From: owner-alloy-digest@smoe.org (alloy-digest) To: alloy-digest@smoe.org Subject: alloy-digest V2 #262 Reply-To: alloy@smoe.org Sender: owner-alloy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-alloy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "alloy-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. alloy-digest Sunday, November 23 1997 Volume 02 : Number 262 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Re: Alloy: Fear in the "White" City. [DThurkirk@aol.com] Re: re: Alloy: Admin. Enough! [crackers@hwcn.org] Re: Alloy: Fear in the "White" City. [crackers@hwcn.org] Re: Alloy: Fear in the "White" City. [crackers@hwcn.org] Re: Alloy: I almost forgot... race vs culture [crackers@hwcn.org] Alloy: Fear in the "White City" ["Stephen M. Tilson" ] Re: Alloy: Sherbert Fountain? [RThurF@aol.com] Re: Alloy: Sorry, should clarify. [RThurF@aol.com] Re: Re: Alloy: OOh, kind words....... [RThurF@aol.com] Re: Alloy: One more parody!! [RThurF@aol.com] Re: Re: Alloy: Catching Up... [RThurF@aol.com] Re: Re: Alloy: To the TMDR Collectors... [RThurF@aol.com] Re: Alloy: One more parody!! [Eclipse ] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 01:55:57 -0500 (EST) From: DThurkirk@aol.com Subject: Re: Alloy: Fear in the "White" City. In a message dated 11/21/97 12:08:08 PM, you wrote: <> I once heard David Bowie say that it isn't easy to live in a free democracy. Would the world be better if there were no nazi skinheads? Well I wouldn't miss them. As for showing zero tolerance the way they do in Germany...well Germany has been known to ignore the rights of people it doesn't approve of. (France too but they're another story). It's tough here. You see if you pick out any group, even a really rotten one, and deside that they get less tolerance than another group, then you've blown everything that America keeps trying to be. It's easy to say that it'd be nice if we had no Nazi's living in the USA and that skinhead groups should be outlawed or something along those lines.. But then that opens the door to say you don't want communists, then socialists, then muslims, then gays, and pretty soon it'll be me that everyone wants to get rid of. (then again they may start with me with my luck) So we have to stick with waiting until someone actually breaks a law before we go after them. It's a sad thing that our country (meaning everyone who lives here, not merely the government) still raises some children to be ignorant, bigoted, savages, but it would be a far greater wrong to persecute people for beliefs that we do not share before there has been a crime committed. As for those who do commit crimes (and that includes anything from harrasing people on the street to murder) then we should make certain they are dealt with as harshly as possible. This is where the zero tolerance comes in and can work in our society. There should be no tolerence for criminal behavior from anyone regardless of their political (or other) affiliation. See ya later. Sorry for the sudden depth of conversation and the nondolbyishness of it all. But sometimes ya just gotta have yer say. - --Dave ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 04:16:39 -0500 (EST) From: crackers@hwcn.org Subject: Re: re: Alloy: Admin. Enough! In article <971121073135_-555779855@mrin54.mail.aol.com>, you wrote: >I can't tell you how much fun it's been to actually view many Alloy people's >snapshots on Paul's page. I think this must have led to a greater feeling of >familiarity amongst us. The random flirtation which resulted immediately >afterward should be taken as nothing more than pure silliness - though I >sincerely apologize to those whose time it wasted. ~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~ I too beg forgiveness if I have violated any humour rules. Doumo sumimasendeshita. CRACKERS (Hanging my head in shame from hell!!!) - -- Accordionist - Wethifl Musician - Atari 2600 Collector | /\/\ *NEW CrAB URL* http://www.hwcn.org/~ad329/crab.html ***| \^^/ Bira Bira Devotee - FES Member - Samurai Pizza Cats Fan| =\/= ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 04:16:46 -0500 (EST) From: crackers@hwcn.org Subject: Re: Alloy: Fear in the "White" City. In article <9711220035.AA17386@acs5.acs.ucalgary.ca>, you wrote: >By the word Skinhead, I assume you mean racist skinhead. Up here >in Canada, we have all sorts, with balness not necessarily meaning >racist. ~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~ Well in Ontario, at least, the term "Skinhead" isn't really used to denote mear baldness but to convey that the person is a neo-nazi. This is probably because in the mid 80s Toronto had a big problem with neo-nazi Skinhead gangs (particularily in the College/Yonge area). Infact until the police started to take the problem seriously, "Swarmings" (when a group of Skinheads pick a victim, swarm around the victim and seriously assault them) were almost a daily occurance happening both at night and in broad daylight. I remember when I worked in the Toronto Eaton Centre. One day I was heading back from the foodcourt with my lunch when I heard a scream and a dull thud. I spun around and saw a crowd gathered by the waterfountain. A gang of Skinheads had just thrown a young man from the top