From: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org (alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest) To: ammf-digest@smoe.org Subject: alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V2 #85 Reply-To: ammf@fruvous.com Sender: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-ammf-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest Friday, December 4 1998 Volume 02 : Number 085 Today's Subjects: ----------------- RE: Stand and be counted [katrin@dimensional.com (Katrin Luessenheide Sal] Re: Nature Sounds of NGs [McCown ] Distribution of wealth in US ["MOLLIE M DRISCOLL" ] Re: Herbivore or Carnivore? [Eve Lauria ] herbivore or carnivore? [Srm9988n@aol.com] Re: Herbivore or Carnivore? [katrin@dimensional.com (Katrin Luessenheide ] Re: Herbivore or Carnivore [Eve Lauria ] Why be vegan? ["MOLLIE M DRISCOLL" ] Re: nye in toronto [drea1@my-dejanews.com] wishing to be older [jacey7@aol.com (Jacey7)] Moxy Morals [shazalinrea@juno.com (Mindy J Munson)] Re: To Herb or not to Herb? tehe=+) [jacey7@aol.com (Jacey7)] RE: Nature Sounds of NGs [shazalinrea@juno.com (Mindy J Munson)] Re: wishing to be older [shazalinrea@juno.com (Mindy J Munson)] Re: To Herb or not to Herb? tehe=+) [lesystemed@aol.com (LeSystemeD)] Re: [Re: Herbivore or Carnivore?] [lesystemed@aol.com (LeSystemeD)] Re: Herbivore or Carnivore? [Chad Schrock ] Re: Nature Sounds of NGs [Thomas Fazzio ] Re: Herbivore or Carnivore? [Nate DeRose ] Re: Herbivore or Carnivore? [Chad Schrock ] Re: Distribution of wealth in US ["Scott Hand" ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 17:07:53 -0700 From: katrin@dimensional.com (Katrin Luessenheide Salyers) Subject: RE: Stand and be counted In article <19981204002241.04749.00002010@ng-fd2.aol.com>, bodaceah@aol.com says... > I am not able to quote the statistics off the top of my head, however, i am > quite sure there are more muslims in the world than christians. I read somewhere (maybe it was a question in some trivia game?) that Christianity was the religion with the most followers worldwide. I can't quote any statistics either, though. k@ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 23:56:49 GMT From: McCown Subject: Re: Nature Sounds of NGs Monique said: > Guys, > Call me paranoid. Call me touchy. Call me at 555- > FRULOVE. But are my posts being read? Are they being placed up in the > newsgroup anywhere? Is it the nature of newsgroups to reply > selectively? Because I posted like mad sometime (Monday, I think), and > no one remarked on them. Is that how this works? I'm awfully > confuzzed. Please give me some signal that you > read this, because I really want to be part of the little Frufamily > you've all started but I don't know if I'm being heard. I'm sorry Monique. I felt that way when I first joined, too (this was only in September). No one would reply to anything that I'd write and I'd be like "ohmigod they all hate me" or "I must have said something really dumb because I think I just ended that entire thread." But I don't *think* that's what was going on. Chad's right, it takes a bit of getting used to, but rest assured that everyone here is *very* nice. We're not ignoring you on purpose. It takes ages, as you probably know, to read all of the posts that accumulate in even one day, so I'm sure people miss a few things that have been written. If there was something you really wanted a response to, I doubt (correct me if I'm wrong, I don't want to be speaking for everybody) anyone would mind if you brought it up again saying you were hoping for input. love Lizzie ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 00:19:10 GMT From: "MOLLIE M DRISCOLL" Subject: Distribution of wealth in US >Bodaceah wrote: > >> >> Here in the United States 10% 0f the population holds 90% of the wealth. > >It's that steep? I'd believe the figure if it's worldwide, or within >the states if it were more like 20% holding 80%; where do these figures >come from? > >Josh Drury >Winnipeg That's the figure I've heard, from multiple sources, some being sociology professors. (And from what I read, it's getting steeper.) Mollie ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 00:34:07 GMT From: Eve Lauria Subject: Re: Herbivore or Carnivore? Monique inquired: > So why, then, do vegans refuse to drink