From: owner-alloy-digest@smoe.org (alloy-digest) To: alloy-digest@smoe.org Subject: alloy-digest V3 #268 Reply-To: alloy@smoe.org Sender: owner-alloy-digest@smoe.org Errors-To: owner-alloy-digest@smoe.org Precedence: bulk X-To-Unsubscribe: Send mail to "alloy-digest-request@smoe.org" X-To-Unsubscribe: with "unsubscribe" as the body. alloy-digest Friday, October 9 1998 Volume 03 : Number 268 Today's Subjects: ----------------- Alloy: RE: Alloy,more stuff (Bowieishness) [John Schofield Subject: Alloy: RE: Alloy,more stuff (Bowieishness) Dave said... >If you don't have it already I encourage you (and everyone else) to buy a copy >of Earthling (Bowie's latest) right this minute I second that opinion. ps. good luck Paul - pity you aren't a bit closer. John (john@police.tas.gov.au) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1998 03:45:03 EDT From: CJMark@aol.com Subject: Re: Alloy: Wish me luck! Hey Beth... Congrats on the award.. !!! It sounded incredibly important.. and I'm certain it is. I just wish I had half the knowledge and a quarter the intelligence to understand what it is your presentation was about.. I guess that's why you get the big bucks! Perhaps its because its been a long day and I'm brain dead.. Slow minded.. but happy nonetheless.! Mark ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1998 07:47:37 EDT From: RThurF@aol.com Subject: Re: Alloy: correction! 80's tours (& workshops) Elaine wrote: << They *can* be a bit undignified. Wasn't there a really odd sounding tour recently... REO Speedwagon with something, and special guest some one-hit wonder from 1984? I forget now. I do recall that we affectionately referred to this tour as the Gaspy Wheezers Reunion.>> Then I wrote: <> (blah blah blah) but in re-reading this I see it came out awkwardly... by 'age' I mean the length of time it's been since these performers were creating music for the general public... ie the age of the musical act itself. This is how I understood Elaine's statement but my reply sounds like I'm mentioning physical age... which I wanted to clarify, because being young or old has nothing to do with creative vitality in my opinion. And on the topic of the '80's tours, and vitality... I heard an interview with Howard Jones when he was in town. I'm happy that he's still extremely energetic about his music. He talked at length about a sort of summer camp he'd been to for musicians which someone had organized, in which lots of people come together in a private setting to do music workshops together. You would be paired with another musician without knowing who it would be in advance & have to have a song written together by the end of the day, which you would both then perform for everyone else after dinner. Then the next day you'd do the whole thing all over again only with another randomly selected fellow musician. It all sounded like incredible fun & great creative exercise!! It made me happy that people were doing this! Robin T ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1998 09:54:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Elaine Linstruth Subject: Re: Alloy: RE: Alloy,more stuff (Bowieishness) Dave and John said... > >If you don't have it already I encourage you (and everyone else) to buy a copy > >of Earthling (Bowie's latest) right this minute > > I second that opinion. And I third-it. I couldn't resist once I heard "I'm Afraid of Americans." > ps. good luck Paul - pity you aren't a bit closer. And I second this too! Good luck Paul, be sure to tell us how it goes. We have confidence that you'll do smashingly. Elaine ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1998 14:24:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Elaine Linstruth Subject: Re: Alloy: correction! 80's tours (& workshops) Thank you Robin.. I, too, didn't specify and I meant the same thing you did. Getting older and creating new art is certainly great, but getting older and doing the stuff from when you were younger just to make money, is another matter. I saw Grace Slick interviewed once and she said something akin to, I'm pushin' 50 or 60 now and I'm not going to get on stage and sing White Rabbit anymore. She thought that was a bit ridiculous and I mostly agree. I think the tour Thomas originally alluded to was this year's Culture Club reunion. Who were they traveling with again? I don't know how I feel about them.. I was among the people who felt Boy George had a uniquely soulful voice, and Time (Clock of the Heart) is still one of my favorite songs from the 80's. I always thought it was just a really well-written song. What's the word for when a song's words and music fit the "mood" very well. ILYG is the same way. Anyway, but to see them get a tour together with the hook about being an 80'S REUNION! just seems like, "oh well 80's memorabilia is hot right now so let's capitalize." I think that's what Thomas meant. And that other tour I was trying to remember, also did the bandwagon thing, but I can't remember now, who it was. That musicians' camp you talked about does sound neat. I guess if you do that, and have a low confidence level, it would be stressful -- but it sounds like a good way to practice getting over your low confidence! I always did like Howard Jones also. I still put his CD's in from time to time.. don't really have to be in an 80's mood for it. - -- Elaine Linstruth Palmdale, CA (USA) On Thu, 8 Oct 1998 RThurF@aol.com wrote: > but in re-reading this I see it came out awkwardly... by 'age' I mean > the length of time it's been since these performers were creating music > for the general public... ie the age of the musical act itself. This is > how I understood Elaine's statement but my reply sounds like I'm > mentioning physical age... which I wanted to clarify, because being > young or old has nothing to do with creative vitality in my opinion. > > And on the topic of the '80's tours, and vitality... I heard an > interview with Howard Jones when he was in town. I'm happy that he's > still extremely energetic about his music. He talked at length about a > sort of summer camp he'd been to for musicians which someone had > organized, in which lots of people come together in a private setting to > do music workshops together. You would be paired with another musician > without knowing who it would be in advance & have to have a song written > together by the end of the day, which you would both then perform for > everyone else after dinner. Then the next day you'd do the whole thing > all over again only with another randomly selected fellow musician. It > all sounded like incredible fun & great creative exercise!! It made me > happy that people were doing this! > > Robin T ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1998 17:57:18 EDT From: RThurF@aol.com Subject: Re: Alloy: correction! 