floor (fortunately the man survived with only a few broken bones and a punctured lung). Why did they throw him over the railing? Well he was wearing a pink shirt so they assumed he was gay. Of course they still have Skinheads in Toronto, but the problems arn't nearly as bad now. CRACKERS (As opposed to the Skinflint problem from hell!) - -- Accordionist - Wethifl Musician - Atari 2600 Collector | /\/\ *NEW CrAB URL* http://www.hwcn.org/~ad329/crab.html ***| \^^/ Bira Bira Devotee - FES Member - Samurai Pizza Cats Fan| =\/= ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 04:16:44 -0500 (EST) From: crackers@hwcn.org Subject: Re: Alloy: Fear in the "White" City. In article <19971120.212737.3638.3.dalexander@juno.com>, you wrote: >I think that they should do like the German government did recently; >absolutely no tolerance. ~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~ In Canada we have a number of hate crime laws too that are designed to slow down Nazi propaganda. Speaking of Germany, I was reading not long ago how the TV show "Hogan's Heros" is a big hit in Germany (go figure). But since the "Hail Hitler" salute is illegal in Germany, they have the actors saying "Hail Schnitzel". Last year I had a friend who was an exchange student from Germany. I was talking to her before she went back home this summer and I asked her what she'll miss the most about Canada and she said, "The bagels". "What!? You don't have bagels in Germany?" I said envisioning the horrors of a world without bagels. She gave me a funny smile and said, "What do you think." "Aaahh, yeah. I get it now, World War ][. I guess that would explain the absence of bagels in Germany." Yet another reason to be thankful I didn't grow up in a country that was once a nazi regime. If nothing else bagels should make it absolutely clear to anyone that Hitler was a total nutcase. ~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~ >And it doesn't matter what color you are. The woman who tried to help >the African immigrant at the bus station was white. ~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~ That's the thing with Hate Mongering. Once you get yourself buried in it, you'll find you can pretty much hate anyone. So let's suppose the nazi revolution is a success and they eliminate all the non-whites from their country. Who do you think they'll turn on next. They'll just keep whittling away at the population eliminating everyone who doesn't live up to their ideal standards. Eventually there'll just be one nutcase left surrounded by a hell of a lot of dead bodies wondering where the hell his utopian society went. And the thing is, education should be able to fix this problem. Ignorance breeds fear, and fear breeds hate. Remove the ignorance and you stop the problem at the source. CRACKERS (Breaking the race myth from hell!!) - -- Accordionist - Wethifl Musician - Atari 2600 Collector | /\/\ *NEW CrAB URL* http://www.hwcn.org/~ad329/crab.html ***| \^^/ Bira Bira Devotee - FES Member - Samurai Pizza Cats Fan| =\/= ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 04:16:45 -0500 (EST) From: crackers@hwcn.org Subject: Re: Alloy: I almost forgot... race vs culture In article <19971120.212737.3638.2.dalexander@juno.com>, you wrote: >I am concerned about genetics, but in a good way. Bear with me here. >I'm blondish-red, blue eyes and freckles. I have to wear sunglasses or >suffer seriously and a day in the sun requires SPF 50. I do not tan. It >is my conclusion that I must marry someone with more 'color' or I would >be torchuring my children! ~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~ Being of irish-stock with reddish-brown hair, blue eyes, and a fair complexion, I can get a sunburn just looking at vacation photos. It's nice to know that my children won't have the same problems. Remember folk, 10 out of 10 anthropologist will tell you, "A diverse gene-pool is a healthy gene-pool." CRACKERS (Hetrozygous and proud from hell!!!) - -- Accordionist - Wethifl Musician - Atari 2600 Collector | /\/\ *NEW CrAB URL* http://www.hwcn.org/~ad329/crab.html ***| \^^/ Bira Bira Devotee - FES Member - Samurai Pizza Cats Fan| =\/= ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 04:56:06 -0500 From: "Stephen M. Tilson" Subject: Alloy: Fear in the "White City" Dave, That was very eloquently put. I dare say we could do with a little more = input from you around here. Stephen ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Nov 97 00:28:16 +1000 From: Paul Baily Subject: Alloy: Sorry, should clarify. Hi y'all, My apologies, I should clarify a bit. 1. By 'enough of the joke posts' all I meant was that I think we could do without the purely unrelated joke posts e.g. 'did you hear the one about when Little Johnnie went to school and told the teacher...' I didn't mean anything like the legendary Mary & Robin thread! 