milk? Milk isn't a precursor > to a calf, and besides, it's actually better for a cow to be milked > than to leave it all in there. Just curious. Well, the main reason I always heard to be vegan is that consuming animal products results from the often brutal enslavement of animals. That is sensationalist language I know, but sadly enough it is also often true. There are several reasons not to drink milk. 1) Milk production requires the yearly birth of a calf, which half the time is male and will probably be killed for veal. 2) Humans are the only animals that drink milk past infancy and drink milk of another species...many people feel this is not natural. 3) Milk is specially formulated to be the perfect food for baby calves (or goats or sheep or whatever) and as such is not necessarily compatible with the human system. Really, if we feed our children milk, we should be eating the same food adult cows eat. 4) Most people are lactose intolerant to some degree and I hear that simply going off dairy can alleviate many health problems including digestive troubles and asthma. 5) Cows are fed hay and grains which are full of chemicals, which they excrete into their milk. Wow...I think I'm going to go vegan again! Eve ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 00:09:52 GMT From: Srm9988n@aol.com Subject: herbivore or carnivore? Heather Moore, our resident ACLU poster child, said: BK is the only chain that'll take money off for omitting >the meat, and the sandwich turns into a tasty and semi-healthy meal! No >joke. Good stuff). Oooh! Thanks for that tip -- I never even thought to ask! >And pizza gets kind of boring (from regular, not >gourmet, pizza places - you know...cheese olives peppers and tomatoes. >Every time). But it's the life I chose. Aahh, geez, I can feel your pain. :) My favorite pizza place in the universe is two blocks away, and not only are they UN-greasy, they also have great toppings. Mushrooms! Spinach! (a divine combo) Artichokes! veggie combo supreme! And they're not "gourmet" either, so my wallet doesn't mind the occasionally quick-n-easy, sure-to-please-the-whole-fam chowdown. - -- Lori, definitely considering dinner now ******************************* "And when I go to sleep at night I hear someone else's song, sung by some Canadians and thousands sing along. And everyone is dancing but I don't know the words, mystery and chimera and a million flying birds" -- the Nields "When I am dreaming, I don't know if I'm truly asleep or if I'm awake And when I get up, I don't know if I'm truly awake, or if I'm still dreaming." - -- Forest for the Trees Visit Lori's strange and wonderful world! http://members.aol.com/srm9988n/index.html ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 17:37:53 -0700 From: katrin@dimensional.com (Katrin Luessenheide Salyers) Subject: Re: Herbivore or Carnivore? One more omnivorous voice coming forward amongst all the veggies...I eat meat. I like it, and it makes me feel healthy. I would never push my own eating preferences on anyone else. I tried being vegetarian for about a month and a half a few years back, and it just didn't agree with me at all. I craved meat the whole time (I actually dreamed about steak many nights!) - and it didn't help that my company was also working on a promotion for the Beef Council. I ended up eating lots of cheese and dairy products, which had a VERY bad effect on my health (that's a whole other long story). I gained weight and just generally felt depressed, sluggish and crummy. What finally ended my veggie experiment was that my company's softball team was in a tournament. The softball field was in back of a barbecue restaurant, which of course catered the event. There wasn't much there to eat besides meat, and it just looked and smelled so good, I decided to break down and have some. Immediately I felt better than I had in weeks. And my team won the tournament. Recently I've been on and off a high-protein, low-carb diet, and it seems to work very well for me. I do lose weight when I manage to stick to the diet, but more importantly I feel healthier when I eat mostly meat and vegetables (and I love vegetables too!) and cut out sugar and starch. If I can manage to stay away from dairy, I do even better. Please don't bother replying if you only want to