From: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org (alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest) To: ammf-digest@smoe.org Subject: alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V3 #53 Reply-To: ammf@fruvous.com Sender: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest Tuesday, January 19 1999 Volume 03 : Number 053 Today's Subjects: ----------------- The Princess Bride (was: Jewel Kilcher) ["KatieWow" ] dan-bern-digest Digest V99 #17 [dan-bern-list@eskimo.com] Re: The Non-Con Gang [shazalinrea@juno.com (Mindy J Munson)] Flamingo Defamation [Srm9988n@aol.com] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 23:21:39 -0500 From: "KatieWow" Subject: The Princess Bride (was: Jewel Kilcher) Need I even ask if any of you are "Princess Bride" fans? It's my all-time, hands-down, knock-out favorite movie. "Life is pain, highness--anyone who tells you differently is selling something." ~~Kate, the girl who wrote away for the omitted reunion scene and was sent an 11-page document explaining why she couldn't have it - -- **************************************************************************** Kate Leahy kleahy@loyola.edu **************************************************************************** nothing good ever comes without a fight gotta kick at the darkness 'til it bleeds daylight - --bruce cockburn, "lovers in a dangerous time" and so the problem remained; lots of the people were mean, and most of them were miserable, even the ones with digital watches. - --douglas adams, "hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy" we're splitting into two camps--mike, i'm with you. - --jian ghomeshi, bottom line, 1/1 *************************************************************************** petit_chou@juno.com wrote in message <19990118.200538.-3750103.1.petit_chou@juno.com>... >From the mouth of Fruchild: >>Like I said...FIRST album. Its my nostalgia album... Last one I heard >>before being torn from my homeland. > >"I've got my maple syrup, everything but you.." C'mon, Fruchild, you >gotta admit there's some silliness in those lyrics that Jewel is >blissfully unaware of. : ) Now, I'm not saying that you're Satan for >liking her or anything (hell, I'm a Spice Fan for crying out loud!), just >that I got no lovin for her. Hey now. Taste is the spice of life (it >all leads back to SPICE -- muhahahahaha). > >>Again, nostalgia. > >Nostalgia can do weird things. Why the hell else would I love >"Semi-Charmed Life"? I got your back on this one girl. Situations can >make you like utter drivel. > >>> "I'm writing/ this letter to tell you/ I >>>don't love you anymore./ I don't miss you./ I never have." Rubbish. >>>Putrescence. >> >>Whats that from? > >The quote from her poem[1] or the other bit[2]? > >>You mistake my saying I like her music for saying it is poetry. > >Nah, I'm just saying that her poetry is crap as an example for her >silliness. > >>That was never said, but never the less, I will listen to it and enjoy >it >>along with my moxy and tori and Dar and Phish and so on... > >Good good good. If you gave her up because of what I said, I'm sure I'd >feel some remorse (not a lot, mind you, but some). As that amazing band >Pulp once said: "Please understand. We don't want no trouble. We just >want the right to be different. That's all." > >Heather Moore > >[1] -- quoted from an article in Entertainment Weekly #467 (15 January >1999) written by Jeff Gordinier on pp 23-24 that said: "Jewel feels that >I haven't delved properly into one of her poems. The verse in question - >a selection from last year's best-selling book A Night Without Armor, now >in its 20th printing - goes like this: 'I'm writing/ this letter to tell >you/ I don't love you anymore./ I don't miss you./ I never have.'...'To >me that poem is very transparent,' Jewel counters. 'I'm writing to tell >you I don't love you anymore always means OUCH I'M HURT. I put a lot of >layers in my writing. If you look at it on the first level, you won't >get very far into it. But if you look for the unspoken, there's always a >lot more to the poem A lot of people don't do that.' Whoa." [Heather's >note: this cracks me the hell up every single time I read it.] > >[2] Perhaps you are referring to my (sloppy) homage to The Princess Bride >by William Goldman. In Chapter 6 "The Festivities," an old hag >approaches Buttercup in a dream. She is screeching, "Ask her how she got >through the Fire Swamp? Ask her if she did it alone? She threw love >away to be the Queen of Grime, the Queen of Muck - I am old and life >means nothing to me, so I am the only person in all this crowd to dare to >tell truth, and truth says bow to the Queen of Feculence if you want to, >but not I. Cheer the Queen of Slime and Ordure if you want to, but not >I. Rave over the beauty of the Queen of Cesspools, but not I. Not I!" >The passage is found of pg 206 of the 25th Anniversary Hardbound Edition, >and on pp. 184-185 of the earlier paperback editions (like my 1987 >edition). Perhaps you remember in the movie how the woman advanced >screaming, (forgive me, this is from memory) "The Queen of Slime! The >Queen of Muck! The Queen of Puuuu-trescence! Boo! Boooooo!" This, of >course, is just a guess as to why my little comment triggered something >in your head, but that's why I wrote it. Aren't foot notes a wonderful >thing? >___________________________________________________________________ >You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. >Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html >or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 04:10:26 GMT From: dan-bern-list@eskimo.com Subject: dan-bern-digest Digest V99 #17 dan-bern-digest Digest Volume 99 : Issue 17 Today's Topics: Re: DB Moxy Fruvous sucks! DB Luther, who do you think you are? Re: DB Moxy Fruvous sucks! Re: DB Moxy Fruvous sucks! DB The "Marilyn" collection Re: DB Moxy Fruvous sucks! Re: DB Luther, who do you think you are? Re: DB dan and jill DB C'mon Dan, get it on! Re: DB Moxy Fruvous sucks! Re: DB Luther, who do you think you are? Re: DB Moxy Fruvous sucks! Re: DB Moxy Fruvous sucks! Luther wrote: >I've just popped in a tape of Dan Bern's 31 December 1998 early show >at the Bottom Line, and I'm waiting for Dan to come on, but before he >does, I'm suffering through this awful Moxy Fruvous set. Ugh. People on >this list *like* these guys? Why? I won't say much, because I think Chad already said what needed to be said. But let me just say again that just because you don't like the fifty or so minutes you hear on a concert tape doesn't mean a band "sucks." A week ago, after seeing the 12/31 show, one person essentially said the same thing about Dan on the Fruvous list, and Dan was similarly defended there. It is just as easy for people who don't know Dan to dismiss him after a few songs on a tape, or even in seeing him in concert, as just some guy who can only play in one key and uses shock value and foul language in place of decent writing or originality. Just as it is easy to say why do American male folk singers like Dan have to try to copy the Dylan schtick. We who have listened to Dan enough know these things aren't true, well its the same for those of us who listen to Fruvous. Fruvous is different than Dan, and some people who like Dan a lot are also going to love Fruvous, like Chad, me, and a numebr of other people I know of who are big listeners of both. There are also going to be Dan listeners who don't like Fruvous, and Frvuous listeners who don't see anything in Dan's music. That is only natural. It neither means Dan nor Fruvous "sucks." I think Fruvous is extremely talented in both their songwritring and their musicianship. Even some of the people that I heard from who saw the shows and didn't like Fruvous so much, agreed that they were very talented. That they have chosen to take a more "fun" approach to their shows than Dan, doesn't make them less talented. A good Fruvous show is great fun and is an interactive and energizing expereince. If that is not what you are looking for in music, you won't appreciate Fruvous. Not to pick on Billy Bragg, because I like him too, Luther, but it is easy for someone to listen to a few of his songs and find him dour and boring. I think any time a band does things in their own unique way, as both Dan and Fruvous do, there are going to be people who don't like them. In my tape trading activity, I have run into many people who have seen my Dan collection and said "why??" because he doesn't mesh with what they want to listen too. Chris Chandler is another example, some of ushere think he is great, others here hate him. But at least they are generally worth having an opinion about. Personally, Dan and Fruvous are the two artists I listen to the most, and I think they go togeather naturally because there are a lot of similarities, but depending on my mood, I'll pick one over the other on a given day. - - Harry K p.s. I will also say that while I wasn't there and haven't heard it yet, I have been told that the early show on 12/31 was the weakest Fruvous show that many Frufans can remember. An unfortuante first impression for Dan listeners. ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] One. <> Would you post some of that? Two. <> Yeah, Luther, shame on you for having an opinion! How dare you have a bad first impression of a band that other people in the world like! And I can't BELIEVE you have the AUDACITY to use the word SUCKS! What are you trying to do, generate DISCUSSION or something? What an asshole! Next time you hear a band that doesn't catch your fancy, before you go telling us what you think, please purchase all of their CDs, take all of the music you like out of your stereo, and listen to these new ones over and over again until you have something nice to say. I mean, the NERVE of some people. k On Mon, 18 Jan 1999, Harry A Keates wrote: > A week ago, after seeing the 12/31 show, one person essentially said > the same thing about Dan on the Fruvous list. Um...you know what? If that was their only exposure to Dan, they were justified in concluding that Dan sucks. His set was very weak that night. The versions of "Thanksgiving Day Parade" and "I Need You" sounded damn good, but everything else was pretty bad. "Lightning Jazz" in particular (my favorite new song) sounded like crap. So there. Was this the night Dan was sick? > Fruvous is different than Dan, and some people who like Dan a lot are > also going to love Fruvous, like Chad, me, and a number of other people > I know of who are big listeners of both. There are also going to be Dan > listeners who don't like Fruvous, and Frvuous listeners who don't see > anything in Dan's music. Sure, if you like "good clean fun" (read: cheesy barbershop quartet music) and a "happy" vibe that