2. By 'grow up!' I meant that while you're more than welcome to speak your mind here, if you want a soapbox, go to the laundry detergent section of your local supermarket. We could do without the aggravation no matter how just you feel in putting your point across or having the last word. If, as listowner, I ask you to drop a thread or take it offline, please do so. I won't ask a second time. 3. Following on from 2, please keep in mind that every message you post gets sent to some 90 other people. If you're talking to one person in particular, maybe think about whether it's /really/ relevant/useful to the rest of the list or whether you could speak easier in direct email to the person concerned: remember, this isn't a newsgroup, it's a plain ol' email list where everyone gets to read what you post: this is Alloy. Let's make it good, eh? cheers, Paul. [who promises to write a non-admin non-datanazi message any day now...] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 11:37:28 -0500 (EST) From: RThurF@aol.com Subject: Re: Alloy: Sherbert Fountain? In a message dated 11/21/97 11:20:09 AM, Neil wrote: <<.... and who was it who wanted an aid parcel of Sherbert Fountains? >> ME !! it was me!! Oh, can it really be true, that Sherbet Fountains still exist in England? Lem had previously written to me about them... he is visiting NYC this very weekend, and had been thinking of buying some & sending them from New York when he got in. Alas, he hadn't found any before his flight time (it's all very exciting really!) He promised to keep looking when he returned home, but didn't feel hopeful that Barratt's were still making them. And now Dave has acquired a taste for them as well from when we used to get them from Cardullo's - double addiction!! Neil, I'll gratefully accept all the Sherbet Fountains you've got. Just let me know what you'd like in return. I'd be happy to pay postage, or I can send something else to trade with you for the Fountains. My best mailing address is via work: Robin Thurlow c/o Johnson String Instrument 11 John Street Newton Centre, MA 02159 USA THANK YOU NEIL!! Robin :) And PS Lem! - Neil's offer probably comes as a great relief to you, though indeed it seems I can never have too much of the stuff for myself & to supply my friends with. Now even my sister wants to try them! If you should find some in the future & you're still feeling kindly disposed, I beg you to send them along & we'll finish working out our trade. Hope NYC was good to you! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 12:03:00 -0500 (EST) From: RThurF@aol.com Subject: Re: Alloy: Sorry, should clarify. In a message dated 11/22/97 10:31:24 AM, Paul wrote: <> I'm so happy it wasn't our thread which caused an upset. I was beginning to think I'd better apply for my NEA grant now. Robin ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 12:26:59 -0500 (EST) From: RThurF@aol.com Subject: Re: Re: Alloy: OOh, kind words....... <<> Well, I still listen to your 'ZAL'. But if you ever make another > album, please! Send it my way! I would even be willing to pay for it. > Very top notch stuff. Same here...I love that tape! >> Me too copse! tell your band to get busy! Robin ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 22:36:55 -0500 (EST) From: RThurF@aol.com Subject: Re: Alloy: One more parody!! E(lipse, your "Painted" was SOOooo incredibly fantastically cool! Your lyrics are now saved to my personal file for permanent safekeeping until I can print them out & hang them up on my wall. I've NEVER been mentioned in a song before - or even a parody of one. The honor! Am I worthy? xxxx Robin the humble ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 22:23:48 -0500 (EST) From: RThurF@aol.com Subject: Re: Re: Alloy: Catching Up... In a message dated 11/19/97 2:21:03 PM, Neil wrote: <<>a little while back, while watching the Hot Sauce video, my then 8 >years old son said "That's not very nice, is it Daddy? Her sitting on that >man's face like that!" Cue one mouthful of juice sprayed everywhere... >aahh, the innocence of youth. >>> HAH! Now you're not the only one who's lost their fruitjuice over that comment (well, herbal tea in my case)! It'll give me something else to think about besides sports whenever that part of the video comes on. Robin ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 22:52:42 -0500 (EST) From: RThurF@aol.com Subject: Re: Re: Alloy: To the TMDR Collectors... In a message dated 11/20/97 6:43:25 AM, Brian wrote: <> Keep information like this coming, please! Yet another thing I didn't know, which I am so happy to know now - because I love Lene (now I have to go & watch the video again. All I can picture is the blond wig & the necklace she was wearing, which I want) Robin ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 00:02:56 -0800 From: Eclipse Subject: Re: Alloy: One more parody!! > E(lipse, your "Painted" was SOOooo incredibly fantastically cool! Your lyrics > are now saved to my personal file for permanent safekeeping until I can print > them out & hang them up on my wall. I've NEVER been mentioned in a song > before - or even a parody of one. The honor! Am I worthy? > > xxxx > Robin the humble Awwwww.... I am most touched by your kind words. It is I who am unworthy to attempt to do justice to such wonderous inspiration as yourself, and Europa and the others as well. ;) Would that a decent photo of me were scanned in soon, that I might join you all in your play beside Crackers' window. ;) -- E(lipse "Oh to paint her eyes so red, and her lips so blue...." ------------------------------ End of alloy-digest V2 #262 ***************************