criticize this diet; I know it has its detractors, and it's certainly not for everyone. This is just what seems to work best for me. k@ Off to thaw out that steak for dinner now ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 00:39:25 GMT From: Eve Lauria Subject: Re: Herbivore or Carnivore Lizzie informed us: > Frucontent (yay, there is some): I didn't know Jian was a vegetarian > intil the KofP show. At soundcheck he was talking about eating a turkey > sandwich (my thoughts: "oh no!") but then he corrected himself and said: > "Tofu turkey!" (my thoughts: "hooray!"). And then I heard the whole > perch story... Jian's a vegetarian!!!!? You have no idea how happy this makes me. And Lori wondered: (So if anyone could explain to me why on this new, improved, healthier diet I've *gained* approximately twenty pounds, I'm listening!) Dairy is very high in fat, especially cheese. Often when people stop eating meat they try to compensate by eating more cheese and other dairy products. I believe cheese has more fat than meat. Of course, there are many factors that might have to do with weight gain...maybe you were too skinny before. Maybe you changed some habits or something. I never lost weight just going off meat...I have when I was completely vegan, though. Eve ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 00:48:00 GMT From: "MOLLIE M DRISCOLL" Subject: Why be vegan? >> Some vegans don't believe that we should eat eggs because they are the >> precursors to chicks which are animals, and that they are not meant >for >> human food. Some vegans will eat eggs if they are free-run (I guess >these >> aren't vegans-vegetarians then, or conscientious eaters if you like) >> because hens in egg-production plants are treated very badly. > >So why, then, do vegans refuse to drink milk? Milk isn't a precursor >to a calf, and besides, it's actually better for a cow to be milked >than to leave it all in there. Just curious. >~Monique/Small Lady People choose vegan diets for a variety of reasons. Some do for health reasons. Cholesterol, for example, is only found in animal products, so vegans have effectively cut all cholesterol out of their diets. Another reason is that some say that taking milk from the cow is not fair to the cow. Who asked the cow if it was okay to take its milk? What kind of life does that leave for the cow? Others do it in protest of the treatment of the animals farmed for their milk or eggs. These animals are often treated badly, being kept in small, dirty quarters. Some folks choose not to give money to support this. Also, the ability to easily digest milk and milk products is not universal among humans. Folks of northern European heritage tend to be most able to digest it, with lactose intolerance being almost universal in some areas of the world such as Asia. I think that's why folks tend to eat yogurt in the Middle East and India--because yogurt is more digestible to the human gut than plain milk. Zainab Sorry for the lack of Frucontent. I'll add some here-- Moxy Fruvous rocks my sox off! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 01:46:57 GMT From: drea1@my-dejanews.com Subject: Re: nye in toronto of course, now that i've said that, somone will pipe up and > tell me there already is one :) go on, someone embarass me! *grin* Yes there is a page already *g* It's at www.angelfire.com/pq/TONYE/index.html. All the info you're looking for is there - where, when, how much and who's coming :) Should be a fun time, hope you'll be there! Drea "Everyone's a novelist, and everyone can sing...but no one talks when the tv's on..." - -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ------------------------------ Date: 5 Dec 1998 01:56:42 GMT From: jacey7@aol.com (Jacey7) Subject: wishing to be older kay, I have to comment on this thread: >>>Old Age: Cheese-n-rice, I *wish* I was older! If I were only 10 years older, I'd be 29<<< >>BINGO!!!!! I am SO with you on this one. In fact, I couldn't have said it better myself<< >i could not agree with you more.