80's tours (& workshops) In a message dated 10/8/98 5:28:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time, elaine@qnet.com writes: << I was among the people who felt Boy George had a uniquely soulful voice, and Time (Clock of the Heart) is still one of my favorite songs from the 80's.>> Yes, me too! I still think it's a really good song. I saw part of a "Behind the Scenes" which featured Culture Club, talking about the supposed secrecy surrounding George's romantic affiliation at the time with the band's drummer. It's silly for them to think it was ever a secret though... even as a totally inexperienced & unworldly teenage girl, I thought it was plain as day that "Time" was written for George's boyfriend Jon (and it didn't phase me even slightly... though the dead guy in George's living room a few years later DID) I thought it was very sweet. I'd be pleased if someone wrote such a nice song for me, pleading for my attentions! Robin T ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1998 19:36:28 EDT From: RThurF@aol.com Subject: Alloy: Autobiographical work In a message dated 10/7/98 1:23:32 AM Eastern Daylight Time, elaine@qnet.com writes: << Next, is I saw a career-retrospective type thing about David Bowie, and at the end he said something akin to, some fans want to have the artist doing autobiographical works, but that is NOT ME. That got me thinking, I've always approached Thomas' songs as being somewhat autobiographical. But are they? >> I tried to give my opinion on this late last night in a different reply I posted, with no success - it's really hard for me to put things into words. The question of whether an artist's work is autobiographical or not has been in my mind all day though! And a couple of things have occured to me. First of all, I think the emotions or ideas an artist communicates may be autobiographical in nature, but that he may use a non-autobiographical story to relate them to his audience. What I mean by this is, though the exact details of the song lyrics (for instance) may not have happened precisely as stated, or even at all, something did happen in the person's life to inspire him to write that particular piece. As far as I'm aware, artists try to communicate a given idea in its very essence (which is why saying "this is a song about thus&such" may seem like overstating the point) & the piece should stand on its own. The audience is being offered an invitation into a person's creative life whenever they hear a well-written song, or see a good painting or any other work, which I think is a much more intense and intimate experience than knowing what specifically inspired someone to do a piece. Not that there's any harm in wondering of course... right now I'm wondering about Rasputina's "The New Zero", a beautiful, slightly scary, fairy-tale of a song. And their "Watch TV" reminds me of a sort of flipside to Thomas' "Commercial Breakup'... about the recluse whose television shows have become her whole world. Anyway enough about the Ladies & their brilliant new cd ;) As I was saying.. David Bowie seemed to be talking about the line which is drawn between the 'show' and the mind behind (or I should say within) the show. Again, Thomas himself seems to describe this very thing in his brilliant film "Live Wireless". The name of the film, when you think it through, is a juxtaposition in opposing terms... 'livewire' and 'wireless' overlapping, which indicates a combination of both intense connection and detachment. Thomas is the star of the film as stage performer, yet is also frequently shown in the isolated, utilitarian projectionist's booth working the machinery that's running it. Most of the time, the projectionist is lost in his own thoughts in his room that's lined with pictures, or gazing out dreamily at the audience & the show, and is moved to bursts of efficient activity & involvement whenever the show needs to be bumped into action. The audience are like automatons, giving the feeling of 'everybody's doing their part' in the performance - musicians playing, and audience listening/applauding at prescribed intervals. Only when the projectionist messes up do they seem to notice him at all! But throughout all this, the projectionist keeps taking Polaroids of the performance, as something he's drawing from as well as creating. He carefully labels each photograph at the end and looks on them as if they're precious things. The subtleties of this film fascinate me, even the way the projectionist smokes the cigarette in the beginning of the film, it makes him seem so aloof, not even the cigarette seems to be making any contact with him. It's really very well done. As you can tell I think this film is quite intense! Robin T ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1998 20:38:43 EDT From: CJMark@aol.com Subject: Re: Alloy: Autobiographical work Robin.. I've never seen the "Live Wireless" Film... Or any other TMDR film I'm ashamed to admit here.. but what the heck.. I did see him live in Vancouver, BC.. at least. But anyhow.. my point is.. do you know where I might be able to find a copy of "Live Wireless" ? I would really enjoy seeing some of that show.. as I think that is the show I saw live.. but it was so long ago.. that I remember far too little of it. Any ideas.. anyone? Ciao for now.. Mark ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Oct 1998 22:26:07 EDT From: JARUTLAND@aol.com Subject: Alloy: Dream State Robin - there are professionals out there who do nothing with their time except analyze dreams and their meanings. I work with someone who has some rather bizarre dreams on a fairly regular basis. She always shares them with us at lunch when they involve the people she works with. As for me, I can't remember the last time I had a dream. I know the human mind is working at a pretty good clip during the rem mode but I can't remember waking up and thinking, "Wow, I just had a dream about so 'n so." Keep us informed about this. This could be really interesting. Andy JARUTLAND@aol.com ------------------------------ End of alloy-digest V3 #268 ***************************