makes you think you're back in the 1970s watching an Osmonds concert, you'll like Moxy Fruvous. Luther Luther, Since so many people seem to think that you need to give Moxy Fruvous another try, I have their LIVE NOISE cd which I'd GLADLY send to you if you'd take it off my hands. *grin* Pam Chris O is THE MAN! http://hillstrom.iww.org/danbern/marilyn.txt Luther Gaylord wrote: > > On Mon, 18 Jan 1999, Harry A Keates wrote: > > > A week ago, after seeing the 12/31 show, one person essentially said > > the same thing about Dan on the Fruvous list. > > Um...you know what? If that was their only exposure to Dan, they were > justified in concluding that Dan sucks. His set was very weak that night. > The versions of "Thanksgiving Day Parade" and "I Need You" sounded damn > good, but everything else was pretty bad. "Lightning Jazz" in particular > (my favorite new song) sounded like crap. So there. Wow. Personally I thought Dan's opening set was really good. Maybe it was just contrasted with Fruvous's bad set. But Dan's tune selection was really good and the audience enjoyed him it seemed. I dunno. But if someone decided from 50 minutes of Dan that he sucks, their opinion wouldn't weigh much with me unless the personal saying it was someone I really truly respected. And then still, I dunno. > Was this the night Dan was sick? You know. I didn't even know Dan was sick any of the nights. He did a good job on all 6 shows to me. Some were definitely better than others, but he was much more even than Fruvous over all. Fruvous had higher high points, but also lower low points in my opinion. > > Fruvous is different than Dan, and some people who like Dan a lot are > > also going to love Fruvous, like Chad, me, and a number of other people > > I know of who are big listeners of both. There are also going to be Dan > > listeners who don't like Fruvous, and Frvuous listeners who don't see > > anything in Dan's music. > > Sure, if you like "good clean fun" (read: cheesy barbershop quartet music) > and a "happy" vibe that makes you think you're back in the 1970s watching > an Osmonds concert, you'll like Moxy Fruvous. Let's apply common logic to Luther's statement here. So, liking "good clean fun" and a "happy" vibe means you will like Fruvous. Luther, I assume you know enough people who like "good clean fun" and a "happy" vibe that like Moxy Fruvous to make that statement. And note it says nothing about people who like Moxy Fruvous having to also like "good clean fun" and a "happy" vibe. Oh, if only I could venn diagram in email. Anyways, I still recommend checking music out (through seeing a live show or through mp3's or through buying a used disc or whatever) before you decide something sucks so much you don't want any part of it. And when you do decide something sucks so much, have an intelligent reason so you start some good open-minded conversation. - Chad "Rich, K. M. (Kevin)" wrote: > < essentially said the same thing about Dan on the Fruvous list, and Dan > was similarly defended there. >> > > Would you post some of that? If people are interested in hearing what the Fruvous newsgroup said about Dan, use DejaNews to read the archives. They are all public and you can read anything that anyone said. Goto http://www.dejanews.com. Use the Power Search and put Dan Bern in the search field and alt.music.moxy-fruvous in the forum field. I think you'll find a lot of people that came away impressed with Dan and wanting more. I know some people who were Fruvous fans that went to Nightengale's shows to hear more Dan. I don't feel comfortable reposting stuff that I didn't write without permission (like I asked when I reposted the Dan Bern description from Colleen before) but if someone else wants to post stuff I don't care. It's all publicly available on DejaNews. > < fifty or so minutes you hear on a concert tape doesn't mean a band > "sucks." >> > > Yeah, Luther, shame on you for having an opinion! How dare you have a bad > first impression of a band that other people in the world like! And I can't > BELIEVE you have the AUDACITY to use the word SUCKS! What are you trying to > do, generate DISCUSSION or something? What an asshole! But generating discussion requires intelligent remarks to respond to, doesn't it? > Next time you hear a band that doesn't catch your fancy, before you go > telling us what you think, please purchase all of their CDs, take all of the > music you like out of your stereo, and listen to these new ones over and > over again until you have something nice to say. Or if you could, phrase it such that you are stating your opinion, state what you like/dislike about something and ask people what they think. It'll save you much money and make you look like a nice reasonable person who wants to start a discussion about something instead of some guy who is trolling for flames... - Chad hey Tim- I think dan mentioned that although he was aware of our boycott, he might play with Jill in early Feb :-) keep checking back for details. yes i think the boycott is lifted, we shall find other ways to protest not sure if jill is playing with band or if merle will be paid...maybe they will do the song they wrote together about pete rose ! see ya there, mike - ---timn wrote: > > >> Dan & Jill. > >> Possibly coming soon to a (one time) boycotted club near you. > > > i read on the idiots delight digest that bern/sobule is among the scheduled > shows upcoming at the bottom line... > > wonder iffin jill will play "good person inside" and dedicate it to dan... > > is the boycott being lifted for these shows? anyone catch when it's > taking place? > will jill have a band or will she be solo? will merle get paid? > > tim (who'll be probably be going to the bottom line for this show but > staying away from the overpriced beer) > > _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com Last night I saw Rufus Wainwright on Sessions At West 54th on PBS. Though I couldn't understand a word he said/sang I felt that this program (hosted by ex-head David Bryne) would be the perfect vehicle for our man Dan. So what's up Dan? Take the plunge damn it and get on this program or Letterman or something! jeesch. Frustrating that somthing so good is heard by so few! JK http://www.sessionsatwest54th.com On Mon, 18 Jan 1999, Chad Maloney wrote: > And when you do decide something sucks so much, have an intelligent > reason so you start some good open-minded conversation. It seems to me, Chad, that even without an "intelligent reason" (in your estimation) I've started a good conversation on the list. This is the first time I've ever seen you post, for example, and Harry Keates seldom comments publicly. So, at the very least, I've drawn some people out of lurkdom. Right? Venn diagram this, buddy! Luther On Mon, 18 Jan 1999, Chad Maloney wrote: > Or if you could, phrase it such that you are stating your opinion, state > what you like/dislike about something and ask people what they think. > It'll save you much money and make you look like a nice reasonable > person who wants to start a discussion about something instead of some > guy who is trolling for flames... Golly, Chad, thanks for the unsolicited advice...er...sage pointers on how to properly post to a mailing list. Silly me, I've been bumbling along in the dark all these years, not knowing how to generate discussion or make a convincing argument. Thanks to you, I now know how to participate effectively in fora like this! *gives Chad a big wet smooch on the lips* Luther Harry, very nicely put....well done!. Harry (one who does like Chris Chandler) Harry A Keates wrote: > Luther wrote: > >I've just popped in a tape of Dan Bern's 31 December 1998 early show > >at the Bottom Line, and I'm waiting for Dan to come on, but before he > >does, I'm suffering through this awful Moxy Fruvous set. Ugh. People > on > >this list *like* these guys? Why? > > I won't say much, because I think Chad already said what needed to be > said. But let me just say again that just because you don't like the > fifty or so minutes you hear on a concert tape doesn't mean a band > "sucks." A week ago, after seeing the 12/31 show, one person > essentially said the same thing about Dan on the Fruvous list, and Dan > was similarly defended there. It is just as easy for people who don't > know Dan to dismiss him after a few songs on a tape, or even in seeing > him in concert, as just some guy who can only play in one key and uses > shock value and foul language in place of decent writing or originality. > Just as it is easy to say why do American male folk singers like Dan have <<< Continued to next message >>> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 04:58:40 GMT From: shazalinrea@juno.com (Mindy J Munson) Subject: Re: The Non-Con Gang ummm... LARPing...soooo goood. do you do a fae LARp by any chance? Fruchild, the "lusty Satyr, Arura Jade" >Sounds great but Ican't!! I'm not going because I was already >committed to a weekend long Live Action Role Playing game (I gave >them >my money and everything!). It won't be too bad, I get to be Puff The >Magic Dragon! > > ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 05:02:35 GMT From: Srm9988n@aol.com Subject: Flamingo Defamation chad ups the ante here: >Can I help it if 'You could whip up french and goblet pleated >pelmets in your sleep while the rest of us are trying to figure >out what the hell that is and living with bare mini-blinds.' Hey, I *said* I didn't know what the hell that is either. geez. >Hmmmmm? ooh, can we hum in harmony here? >> I'm working on that passport right now, my friend. >Just remember to smile for the camera. 'kay. :> >I sort of grimaced, since I got the picture taken two days into >my sentance of not washing my hair for two weeks. You see, I >cracked my head into a key safe mounted on a wall at work, and >put a small gash in my head. Besides, now my passport >pic will make it look like I'm too ill to travel. ummm, thanks for sharing? >And, that brings us to Frürelated-ness, because of the upcoming >FrüCon and it being in Canada and all that. who needs a passport to go to Canada? All I need is a car and some ID. (resident visas work like a charm, but unfortunately mine's expired ... :( ) >one looks like crap because I had a migrane that morning and >the bright light didn't help any.) yuck. Just put your head in a vise and spin round on a tilt-a-whirl. gotta love *that* feeling. >> -- Lori (who admits to having been called princess by her beloved >> poppop, but that's as royal as she ever got.) >Well, until you took that quiz, right? hey, YOU administered it buddy. And you never told me your score, either. :> - -- Princess Lori ------------------------------ End of alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V3 #53 *******************************************