< I used to say stuff like that all the time-- everything from "I wish it were Friday!" to "I wish the school year were over and it was warmer," to the old standard "I wish I was old enough to drive" "I wish I was old enough to drink" and on and on and on... (I'm old enough for both now, btw ;-) I was in the middle of one of those frustrated "I wish"s one day, when my mom just turned, looked at me and said: Don't wish your life away. I've always carried that with me. I don't "wish this week were just over" or that "Christmas would just hurry up and get here" or any of that anymore. Because you only get one life, and I refuse to wish mine away. Just a little mental food for ya. ~jen (who will now return to her regularly-scheduled sarcastic nature ;-) *~~~"Measure your life in love"~~~* ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 02:34:24 GMT From: shazalinrea@juno.com (Mindy J Munson) Subject: Moxy Morals On Fri, 4 Dec 1998 18:20:38 -0500 "Scott Hand" writes: >I say go for it, but don't get caught. > > >Scott Tehe. Never. Im a stealthy midget =+) Fruchild ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: 5 Dec 1998 02:09:12 GMT From: jacey7@aol.com (Jacey7) Subject: Re: To Herb or not to Herb? tehe=+) >Okay, I've been thinking about becoming a vegetarian for a while. < yah, me too. I've been completely off of red meat for over a year now (except for one unintentional "pea soup" incident. Can someone tell me why there is PIG in *pea* soup??? I think this is definitely a case of false advertising...) People are always asking me if I'm a vegetarian (or, more aptly-- "you're a vegetarian, right?") which I find really odd... But I have a feeling that I won't really make the plunge until I move out. My mother had enough of a cow (oh-- the puns abound!) when I cut 3 simple animals out of the diet, I know there is no way she would handle me ditching the whole dead carcass thing altogether... ~~jen (one more motivation to save all the money I would spend on buying CDs of bands praised on this group.. just think ::apartment:: ;-) *~~~"Measure your life in love"~~~* ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 02:34:24 GMT From: shazalinrea@juno.com (Mindy J Munson) Subject: RE: Nature Sounds of NGs On Fri, 4 Dec 1998 17:23:56 -0500 "KatieWow" writes: > >Mindy J Munson wrote in message ><19981204.163859.-3961137.4.SHAZALINREA@juno.com>... >>>Old Age: Cheese-n-rice, I *wish* I was older! If I were only 10 >years >>>older, I'd be 29, only scant years behind 3/4 of Fruvous. Do you >know >>>how much easier it would be to talk to them if I were closer to >their >>>ages? How something flirtatious could be considered halfway serious >>>instead of just cute teenage fan worship? You adults don't know how >>>easy you've got it. >> >> >>BINGO!!!!! >>I am SO with you on this one. In fact, I couldn't have said it >better >>myself >> > >i could not agree with you more. first i had to give up on doogie >howser, >then ed robertson, and now the früguys. bummer. >~~kate My first crush was when I was 4 and he was 17. I didn't give up hope then (until he moved away) and I refuse to now! Will you join in my crusade? Who will be strond and stand with me? Anyways victor, crush#1, loved me...just not in that way =+) Fruchild ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 05 Dec 1998 02:22:27 GMT From: shazalinrea@juno.com (Mindy J Munson) Subject: Re: wishing to be older On 5 Dec 1998 01:56:42 GMT jacey7@aol.com (Jacey7) writes: >kay, I have to comment on this thread: > >>>>Old Age: Cheese-n-rice, I *wish* I was older! If I were only 10 >years >older, I'd be 29<<< > >>>BINGO!!!!! I am SO with you on this one. In fact, I couldn't have >said it >better >myself<< > >>i could not agree with you more.< > >I used to say stuff like that all the time-- everything from "I wish >it were >Friday!" to "I wish the school year were over and it was warmer," to >the old >standard "I wish I was old enough to drive" "I wish I was old enough >to drink" >and on and on and on... (I'm old enough for both now, btw ;-) > >I was in the middle of one of those frustrated "I wish"s one day, when >my mom >just turned, looked at me and said: > >Don't wish your life away. > >I've always carried that with me. I don't "wish this week were just >over" or >that "Christmas would just hurry up and get here" or any of that >anymore. > >Because you only get one life, and I refuse to wish mine away. > >Just a little mental food for ya. > >~jen (who will now return to her regularly-scheduled sarcastic nature >;-) > > >*~~~"Measure your life