a bit slow on the album, but that is something that happens in a lot of studio recording. The musicians don't feel like they have to go go go as they do on stage, but sometimes they drop under optimal tempo. I think that happened in this case. (as it did with It's Too Cold on wood. The album version of that drives Lis and I crazy now that we are used to the way they play it live.) (Of course most of you have never heard it live, but that is another issue.) :) IMHO Half as Much should have been the first single. There are too many stations that are NEVER gonna play IWHO, and the stations that will would not play most of the other stuff that fruvous does. Plus anyone who buys this or any frualbum for IWHO may be disappointed because that is not what most of their stuff is like. I guess what I'm saying here is that if we are looking for the Fruvous "One Week" I think it would be Half far more than IWHO. Sad Girl Wow does this sound like a Beatles song now or what? I've always been kind of neutral on this song. By neutral I guess I mean that I like it, but it isn't one that I think about very much. It is just a nice Fruvous song without any special meaning for me. As I listen to the studio version of it though I'm struck by how good it sounds. I think they've created a wonderful total sound package for it. You Can't Be Too Careful I LOVE this song. Always have. It is so clever in its double-entendre. And I can truly relate to the message. (ahem). As for the album version. This song DIDN'T sound beatlesque to me before, (Maybe Monkeesque but that is a different story), but but now it totally does. I'm not sure how I feel about that but it does sound awfully good. My only criticism: same as in Half as Much--Too slow. It yearns to go faster. I think this song would also be an excellent choice for a single. I Will Hold On I've said this before: I miss the old backing vocals. In fact I put them in in my head while I'm listening. However, I think the message of the song is much clearer without them. I guess I just can't decide which is ultimately better. I wonder if the band had similar angst in deciding to cut them. I guess I approve of the way they've done the song here, but I think I'd like to hear the full backing maybe in a year or two as a live variant. (Yeah, dream on A.J.). As I said before I think it is a horrible mistake to make this the first single. It it too soft for a lot of stations, and I think it it just too damn straight (not sexually but in terms of quirkiness) to truly represent Fruvous. I think it is probably impossible for a single song to ever represent a band like Fruvous. Canadian fans from '93 wanted to have KOS represent the band, and that was totally unsuccessful too, but I just think that if you are even going to TRY and introduce someone to Fruvous with only one song it needs to be a song like 1/2, YCBTC, or Splatter Splatter that captures at least a little bit of the clever side. (Ok,Ok, "breath if that won't make you blue" Granted, but it is only in the lyrics. It needs to be in the MUSIC as well. I can't really explain. I hope some of you have some idea what I'm trying to say. Earthquakes!!! I totally fell in love with this song in Windsor. The banjo version that is. On Thornhill, again it has been beatleized. I wasn't sure if I liked the result the first time I played the disc, but now I am. This version is different from the Windsor version, but it is also fabulous. I hope the banjo version survives in the live shows though because it was great in its own right. (N.B. Just read the Kate's review of the radio show. I guess it has!!!) :) This song just WORKS for me on sooooo many levels! BTW, as I'm writing this I'm playing Thornhill on the computer CD player. This is the first time I've heard it out of car. WOW. A lot more of the layers are jumping out at me. I just love the intricacy of it. When She Talks I understand Michaela called this song Beach Boysesque. As a teenage Beach Boys fanatic I can confirm this. It sounds to me a lot like the later Beach Boys which were more musically and thematically complex than their early work, but which had IMHO lost the vital spark that made the early stuff so compelling. (Sounds like a slam doesn't it?) Well yes and no. I think it is a pretty good sounding song, and the recording is very nice. The band obviously has a fondness for this song, and so do a sizable minority of Fruheads. I think maybe i just don't fully "get it." I have stated before that WST is not (by a long shot) my favorite Thornhill song. Ok I'll even say it is my least favorite Thornhill song. (Like others I've even skipped it on occasion). For me it just lacks something. Some spark, something. That being said it still can rise to a wonderful level. While I find the version on Thornhill "Ok but not trancendant" the version they did the other night at Milestones was. When they started into the song I intended to provide only polite applause when they finished, but at the end I found myself spontaneously clapping and cheering. Go figure. I guess I don't know what I think. Splatter Splatter Ok, this is the REAL song that I think should be the single. Radio Friendly for almost ANY station. This is my favorite song on the album. I loved it from the first time I heard an MP3 of it. (MP3s are a good thing! I'd never heard it in concert until fairly recently.) I hope they do this one on Conan. Independence Day Dark, brooding, discordant... Murray! I don't necessarily "like" this song (does one "like" discord?), but it is a great song nevertheless. ~\o Genivieve I do believe I can't go on this way ~\o I often can't get that line out of my head. Wonderful. Downsizing. I have a tape with an early performance of this. It wasn't too impressive, but I know better than to judge by that. (Anyone ever heard the truly awful embryonic version of Fly they did on the radio in (I think) Columbus?) Once I get past the fact that the beginning of this song sounds way too much like "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds" (and even more like the Rutles parody thereof "Cheese and Onions") this is really an amazing groove of a song. Like Mary Lane, it is ok on the album but doesn't really reach its potential. Live at Milestones it was effing incredible. Hate Letter This kind of music is not my cup of tea stylistically, but listening to it, it is very very cool. It is going to take a bunch of listens through headphones for me to get even a partial sense of the totality of it. If Only You Knew I agree that this song is perfect. I know some people think they could have done more with it, but I'm glad they didn't. The song is still essentially the same as the first times that Mike sang it. It doesn't need anything. Poifect just the way it is. And for the record, I love the fiddle in G line too! I don't know exactly what it is, but this song just pushes ALL the right buttons for me. My Poor Generation This is another great song. Clever, sad, true. My first thought on hearing the album version: What's with the funky percussion? I mean it doesn't ruin the song, but I don't think it really is needed either. The song is powerful enough on its own. Bonus Track I think there really really should have been one. This album is awfully short by current standards as it is, and I think anything this conceptual and heavy needs something to "take the piss" (as the English say) at the end. If they wanted to save Pisco, I can understand that, but still I think something is needed here to do what Organ Grinder does on wood. The ancient greeks understood this need which is why they structured their theatre in cycles with a satyr play to break up the weight of the tragedies. The same considerations hold true here IMO. On the other hand, I know the band is familiar with these concepts, and I know that they thought long and hard about everything to do with this album, so obviously they didn't think a bonus track was needed or desirable and well, it is THEIR album. - -- Mariaweb last updated 5/13/99. See Maria Louise in all her... erm... Glory? Visit MariaWeb at http://members.aol.com/marilou99/ _____ _ / ____(_) | | _ ___ ___ _ __ ___ | | | |/ __/ _ \ '__/ _ \ | |____| | (_| __/ | | (_) | \_____|_|\___\___|_| \___/ @wwnet.com ICQ#: 13117113 ------------------------------ End of alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V3 #736 ********************************************