in love"~~~* I understand completely what you are saying, but I am not normally like that. This is a special case =+). The thing that really bothers me about being my age is that I have a bro 12 years older than me, a sis 10 older, and another bro 2 older. I've always spent time with them and I usually am not stimulated by the conversations and trite conflicts of my peers. I've always had a better time with my teachers! (embarrassing?) Thats all the grief Ill give ya. A 30 yr old in a (gasp) teenage body. Fruchild ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: 05 Dec 1998 02:58:44 GMT From: lesystemed@aol.com (LeSystemeD) Subject: Re: To Herb or not to Herb? tehe=+) In article <19981204.181940.-3961137.10.SHAZALINREA@juno.com>, shazalinrea@juno.com wrote: > thought it might as well not >contain my furry friends. Besides there are so many substitutes (ie. >these interesting sounding Tofu Turkey thingies). Look for Morningstar Farms brand of synthetic meat-like things. Their meatless breakfast sausages are a staple in my house. They make several kinds of "burgers" too, that are quite good. The key to making vegan food palatable is lots of aromatic herbs and spices. Regards, Steve "I am not an actress, and I don't work for Morningstar Farms" ------------------------------ Date: 05 Dec 1998 02:59:06 GMT From: lesystemed@aol.com (LeSystemeD) Subject: Re: [Re: Herbivore or Carnivore?] In article <19981204221051.14801.qmail@www0p.netaddress.usa.net>, Angie wrote: >I am 100% Carnivore... Thick juicy dripping red rare steak with sauteed >'shrooms and onions... > >Actually, in true human form: i'm Omnivore... I like food. Good food. > Fried >food, broiled, baked, sauteed, steamed, food! > I was like that until my cardiologist told me that my lopid wasn't really working and I'd need a fourth angioplasty (the first was during a heart attack, the second and third were planned) if I didn't become an almost exclusive vegetarian. In spite of this, I don't have any philosophical objection to eating meat. It just doesn't agree with my arteries. Not everyone has this problem. I just take it as if I'm allergic to meat just like someone else might be allergic to peanut butter. I grew up on one of the greasiest cuisines I know of, Hungarian. My grandmother (and later, I) used to fry up a mess of bacon and then instead of discarding the excess fat, deep-fry bread in it. There's almost nothing better. Except that it might kill me. Who was it, the mother in The Glass Menagerie, who said, "Life is a casting off"? Well I guess I cast that off. Do watch out for your cholesterol level if you're eating like that. If it's acceptably low, then have a ball. Don't imagine you're too young to worry about it. I had my heart attack (and it was not a minor one, could of killed me if I had been asleep or hadn't recognized it) at 41. Regards, Steve ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 21:56:51 -0500 From: Chad Schrock Subject: Re: Herbivore or Carnivore? Princess of Monaco wrote: > On Fri, 4 Dec 1998, Thomas Fazzio wrote: > > Eve Lauria wrote: > > > > > Speaking of vegitarians...lunchroom poll time! Who out > > > there is a vegetarian? sort-of, I guess. I don't eat meat, but I don't really consider myself a vegetarian. IT'S THAT WHOLE LABEL THING!!!! :) > > > Anyone vegan? I don't have that kind of will power. > i'm kinda a vegetarian..it all started at NoHo, i just..up > and stopped eating meat. I cut out red meat and discovered that I felt better. Later on, I cut out chicken and turkey. (I never ate seafood, not even crabs. Get another Annapolitian to say that! ha!) > havent had a bite since. and i'm happy that way. i feel fine > :) ..my family, the kielbasa-consuming-like-there's-no-tomorrow > people that they are, think i'm a basketcase :) Mine just roll their eyes. See my earlier post about about living on a different planet from my parents and the orbits are getting farther and farther apart. > now i dont know *crap* about farming, isn't that when you pick through vegetables at Giant?[1] Me? A city-boy? How did you guess? :) [1] - Big supermarket chain in Balt/Wash. Known as "Super G" in DE, PA, and NJ. > > Now that I have shoved my foot in my mouth and opened myself > > to retaliation... flame on! > great, now you're a carnivore *and* a cannibal. you sicko! ;) No, that's me. When it comes to pumpkins, rutabegas, and squash-like things. :) - -- chad at radix dot net I pay attention. I only pretend to care. --me ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 22:16:23 -0500 From: Thomas Fazzio Subject: Re: Nature Sounds of NGs Mindy J Munson wrote: > Will you join in my crusade? Who will be strond and stand with me? Beyond the baracade is there a world you long to see? --Sorry, couldn't help it, I've been listening to my Les Mis tape ALL day... later, tom. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 22:30:22 -0500 From: Nate DeRose Subject: Re: Herbivore or Carnivore? Thomas Fazzio wrote: > I'm going against the grain to say: I like meat. I eat meat. I have to agree with Tom here.... :) I'm a big meat eater. I actually tried to be a vegetarian for a little while........... since my girlfriend was.... (actually, all my girlfriends have been vegetarians........ although I was able to get the last one to start eating meat again.....) So, I tried it for a while..... but I felt soooo unhealthy and I tended to eat alot more.......... I just never felt like I'd actually eaten anything more than a snack.... just felt weak and kinda icky most of the time.... gave up and went back to meat. Felt much better. I mean, everyone is different..... it works for some poeople.... and it just doesn't work for others. I was one of the people who just couldn't do it....... Besides, I love meat too much! :) I'm one of those people who's more likely to have a second helping of meat than dessert...... or leftover steak for breakfast, rather than toast and eggs. hehehhe Just had to chime in. Cheers, nate ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 22:18:07 -0500 From: Chad Schrock Subject: Re: Herbivore or Carnivore? Eve Lauria wrote: > be killed for veal. 2) Humans are the only animals that drink > milk past infancy and drink milk of another species...many > people feel this is not natural. Well, that's because it isn't. :) Actually, the human digestive system isn't really set up to digest milk beyond about the age of 13 or so. > 3) Milk is specially formulated to be the perfect food for baby > calves (or goats or sheep or whatever) and as such is not > necessarily compatible with the human system. As with the other mammals, human milk is great for humans. Cow milk is good for calves. etc... > Really, if we feed our children milk, we should be eating the > same food adult cows eat. 4) Most people are lactose intolerant > to some degree and I hear that simply going off dairy can > alleviate many health problems including digestive troubles and > asthma. See above. Actually, I have found that soy milk is a pretty good alternative. I had to try a couple of differnt brands to find one that I liked. You get milk with out all of the bad parts of milk, such as the lactose and other complex protiens that are in moo-milk. > 5) Cows are fed hay and grains which are full of chemicals, > which they excrete into their milk. Wow...I think I'm going > to go vegan again! Aw, c'mon. A little toxic waste is good for you! :) - -- chad at radix dot net I hear you all asking... When is he going to post something about Früvous? I dunno. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 4 Dec 1998 22:35:06 -0500 From: "Scott Hand" Subject: Re: Distribution of wealth in US I looked it up. 10% of the population holds (at most) 92.3% of the monies. That's if you pick the right ten percent. I f you pick the wrong ten percent, they only hold .000014% of the wealth. So pick your financial advisors well! Scott with two exams down and five more to go, I can sleep this weekend! MOLLIE M DRISCOLL wrote in message <01be1fdb$750c6cc0$LocalHost@labbox1>... >>Bodaceah wrote: >> >>> >>> Here in the United States 10% 0f the population holds 90% of the wealth. >> >>It's that steep? I'd believe the figure if it's worldwide, or within >>the states if it were more like 20% holding 80%; where do these figures >>come from? >> >>Josh Drury >>Winnipeg > >That's the figure I've heard, from multiple sources, some being >sociology professors. (And from what I read, it's getting steeper.) > >Mollie > ------------------------------ End of alt.music.moxy-fruvous digest V2 #85 *******************************************